to PDCC or not...
#32
03-07-2012, 03:22 PM
If I was getting a 991, the PDCC would be a "must have". It plays such a significant role in my CTT, but even though the 911 is much lower it still can benefit by such a great invention. From my understanding it does not allow the chassis to lean until the G's are greater then .75, then it lets it lean just a little.
When I am buying a sports car, its not time to be cheap and skip on performance options. I want it to be the best it can be for what it is used for 'sports'. If people want to skip on options to save money then skip on cosmetic ones like carbon fiber, leather, and contrast stitching. Not saying those aren't great too, but performance should far outweigh the looks for a sports car....me thinks.
When I am buying a sports car, its not time to be cheap and skip on performance options. I want it to be the best it can be for what it is used for 'sports'. If people want to skip on options to save money then skip on cosmetic ones like carbon fiber, leather, and contrast stitching. Not saying those aren't great too, but performance should far outweigh the looks for a sports car....me thinks.
#34
03-07-2012, 08:03 PM
No doubt PDCC greatly reduces lean, and thereby improves confidence, but I'm still trying to figure out how much measurable performance difference it provides.
Jeez, I'm spending way too much time on this stuff! Should be working, but it's been a tough week, the weather's great right now, and I'm in a mood to goof off.
Jeez, I'm spending way too much time on this stuff! Should be working, but it's been a tough week, the weather's great right now, and I'm in a mood to goof off.
As to your second point - I understand completely! This is way more fun!
#35
03-07-2012, 08:10 PM
I was on the fence whether to order it or not. The writeup below tipped me in favor of taking the leap of faith.
I have only driven a non-PDCC 991 yet. I did not think it rolled excessively, but then again, how would I compare "excessively" if I have not driven one with PDCC.
I will use as daily driver, and would like to do some track but not interested in modding for that given the DD. So the duality of character seems attractive to me.
"On straight roads they [stabilizer bar links] can go limp to essentially remove the stabilizer bar from the picture for a smooth ride. In corners they can be made to "overdrive" what the stabilizer bar could otherwise do on its own to utterly eliminate body roll. Or the computer can dial in any amount of roll stiffness in between, and it can change its mind in real time as road conditions or driver inputs fluctuate.
Porsche calls this Porsche Dynamic Chassis Control (PDCC) and it's the first time they've fit it to a 911-series vehicle. Whatever you call it, it flat works. This very car pulled 1.04 g on our skidpad, and some of the credit has to be put down to the way this system can make use of all four tires instead of leaning heavily on the outside ones.
You could theoretically achieve the same skidpad prowess with a pair of very big stabilizer bars, but then the car would ride like Grade A dog doo. Conversely, a hydraulic anti-roll system such as this doesn't need a physical stabilizer in between the left and right struts at all, but in that case there'd be no fail-safe if the system developed a fault."
Source:
http://blogs.insideline.com/straight...carrera-s.html
I have only driven a non-PDCC 991 yet. I did not think it rolled excessively, but then again, how would I compare "excessively" if I have not driven one with PDCC.
I will use as daily driver, and would like to do some track but not interested in modding for that given the DD. So the duality of character seems attractive to me.
"On straight roads they [stabilizer bar links] can go limp to essentially remove the stabilizer bar from the picture for a smooth ride. In corners they can be made to "overdrive" what the stabilizer bar could otherwise do on its own to utterly eliminate body roll. Or the computer can dial in any amount of roll stiffness in between, and it can change its mind in real time as road conditions or driver inputs fluctuate.
Porsche calls this Porsche Dynamic Chassis Control (PDCC) and it's the first time they've fit it to a 911-series vehicle. Whatever you call it, it flat works. This very car pulled 1.04 g on our skidpad, and some of the credit has to be put down to the way this system can make use of all four tires instead of leaning heavily on the outside ones.
You could theoretically achieve the same skidpad prowess with a pair of very big stabilizer bars, but then the car would ride like Grade A dog doo. Conversely, a hydraulic anti-roll system such as this doesn't need a physical stabilizer in between the left and right struts at all, but in that case there'd be no fail-safe if the system developed a fault."
Source:
http://blogs.insideline.com/straight...carrera-s.html
#36
03-07-2012, 09:14 PM
Porsche calls this Porsche Dynamic Chassis Control (PDCC) and it's the first time they've fit it to a 911-series vehicle. Whatever you call it, it flat works. This very car pulled 1.04 g on our skidpad, and some of the credit has to be put down to the way this system can make use of all four tires instead of leaning heavily on the outside ones.
In any case, the 1.04 g on the skidpad is quite high, though it also tends to depend on the skidpad radius.
#37
03-07-2012, 09:17 PM
I was on the fence whether to order it or not. The writeup below tipped me in favor of taking the leap of faith.
I have only driven a non-PDCC 991 yet. I did not think it rolled excessively, but then again, how would I compare "excessively" if I have not driven one with PDCC.
I will use as daily driver, and would like to do some track but not interested in modding for that given the DD. So the duality of character seems attractive to me.
"On straight roads they [stabilizer bar links] can go limp to essentially remove the stabilizer bar from the picture for a smooth ride. In corners they can be made to "overdrive" what the stabilizer bar could otherwise do on its own to utterly eliminate body roll. Or the computer can dial in any amount of roll stiffness in between, and it can change its mind in real time as road conditions or driver inputs fluctuate.
Porsche calls this Porsche Dynamic Chassis Control (PDCC) and it's the first time they've fit it to a 911-series vehicle. Whatever you call it, it flat works. This very car pulled 1.04 g on our skidpad, and some of the credit has to be put down to the way this system can make use of all four tires instead of leaning heavily on the outside ones.
You could theoretically achieve the same skidpad prowess with a pair of very big stabilizer bars, but then the car would ride like Grade A dog doo. Conversely, a hydraulic anti-roll system such as this doesn't need a physical stabilizer in between the left and right struts at all, but in that case there'd be no fail-safe if the system developed a fault."
Source:
http://blogs.insideline.com/straight...carrera-s.html
I have only driven a non-PDCC 991 yet. I did not think it rolled excessively, but then again, how would I compare "excessively" if I have not driven one with PDCC.
I will use as daily driver, and would like to do some track but not interested in modding for that given the DD. So the duality of character seems attractive to me.
"On straight roads they [stabilizer bar links] can go limp to essentially remove the stabilizer bar from the picture for a smooth ride. In corners they can be made to "overdrive" what the stabilizer bar could otherwise do on its own to utterly eliminate body roll. Or the computer can dial in any amount of roll stiffness in between, and it can change its mind in real time as road conditions or driver inputs fluctuate.
Porsche calls this Porsche Dynamic Chassis Control (PDCC) and it's the first time they've fit it to a 911-series vehicle. Whatever you call it, it flat works. This very car pulled 1.04 g on our skidpad, and some of the credit has to be put down to the way this system can make use of all four tires instead of leaning heavily on the outside ones.
You could theoretically achieve the same skidpad prowess with a pair of very big stabilizer bars, but then the car would ride like Grade A dog doo. Conversely, a hydraulic anti-roll system such as this doesn't need a physical stabilizer in between the left and right struts at all, but in that case there'd be no fail-safe if the system developed a fault."
Source:
http://blogs.insideline.com/straight...carrera-s.html
#38
03-12-2012, 11:52 AM
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: SF Bay Area, California
Posts: 320
Rep Power: 34 
Test drove yet another white 991S at Carlsen's this time at 102 mph on Hwy 101. Continue to reserve judgement till I drive the 7spd.
The car did not have PDCC, PSE, chrono or any of the goodies - just a base S w/ bose. I asked about the PDCC and Michael Bradely, the sales person said PDCC is the last option people consider on a 991 and first on a cayenne. He sounded convincing to me. I believe, Carlsen has not ordered any with it yet.
The car did not have PDCC, PSE, chrono or any of the goodies - just a base S w/ bose. I asked about the PDCC and Michael Bradely, the sales person said PDCC is the last option people consider on a 991 and first on a cayenne. He sounded convincing to me. I believe, Carlsen has not ordered any with it yet.
#39
03-12-2012, 12:18 PM
I don't have PDCC just spasm. If I didn't know PDCC existed I would be extremely pleased with the handling of my car. In fact I would be thrilled. Sadly now that I have read the above I wish I had ordered the PDCC. Not sure why.... I just "want" not "need"!
#40
03-12-2012, 12:44 PM
Test drove yet another white 991S at Carlsen's this time at 102 mph on Hwy 101. Continue to reserve judgement till I drive the 7spd.
The car did not have PDCC, PSE, chrono or any of the goodies - just a base S w/ bose. I asked about the PDCC and Michael Bradely, the sales person said PDCC is the last option people consider on a 991 and first on a cayenne. He sounded convincing to me. I believe, Carlsen has not ordered any with it yet.
The car did not have PDCC, PSE, chrono or any of the goodies - just a base S w/ bose. I asked about the PDCC and Michael Bradely, the sales person said PDCC is the last option people consider on a 991 and first on a cayenne. He sounded convincing to me. I believe, Carlsen has not ordered any with it yet.
Last edited by No.92; 03-12-2012 at 12:47 PM.
#41
03-12-2012, 08:09 PM
No doubt PDCC greatly reduces lean, and thereby improves confidence, but I'm still trying to figure out how much measurable performance difference it provides.
Jeez, I'm spending way too much time on this stuff! Should be working, but it's been a tough week, the weather's great right now, and I'm in a mood to goof off.
Jeez, I'm spending way too much time on this stuff! Should be working, but it's been a tough week, the weather's great right now, and I'm in a mood to goof off.
Lurker out.
#42
03-12-2012, 09:58 PM
Understood that weight (load) transfer is lateral as well, but how does PDCC reduce lateral load transfer? The lateral load is still mv^2/R, the lateral 'torque' is still lateral load times CG height, and the lateral load transfer is still lateral torque divided by track width. What am I missing here?
#43
03-12-2012, 10:36 PM
Nice reminder with the link EricP! PDCC is very special as is PTV with the special diff. Looking over the option list my guess why PDCC is being left out is simply to get people into these new cars at a price they can afford without scaring them off from thinking they are missing out on anything. So if it's not in the car why poke it under their noses when you know it could most likey make a deal harder to do.
Many can say they dont need this or that, or it numbs the car
but the reality is if money wasn't an issue all of theses boxes would be ticked in a heartbeat. For me it would be the 20mm Pasm Sports chassis with PDCC, PTV and Sports chrono (with the dynamic engine mounts)....and also a big bullet to bite into when I write the cheque
.
Many can say they dont need this or that, or it numbs the car
but the reality is if money wasn't an issue all of theses boxes would be ticked in a heartbeat. For me it would be the 20mm Pasm Sports chassis with PDCC, PTV and Sports chrono (with the dynamic engine mounts)....and also a big bullet to bite into when I write the cheque.
#44
03-12-2012, 11:45 PM
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: SF Bay Area, California
Posts: 320
Rep Power: 34 Wow, that's a fail for Carlsen then. I can't believe they wouldn't order any cars with it. Go check out Porsche of Fremont. Those guys are the best. Very friendly and not stuck up like the guys down at Steven's Creek in San Jose. Ask for Barry. He's a great sales guy and was very patient with us. And when I did my test drive there, the vehicle had PDCC.
Fremont's John continues to stalk me with phone calls at least twice a week.
#45
03-13-2012, 05:24 AM
