Or it could just be considered a Next Generation Automatic

 

Tell that to the rest of the world.
https://www.google.com/search?q=auto...hrome&ie=UTF-8

 

Does the lack of a clutch pedal and the fact that car automatically changes gears for you, not qualify it as being an automatic?

But more importantly, when did the term "automatic" become so toxic.

It's a personal choice - neither of which should draw the ire of others.

 

It's a matter of definition in a fast-changing technology. Where once there were just two choices - auto or manual - there are now at least 4 - traditional auto, traditional manual, continuously-variable, and semi-automatic. We don't say we are taping a TV program because tapes are from last century. We don't play records anymore. We once had only postal mail but now we have electronic mail. So, if you want to keep lumping transmissions together as being one or the other, that's your business but those who refuse to accept the differences are becoming dinosaurs.

From Wikipedia:
Despite superficial similarity to other transmissions, automatic transmissions differ significantly in internal operation and driver's feel from semi-automatics and CVTs. An automatic uses a torque converter instead of a clutch to manage the connection between the transmission gearing and the engine. In contrast, a CVT uses a belt or other torque transmission scheme to allow an "infinite" number of gear ratios instead of a fixed number of gear ratios. A semi-automatic retains a clutch like a manual transmission, but controls the clutch through electrohydraulic means.

 

A lot of defensiveness from the automatic, er, non-traditional manual, er, automated manual crowd. We're really not challenging your manhood for not wanting to drive a traditional manual. If you enjoy 2 pedals and flicking the paddles back and forth to change gears, more power to you. I personally don't consider it a 'MANUAL' because the transmission has clutches rather than a torque converter, when you have only 2 pedals and paddles.

My personal driving activity with a PDK is closer to a traditional automatic transmission than to a traditional manual with a clutch pedal and a shifter with multiple gates.

 

Unbelievable. I own and drive two three-pedal manual cars and I'm quite secure in my manhood. Call it what you want and enjoy using it, whichever transmission you have. I hope you're secure in your knowledge that your car isn't as fast or as technically advanced as mine.

 

I was wondering when this would come up.

See how black and white that is?

This is why I refer to difference transmissions as single clutch transmissions, and dual clutch transmissions...

But then again, we'd have to redefine over the last several decades what an automatic transmission is... I think people who get butt hurt about the PDK transmissions (or other dual clutch setups) have other deeper issues. It is a preference. Nothing more.

I'm sticking by my Amish comment I made a while back. So welcome Amish sports enthusiasts. The world was perfect a few years ago right after the advent of ABS, disc brakes, 3-way adjustable suspension, fuel injection, drive-by-wire, LSD's, single clutches with synchros, etc... Anything older is antiquated, and anything newer is horrible and ruins the experience.

 

Arrgh! This debate is solely about how to classify and call the new technology, not about personal preference for one over the other. I'm done.

 

Yep, not as fast or technically advanced, and I've admitted so many times. The only reason the speed 'numbers' matter to me is so that I know how fast the car will 'feel' to me. I really couldn't care less how technically advanced my transmission is. In the end, all that really matters is that it is just more fun for me, as yours is for you!!!

 

I hear you and you may be right. But I still think there's an underlying subtext here of "which is better?" Some MT fans want to call it "automatic" because there is a perceived stigma about the term in the enthusiasts world, and some PDK fans feel defensive about the term for the same reason. In the end, it's really just semantics and definition.

My only point is that they're both "better" for different reasons. Today, for me, I care more about those characteristics of a MT -- but I can fully appreciate the benefits of a PDK (or even a traditional automatic with TC).

On another topic -- I wanted to ask which kind of oil is best for my car? (Just kidding )

 

I think you make a good point. Given all of the prior discussions, I can't for the life of me figure out why I continue to argue. The PDK is better in nearly every single way, and yet I prefer the alternative! No explaining some people...

BTW, I vote oilless. These cars are so precise and advanced these days, I think that oil is just overkill.

 

I think another issue may be - why would you bother trying to justify your preference?

I think we've all agreed (at some point) that dual clutches are superior in every measurable way. The difference is preference.

I don't think anyone would argue against preference. There are 'better' cars than the ones we chose, but we preferred 'these' (whatever car(s) you now have).

The only issue I have is when someone tries to justify their preference as somehow being superior to mine. We can shoot holes in those all day long... (and I have - it can be quite fun)

I'm trying to get an Alfa Romeo 4C as we speak. It is inferior to my current car? In every single way. But I want one. I'm not going to try and explain to any owner of my current car that the Alfa Romeo is a better car, or I can't explain it, because they just don't get it - that appears quite condescending.

Preference, brothers, preference.

There will always be options with better technologies and capabilities. We only have to choose which ones we prefer.

For the record, my preference is better than your preferences...

 

From what has been shown, the Alpha will be most directly comparable to a Lotus- a great track toy and not really comparable to anything in the Porsche lineup. Should be interesting to see how they shake out. OOPS sorry should net say that and Lotus in the same sentence.

 

How is this for irony... What sold us on the Alfa 4C (that didn't need help at the time), was the dry twin clutch setup.

The wife and I both prefer dual clutches to autos and single clutch transmissions. We drive all three, but have a preference to the dual clutch.

 

Watch Out!!!!!!!!This is kinda like Gay marriage. marriage is defined as being with man & woman...............Ducking now

Dan