new Porsche Cayman any day over 911
Aren't we saying the same thing?
#122
02-20-2013, 07:48 AM
*Edit - after rereading it, yes.
** Edit - After thinking about why I misinterpreted your post, it's because when I spec'd out a Cayman S with things I consider should be standard on every car, I end up around $96-98k, plus destination fee = ~$100k. So I thought you were speaking in present tense, not future tense. I see the current Cayman as a $100k mid-engine car.
I think Porsche is doing an EXTREMELY good job of keeping the Cayman S away from 911 territory. So good, in fact, they are being careful NOT make it as good (or better) by accident.
** Edit - After thinking about why I misinterpreted your post, it's because when I spec'd out a Cayman S with things I consider should be standard on every car, I end up around $96-98k, plus destination fee = ~$100k. So I thought you were speaking in present tense, not future tense. I see the current Cayman as a $100k mid-engine car.
I think Porsche is doing an EXTREMELY good job of keeping the Cayman S away from 911 territory. So good, in fact, they are being careful NOT make it as good (or better) by accident.
Last edited by jaspergtr; 02-20-2013 at 08:54 AM.
#123
02-20-2013, 08:05 AM
Have to agree that putting more power, better brakes, etc. in the Cayman would make it a real rival to the 991, and likely steal considerable sales from it (and other cars). There's very much a place for an 'affordable' (~$100K) mid-engine two-seater coupe which is about as good as Porsche can make it.
The is a big gap in the mid-engine sports car market. The next step up from a Boxster or Cayman is an Audi R8. And that's a pretty big step! If Porsche developed a Cayman GT with a 400hp 3.8l engine in the $100k range, it would be awesome! And likely cost Audi some R8 sales. Perhaps the new NSX will capture that market?
Not sure it would affect 911 sales. The vehicle dynamics are totally different, as are the buyer demographics. Although some of us have both. (and still don't need or use the back 'seats')
#124
02-20-2013, 08:26 AM
Where some people get annoyed is that it feels like the Cayman is being limited to keep it from beating the 911. Imagine if the Cayman was made by a competitor for a second. Maybe BMW or Lotus. Same car, different badge. You better believe they would put the best motor they had in it. Porsche has a motor(the 911 motor) that would "drop in" but they chose to develop a different, less powerful motor. Why?
ChuckJ
Last edited by ChuckJ; 02-20-2013 at 08:40 AM.
#125
02-20-2013, 08:44 AM
Exactly!
The is a big gap in the mid-engine sports car market. The next step up from a Boxster or Cayman is an Audi R8. And that's a pretty big step! If Porsche developed a Cayman GT with a 400hp 3.8l engine in the $100k range, it would be awesome! And likely cost Audi some R8 sales. Perhaps the new NSX will capture that market?
Not sure it would affect 911 sales. The vehicle dynamics are totally different, as are the buyer demographics. Although some of us have both. (and still don't need or use the back 'seats')
The is a big gap in the mid-engine sports car market. The next step up from a Boxster or Cayman is an Audi R8. And that's a pretty big step! If Porsche developed a Cayman GT with a 400hp 3.8l engine in the $100k range, it would be awesome! And likely cost Audi some R8 sales. Perhaps the new NSX will capture that market?
Not sure it would affect 911 sales. The vehicle dynamics are totally different, as are the buyer demographics. Although some of us have both. (and still don't need or use the back 'seats')
Looking at Nissan (as a marketing example) a few years ago (before the 3.7):
Altima sedan 3.5 VQ FWD sedan
Altima coupe 3.5 VQ FWD 2+2
Maxima 3.5 VQ sedan
350Z 3.5 VQ RWD 2 seater coupe
G35 sedan 3.5 VQ RWD/AWD entry luxury
G35 coupe 3.5 VQ RWD 2+2 entry luxury sport coupe (before the G37x)
M35 3.5 VQ RWD luxury sedan
FX35 3.5 VQ AWD cross-over SUV
If you have an award winning engine platform, why not share it? Same platform (even the front mid-engine design), but completely different market segments. Give the choice to the consumer.
#126
02-20-2013, 08:56 AM
I'm sure Porsche marketing would like to keep their 50 year old flagship floating by not making a derivative of the entry car the premiere racing machine. That said, adding hp increases cost and weight to the engine, structure, brake, wheel and transmission components, so unless you're a hot rod guy who doesn't care about durability, that increased structure would come with cost putting the two cars very close in cost. And finally, the folks who designed the 918 seem to think that the best weight distribution is 43/57 front/rear. Perhaps that's why we see the priority on the 911.
ChuckJ
ChuckJ
The Cayman has come of age. I say let it be all it can be, and then let the customer choose. Imagine a Cayman GT3 ... wow!
#127
02-20-2013, 09:02 AM
** Edit - After thinking about why I misinterpreted your post, it's because when I spec'd out a Cayman S with things I consider should be standard on every car, I end up around $96-98k, plus destination fee = ~$100k. So I thought you were speaking in present tense, not future tense. I see the current Cayman as a $100k mid-engine car.
#131
02-20-2013, 09:58 AM
I don't see why they couldn't beef up the Cayman to a similar level as the 991, while still keeping it lighter since it would be smaller. That would address the durability issue. And the cost should be similar too, if not a bit lower for the Cayman. It would then come down to people choosing the platform they prefer, since the objective performance would be comparable (and note that the Cayman isn't 50/50 either).
The Cayman has come of age. I say let it be all it can be, and then let the customer choose. Imagine a Cayman GT3 ... wow!
The Cayman has come of age. I say let it be all it can be, and then let the customer choose. Imagine a Cayman GT3 ... wow!
But for $100K, they should be able to give us it at least a 3.6 L engine with a lot more power. I don't know how reliable the source is, but I recall reading that the production cost for a Cayman is less than a Boxster, and it does seem odd for a convertible version to cost less. The Cayman seems to have some middle child problems, but eager to surpass big brother.
#132
02-20-2013, 10:28 AM
Not necessarily for the 911...depends on the track.
Last edited by buck986; 02-20-2013 at 10:46 AM.
#133
02-20-2013, 10:33 AM
Also, some of us don't want to end up with a trailer, tow vehicle, etc. Otherwise, we would all have Ariel Atoms or BAC Monos.
#134
02-20-2013, 12:22 PM
Let's be real for a second here. There's no reason a TIP TOP spec'd Cayman S should be slower than a BASE 911. That just doesn't make sense. Sure base vs base make the Cayman slower. But why is a fully spec'd "S" car slower than a bare bones GT car?
