Bought the MPSS last week slightly before our PS2's were completely worn out. I wanted to test them at Streets of Willow in the semi-annual DE day run by the Grand Prix region of PCA. I'll talk about the methods of tire-setup elsewhere and stick to tire information here. We arrived at pit pressures that produced excellent handling, never mind how, so let's get to the tires. The results.

The Michelin Pilot Super Sport has been on the car for a week now and I'm very pleased with the road performance and comfort. Turn off the radio, set the cruise control, and rolling along a freeway with rough pavement, the tires are the loudest noise of course. (Well, not of course, but if you don't have a modified exhaust that will be the case.) But the noise is low and quite tolerable and nearly the only artifact of the roughness. The ride comfort is excellent. In the other direction, I ran a section of Highway 138 that I knew was recently paved to see how much intrinsic noise came from these tires. It was almost eerie. The sound level dropped so low my first thought was "like a damn Lexus", but on consideration it really was not. More like the sensation of harnessed power you get with an idling jet aircraft. This is hard to describe, but I could feel the tread gripping that smooth surface and hear the ultra-low sound level increase slightly every time I moved the steering wheel. In the middle of all that imminent silence, a chipmunk ran in front of me. Then, as they so often do, he noticed me coming and turned around to run right back. I started left and then had to dart back to the right when he reversed course. Steering response is immediate, crisp, and precise. Not at all Lexus-like. Just spooky quiet tires until they have something to talk about.

We don't have the problem of expansion strips that plagues other areas, but with CalTrans's budget so stressed right now we have plenty of roughness to explore. On a two-lane road a new pothole appeared just as someone was in the oncoming lane. I couldn't avoid it. Running over such things isn't my favorite way to treat tires, but the MPSS soaked up the blow. Comfortable, even if disquieting in terms of long term consequences if you do such things regularly. I also deliberately ran along that California invention we call Bott's Dots, the reflective lane-separator buttons. They are intentionally jarring in a stiff car because a highway engineer named Bott wanted something that would catch the attention of complacent drivers in softly suspended sedans and SUV's. He succeeded so well that I normally drive them like an autocross when changing lanes, aiming between the dots to reduce the annoyance. When I drove along them intentionally with these new tires, I could hear them with the window down, but the sensation at the steering wheel was one of awareness without annoyance. You can tell you've run over one, but it isn't a harsh bump.

Very impressive tires for comfort, probably a result of that new belt material with a name that only a Frenchman would conceive: Sauron or Laurel or something like that. Road handling is excellent as well, but since I'm about to talk about track performance we'll leave it at 'excellent'. All this was last week at the default pressure I chose: 34/37, which we've learned is the new pressure spec in the supplemental GTS owner's manual.

At the track, we spent the morning making preliminary adjustments. Over lunch, the club broke from DE sessions to hold one of their season's autocrosses. And I ran of course. (Purely in the spirit of scientific inquiry you understand.) These are 3/4 lap events so the measured time doesn't mean much, but the result relative to other cars is useful information.

At the last event, with PS2 tires mounted, I matched the time of my instructor. He has a 1974 Targa so in horsepower terms that wasn't terribly impressive. On the other hand, he is a very good driver running race rubber, so what he lost on the straights he made up on the twisty bits. This time, with only preliminary pressure measurements complete, and one quick "take your life in your hands" adjustment, I went out on the timed run cold. I ran four seconds faster than him. Since that last event, I've learned some racer techniques for getting more out of a 997.2, but I'd have to give credit for at least half that lap time differential to the Michelin Pilot Super Sports. And a set with incorrect pressures to boot. Good news for the compound they chose.

Next, we consider the 'instructor' for this event. He was running an 'old' second-gen GT3, not the current one, but still. He runs Michelin Pilot Sport Cups. Beat him by two seconds. To his side, he had a slight off at "The Waterfall" on what would have been his best lap. So he could have done better. (Couldn't we all? ) Still, that cost him a couple of seconds at least. Maybe five or more. On the MPSS side, those tires still weren't set up correctly. Later that afternoon, the car was turning laps at least four seconds faster, though I can't be more specific because the local DE rules prohibit in-car timing. The MPSS is not a match for the Cup tires in track work. We can't jump to that conclusion at all. But with two competent drivers, one in a 996 GT3 and the other a 997.2 S, I'd say the cars were level-pegging in that timed event. Is an old man from Formula Ford better than a Norschleife veteran and Nurburgring endurance racer? I seriously doubt it. Is the current C2S a match for last generation's GT3? Boy. Ask that in the right forum and the debate will be raging past midnight.

I would say this: the MPSS is close enough to the Cup tires that a good lap for a C2S will bridge that gap to a poor lap for a GT3 on Cups. That's saying a lot more than it sounds like. Cups are damned fine tires and the GT3 is a formidable track car in any generation.

Finally, the chief instructor declared an open session before the track closed. At least half an hour of lapping was promised, with all remaining cars on track from all run groups. There was no question this car being fastest in the fastest novice group of the earlier sessions. (Besides simple observation, we won first in class in that autocross.) But since most of those drivers were true novices, that tells us little about the tires beyond "they didn't let me down." What was worth learning is how it would run against the rest of the field. Cars driven by experienced drivers and previously separated from us in the Red and Yellow run groups. Besides a bunch of Carreras, we had race-prepared BMW's, half a dozen GT3's, a couple of 996 Turbos, a few 914's prepared every which way (as all of them are these days). I never figured out how many of those cars hit the track at the same time I did (as I'll explain in a minute) but we had a pretty full track. Maybe fifteen cars per mile, maybe a little more. That was the jury convened to pronounce racer's judgment on the Michelin Pilot Super Sport.

The tires were set up by then. We had pyrometered within an inch of their lives, and tweaked the pit pressures until the tread temps were right where we wanted them. I have to say the current Carrera is a delight to drive when set up like that and running the MPSS. John Deere need not apply. The car is responsive in slow corners (like two and three at the Streets) where you turn in with the steering but control direction with the throttle. Yet it is controllable and stable in the sequence that begins with "The Waterfall." For those not familiar with the Streets, you come out of a moderately banked turn at the north end of the track, accelerate about two tenths of a mile to a combined vertical and horizontal kink. The road drops away at the same time it sidesteps. You must move right abruptly, while using that as the entry to a high-speed downhill left curve that ends with a sharp almost-off-camber left turn taken at perhaps forty. A good test of car and tires.

In the morning, I couldn't get a good launch off the banking, just as with the PS2's at the last event. The car would plow through the turn leaving me still in high-rpm second as the track straightened. I would reach "the kink" just as I neared redline in third, leaving the sad choice of shifting just as the car was dancing over the abyss or backing off early. In the afternoon, I got into third before exiting the banking, during the early track-out phase. That gave me enough time to reach fourth gear well short of the kink. I was going over the top in fourth holding speed through that first twitch sideways. Then diving to the apex of the downhill curve, braking heavily from there, and rolling into the tight left hand corner. With that launch off the banking, the car was picking up 200 yards on every car we ran down, just from the entry to the banked section to the end. Add that to time gained in the esses and the result was formidable. Time after time, a car at the end of the front straight when I entered the straight would be caught by the exit of the waterfall. That let me hang in the driver's mirror and get a point-by on the straight. Picking up a quarter mile per lap on a short track is impressive.

That happened with car after car, including several that posted better times in the autocross at lunch. We lapped the mundane but well-driven Carreras, and caught the raucous heavily-modded BMW that started the session half a lap ahead. All in all, I was having a great time despite the distraction of the "Low Pressure!" warning that kept coming up, until I noticed it alternating with a fuel warning. Oops. Turns out a C2S kept between 5000 and 7000 rpm for lap after lap gets pretty greedy about fuel. Afterward, the on-board computer confessed to our getting only 9 mpg and swallowing half a tankful in those test sessions. At the moment, all it would assert is that my remaining range was - - -.- - miles. Sigh. I tiptoed to the pit, picked up my trophy and the new helmet they gave me, and slunk to a gas station.

I would assess that last session like this, for lack of specific lap times: With MPSS mounted, the C2S is running level with anything in its class (Q if you know PCA classes), no matter who is driving or what tires they wear, and it is passing most of them. The only cars giving us a run were in the next class up, which is where the current turbos and the GT2 and GT3 hang out and sneer at the rest of us.

Conclusion. With the pressures set correctly, the Michelin Pilot Super Sport is producing some bloody high grip levels. Turn-in is precise and controllability is excellent. And my, don't they just talk about it when cornering at those levels? Howl, baby, howl. Lap after lap. Well, until you run out of gas.

What psi was I running? Well, I refuse to answer without also explaining how we picked the right pressures for these tires on this car with this driver. Procedure is everything. You can get numbers from any railbird. See the other thread. I'll post it later tonight after I fix dinner for Cindy.

The tires themselves are great. Buy some while the price is right.

Gary

 

good write up! I've been running my PSSs for about 3k miles and they've been fantastic.

 

Great Post! I agree, the PSS tires are great. I only had a chance to test them out on local streets and 'round abouts', but they have far more grip than my old P Zero and none of the understeer. I think the P Zeros should not even be mounted on our cars... they were down right scarry. PSS are also quieter and softer than Pirelli.

 

great review, Ive been running them since they were released and could not agree more.

 

Simsgw

I've found the same, on my laps of Donnington here in the UK which is a circa 1:30 lap I was previously seeing a best time of 1:27 - 1:28.

I am now down to 1:24.3s, so nearly 4s improvement and like you I've improved my lines and techniques but the tyres are definetely gripping better than the PS2's did, so I'd comfortably say they are responsible for 1-2s improvement.

I've found mine seem to give best results with HOT pressures of circa 38-40psi hot in the rear and around 36-38psi hot in the front.

Be interesting to know what pressures you were using by the end of the day HOT as in checking them as soon as arriving into the pits where they are so hot they burn?

 

Gibbo, check the thread I just posted about how we set up the tires. I'm too tired to dig out my notes about hot pressures but memory says I got the same results as you did.

Off to bed here,

Gary

 

Same experience here coming from the PZeros. Been very happy with their performance on street and track (until recently I corded the edges, but that blame's on my setup, not the tires).

Gary -- thanks again for being a champ with the knowledge transfer. If you ever make it to the Big Apple, I'd love to buy you a beer.

 

Gary

Excellent write-up. I am ordering some in about a week. My last DE was the last gasp of the current PZeros.

 

I'll hold you to that! I haven't been in nearly thirty years, so you'll have to pick the source.

Gary

 

Outstanding writeup! Thanks for such concise feedback.

 

If you haven't tested your MPSS's in the rain. You are doing yourself an injustice. I think they grip better in wet weather than in dry. That's just my opinion though.

 

I did drive them in the rain just yesterday, and found them quite satisfactory, but I couldn't call it testing because my wife would justly resent taking on-ramps at .9 g.

Gary

 

i just bought some super sports from TR.. got them mounted and balanced.. took wheels works 3hrs but they got the job done.

bottom line is that the tires are an innovation, by touch they feel a lot softer than ps2's and appear to have some characteristics in terms of tread design to the mcups.

i haven't had a chance to push them hard yet, but i can immediately tell just from street driving that the ride comfort has improved. it could be because i was on nearly bald tires just before.. but i dont feel as many bumps as before in the front of my car.

i only replaced the fronts, i went with 235.40.18 as im in a awd turbo and want to keep the rpm's in check.

there a great tire! shame they dont come in my size for rears.. i plan to run ps2's in the rear in the future.

im running them at 34 psi.

Mike

 

Thanks for the write up, Im convinced that MPSS are my next set

 

I'm you're pusher. Give me a call.