Thinking of purchasing '75 911 2.7, thoughts?
#1
Thinking of purchasing '75 911 2.7, thoughts?
A friend of mine's father recently passed away. Left was a very extensive collection of (mostly american) cars. Among the 100 or so cars is a 1975 Porsche 911 Carrera. It was professionally judged to have a condition as follows:
9 - Paint
8 - Interior
9 - Body
7 - Chassis
7 - Engine
8 - Total
It is a brown/brown with a moon roof and 6-speed. Un-restored and in "good condition". I'm not too excited about the brown/brown, but I'm not opposed to repainting/upholstering.
I currently drive an Audi A4 daily, and have a mint example of a '94 Toyota Supra twin-turbo that has turned into a garage queen. I've started to ache lately for a fun car to drive very commonly in the summer that I won't cringe over parking it for more than 5 minutes. I would love an older porsche, and have been lurking here for some time gathering information on different models/years, etc... Now that my situation is clear, here is where I need help:
First of all, I've had a little trouble finding a good example set on price for these cars. I've seen from 5000-40,000 depending on many things. As far as I know this is a run-of-the-mill example of this particular car. That aspect is perfect. I don't want something special. I have that in the supra. I want something to drive. Now this is the (seemingly) very enticing part of the deal. I was offered this car for $6000. I almost feel like jumping on it and reselling if it turns out to not meet my expectations. But I won't go that route. What should I expect to pay for a car similar to this in another private sale?
And my biggest question is the lack of desirability in the 2.7L. I even saw it mentioned as the second worse Porsche ever made. That is troubling, but I can't find why. Would someone care to enlighten me? As I really do want this car to drive, reliability would be a must. I have a fair amount of mechanical knowledge with most cars. Porsches are still new to me, so I'm not sure how hard this will be to keep up by myself. Regardless, if it's going to be a constant headache, I don't care if I was the god of porsche techs I wouldn't want it. That being said, I don't mind regular maintenance and the occasional repair job.
I will most likely be going to see the car in the next couple weeks, and would like to have a good background on what I may or may not be getting myself into.
Thanks in advance for anyone/everyones' help.
-Sumner
9 - Paint
8 - Interior
9 - Body
7 - Chassis
7 - Engine
8 - Total
It is a brown/brown with a moon roof and 6-speed. Un-restored and in "good condition". I'm not too excited about the brown/brown, but I'm not opposed to repainting/upholstering.
I currently drive an Audi A4 daily, and have a mint example of a '94 Toyota Supra twin-turbo that has turned into a garage queen. I've started to ache lately for a fun car to drive very commonly in the summer that I won't cringe over parking it for more than 5 minutes. I would love an older porsche, and have been lurking here for some time gathering information on different models/years, etc... Now that my situation is clear, here is where I need help:
First of all, I've had a little trouble finding a good example set on price for these cars. I've seen from 5000-40,000 depending on many things. As far as I know this is a run-of-the-mill example of this particular car. That aspect is perfect. I don't want something special. I have that in the supra. I want something to drive. Now this is the (seemingly) very enticing part of the deal. I was offered this car for $6000. I almost feel like jumping on it and reselling if it turns out to not meet my expectations. But I won't go that route. What should I expect to pay for a car similar to this in another private sale?
And my biggest question is the lack of desirability in the 2.7L. I even saw it mentioned as the second worse Porsche ever made. That is troubling, but I can't find why. Would someone care to enlighten me? As I really do want this car to drive, reliability would be a must. I have a fair amount of mechanical knowledge with most cars. Porsches are still new to me, so I'm not sure how hard this will be to keep up by myself. Regardless, if it's going to be a constant headache, I don't care if I was the god of porsche techs I wouldn't want it. That being said, I don't mind regular maintenance and the occasional repair job.
I will most likely be going to see the car in the next couple weeks, and would like to have a good background on what I may or may not be getting myself into.
Thanks in advance for anyone/everyones' help.
-Sumner
#2
Hmmm...
A friend of mine's father recently passed away. Left was a very extensive collection of (mostly american) cars. Among the 100 or so cars is a 1975 Porsche 911 Carrera. It was professionally judged to have a condition as follows:
9 - Paint
8 - Interior
9 - Body
7 - Chassis
7 - Engine
8 - Total
It is a brown/brown with a moon roof and 6-speed. Un-restored and in "good condition". I'm not too excited about the brown/brown, but I'm not opposed to repainting/upholstering.
I currently drive an Audi A4 daily, and have a mint example of a '94 Toyota Supra twin-turbo that has turned into a garage queen. I've started to ache lately for a fun car to drive very commonly in the summer that I won't cringe over parking it for more than 5 minutes. I would love an older porsche, and have been lurking here for some time gathering information on different models/years, etc... Now that my situation is clear, here is where I need help:
First of all, I've had a little trouble finding a good example set on price for these cars. I've seen from 5000-40,000 depending on many things. As far as I know this is a run-of-the-mill example of this particular car. That aspect is perfect. I don't want something special. I have that in the supra. I want something to drive. Now this is the (seemingly) very enticing part of the deal. I was offered this car for $6000. I almost feel like jumping on it and reselling if it turns out to not meet my expectations. But I won't go that route. What should I expect to pay for a car similar to this in another private sale?
And my biggest question is the lack of desirability in the 2.7L. I even saw it mentioned as the second worse Porsche ever made. That is troubling, but I can't find why. Would someone care to enlighten me? As I really do want this car to drive, reliability would be a must. I have a fair amount of mechanical knowledge with most cars. Porsches are still new to me, so I'm not sure how hard this will be to keep up by myself. Regardless, if it's going to be a constant headache, I don't care if I was the god of porsche techs I wouldn't want it. That being said, I don't mind regular maintenance and the occasional repair job.
I will most likely be going to see the car in the next couple weeks, and would like to have a good background on what I may or may not be getting myself into.
Thanks in advance for anyone/everyones' help.
-Sumner
9 - Paint
8 - Interior
9 - Body
7 - Chassis
7 - Engine
8 - Total
It is a brown/brown with a moon roof and 6-speed. Un-restored and in "good condition". I'm not too excited about the brown/brown, but I'm not opposed to repainting/upholstering.
I currently drive an Audi A4 daily, and have a mint example of a '94 Toyota Supra twin-turbo that has turned into a garage queen. I've started to ache lately for a fun car to drive very commonly in the summer that I won't cringe over parking it for more than 5 minutes. I would love an older porsche, and have been lurking here for some time gathering information on different models/years, etc... Now that my situation is clear, here is where I need help:
First of all, I've had a little trouble finding a good example set on price for these cars. I've seen from 5000-40,000 depending on many things. As far as I know this is a run-of-the-mill example of this particular car. That aspect is perfect. I don't want something special. I have that in the supra. I want something to drive. Now this is the (seemingly) very enticing part of the deal. I was offered this car for $6000. I almost feel like jumping on it and reselling if it turns out to not meet my expectations. But I won't go that route. What should I expect to pay for a car similar to this in another private sale?
And my biggest question is the lack of desirability in the 2.7L. I even saw it mentioned as the second worse Porsche ever made. That is troubling, but I can't find why. Would someone care to enlighten me? As I really do want this car to drive, reliability would be a must. I have a fair amount of mechanical knowledge with most cars. Porsches are still new to me, so I'm not sure how hard this will be to keep up by myself. Regardless, if it's going to be a constant headache, I don't care if I was the god of porsche techs I wouldn't want it. That being said, I don't mind regular maintenance and the occasional repair job.
I will most likely be going to see the car in the next couple weeks, and would like to have a good background on what I may or may not be getting myself into.
Thanks in advance for anyone/everyones' help.
-Sumner
That would be very unique since there were only five speeds afaik.
Is it a custom job? A special euro model?
$6000 seems like a no-brainer to me in the condition you say it is in.
#3
That's what I am thinking. But you always get those red flags when a deal like this comes along, so I thought I'd ask.
#5
Anybody have any info on the ups/downs of the 911 2.7 for a common driver yet?
#6
found an answer to one of my questions on pelican parts:
"It's a tragic story. Porsche increased the displacement of the
2.4 without providing enough cooling and, to add insult to injury,
the US models had thermal reactors (except for 1974) that got
REALLY hot. The result is, among other things, head studs that
pulled out of the crank case (due to thermal expansion of the
cylinders) and destroyed valve trains. All of this resulted in an
average engine life of about 50,000 miles (your mileage may vary --
HA! I was *waiting* to use that line).
So the natural follow-on question (so natural, in fact, that I'm not
breaking it out into its own question) is "can anything be done to
mitigate the design flaws of the 2.7?" The answer is:
- Have the case helicoiled or timeserted. These threaded
inserts are installed in the crank case to hold the
cylinder studs tightly and keep them from pulling.
- Use Dilivar or Raceware studs. These studs won't pull
out because they expand with temperature at the same
rate as the cylendars.
- Replace the 5-blade fan with an 11-blade fan.
- Add an extra oil cooler."
Looks like an extra couple $k will be needed to ensure avoiding engine failure. Or perhaps some of these measures have already been taken. We'll see..
Anyone on here daily or commonly drive their '74-78? If so, some tricks/tips would be appreciated.
"It's a tragic story. Porsche increased the displacement of the
2.4 without providing enough cooling and, to add insult to injury,
the US models had thermal reactors (except for 1974) that got
REALLY hot. The result is, among other things, head studs that
pulled out of the crank case (due to thermal expansion of the
cylinders) and destroyed valve trains. All of this resulted in an
average engine life of about 50,000 miles (your mileage may vary --
HA! I was *waiting* to use that line).
So the natural follow-on question (so natural, in fact, that I'm not
breaking it out into its own question) is "can anything be done to
mitigate the design flaws of the 2.7?" The answer is:
- Have the case helicoiled or timeserted. These threaded
inserts are installed in the crank case to hold the
cylinder studs tightly and keep them from pulling.
- Use Dilivar or Raceware studs. These studs won't pull
out because they expand with temperature at the same
rate as the cylendars.
- Replace the 5-blade fan with an 11-blade fan.
- Add an extra oil cooler."
Looks like an extra couple $k will be needed to ensure avoiding engine failure. Or perhaps some of these measures have already been taken. We'll see..
Anyone on here daily or commonly drive their '74-78? If so, some tricks/tips would be appreciated.
#7
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#8
It looks like I need 15 post count before I can PM. So...
I haven't bought the car YET. If I have the opportunity I will most likely buy it. That being said, the owner is not 100% sure it is still available. The cars are trading ownership soon for an auction under a third party. The whole situation is a little complicated, and I haven't spoken with him much lately. So I'm kind of in limbo with the car now, waiting to see what happens.
I've been browsing online and found an '82 cabriolet conversion (from targa) local for $6900 that seems to be mechanically sound. If it turns out to be a good car after a PPI, the 78+ models would probably be more desirable over the 2.7L. We'll see...
I haven't bought the car YET. If I have the opportunity I will most likely buy it. That being said, the owner is not 100% sure it is still available. The cars are trading ownership soon for an auction under a third party. The whole situation is a little complicated, and I haven't spoken with him much lately. So I'm kind of in limbo with the car now, waiting to see what happens.
I've been browsing online and found an '82 cabriolet conversion (from targa) local for $6900 that seems to be mechanically sound. If it turns out to be a good car after a PPI, the 78+ models would probably be more desirable over the 2.7L. We'll see...
Last edited by white-tt; 11-04-2010 at 01:21 AM.
#9
The "carrera" may be a different animal from the NA ver. I had a 77' 911S Targa that I had for 25 years and sold it this year with 185K on the clock and still running fine with minimal oil usage.
Had a great mechanic and mods mentioned above were all done early in the game:
Removed thermal reactors and replaced with SSI exhaust
updated head studs
11 blade fan
added front oil cooler
consistent oil changes
fuel additive for CIS injection every other tank
The 77 was the first year with galvanixed body panels
Was a fun car, liked the narrow body. Would always advise to do a PPI with a shop that is very familiar with the 2.7. Rebuild is quite pricy that why there are examples with newer engines but that sometimes creates another set of issues. Guess I'm more inclined for originality
optical points in distributor
Had a great mechanic and mods mentioned above were all done early in the game:
Removed thermal reactors and replaced with SSI exhaust
updated head studs
11 blade fan
added front oil cooler
consistent oil changes
fuel additive for CIS injection every other tank
The 77 was the first year with galvanixed body panels
Was a fun car, liked the narrow body. Would always advise to do a PPI with a shop that is very familiar with the 2.7. Rebuild is quite pricy that why there are examples with newer engines but that sometimes creates another set of issues. Guess I'm more inclined for originality
optical points in distributor
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