2003 996tt replaced with 08 Z06
#46
11-07-2007, 05:31 PM
for the tt
#47
11-07-2007, 05:32 PM
Registered User
I always tell people this:
If you cant see the difference, or appreciate the differences, then by all means... BUY A Z06. If you can, then you "get it".
I've not found a Z06 yet that can keep up with me on a road course. I've also not lost to one at a stoplight challenge. I've run against a couple that have been modified as well, and even though my car is 3564# corner weighted, so it IS heavy, not including my lard ***...
The new Z06 is I'm sure the finest Chevy made. It's still a chevy, and it'll still depreciate the same as all other corvettes (About 40%) and will still suffer the plague of all GM build issues. I had one, have the t-shirt, ballcap, hoodie, and many memories of broken parts and failed promises...
Good luck and enjoy your new Chevrolet!
Mike
If you cant see the difference, or appreciate the differences, then by all means... BUY A Z06. If you can, then you "get it".
I've not found a Z06 yet that can keep up with me on a road course. I've also not lost to one at a stoplight challenge. I've run against a couple that have been modified as well, and even though my car is 3564# corner weighted, so it IS heavy, not including my lard ***...
The new Z06 is I'm sure the finest Chevy made. It's still a chevy, and it'll still depreciate the same as all other corvettes (About 40%) and will still suffer the plague of all GM build issues. I had one, have the t-shirt, ballcap, hoodie, and many memories of broken parts and failed promises...
Good luck and enjoy your new Chevrolet!
Mike
#48
11-07-2007, 05:33 PM
Boulder/Furman- I agree with both of you, even when I had a C5 Roadster the bang for the buck conversation was a pretty frequent topic.
That said, I think everyone has to admit that they have made monumental strides in getting the Vette ever closer to the Porsche benchmark. Old stereotypes die hard. Even if the Vette were arguably better, youd still hear people for years to come tell you "its no Porsche."
That said, I think everyone has to admit that they have made monumental strides in getting the Vette ever closer to the Porsche benchmark. Old stereotypes die hard. Even if the Vette were arguably better, youd still hear people for years to come tell you "its no Porsche."
#49
11-07-2007, 05:36 PM
I am getting ready to sell my '01 Z06 with 67,000 miles on it. I'm going to ask $22g but I'll obviously get less. Close to 60% depriciation in 7 years with lots of miles.
For the record I loved my vette. It was a great city car. Seats weren't supportive but were comfortable as anything. Steering was over boosted but easy to maneuver. Transmission was notchy but manly. It was easy and fun to get the tail out.
But that's irrelevant. This guy bought an '08 which is better in every way. Enjoy the crap out of it, dude.
For the record I loved my vette. It was a great city car. Seats weren't supportive but were comfortable as anything. Steering was over boosted but easy to maneuver. Transmission was notchy but manly. It was easy and fun to get the tail out.
But that's irrelevant. This guy bought an '08 which is better in every way. Enjoy the crap out of it, dude.
#50
11-07-2007, 05:37 PM
Registered User
Jamie, I've read a lot of your posts, and I'll meet you in person on Monday at the trackday rental... I like what you write most of the time, but have to challenge this one... I shopped... HARD. I never could find a 2002-2004 Z06 for less than $52K+ at any of the dealerships when I was nominally checking price in that era. They simply weren't there... Koons didn't have them, Kerbek wasn't selling them at that price, and nobody else was that I'm aware of... My best friend still has his 2003 Sticker for his and I confirmed an 2003 anniversary package car sold new for $58924. They simply weren't available for $42000. Maybe if you had a GM "family" discount you could get it at that, but I wasn't so fortunate in 2003-2004 or I'd have bought one back then... Instead I bought a used C5 and built a monster... Then broke it repeatedly and sold it.
Mike
Mike
Shark and XXI, the weed I'm smokin obviously isn't as damaging as the crack some of you are smokin, go on ebay and look at 5 year old 2002 C5 Z06's with decent mileage still bringing in the the low to mid 30's, a car that could be bought new all day long for 42k or less, around a 25 percent depreciation not 45 percent. I bought an 04 Z06 commemerative for 12k off msrp or about 44k brand new, that same car with low mileage 10k or less is still bringing high 30's 4 years later about a 10 percent loss. I also bought my new Z06 for 10k off msrp or 67k for the anyone not familiar with Z06 prices. That car will still bring low to mid 50's in 5 years IMO if it follows the same trend as the low hp Z06's, which I think with the dry sump 427 that comes in the car now will make it more desireable in the used market than the C5 keeping prices up, and even if they do go to the high 40's thats still only 30 percent but only ragged out ones will see 40's. I also stated that I would buy a Porsche over a Vette because of the overall package, but the fact is Porsches are softer than baby **** in the used car market and have trouble maintaining a reasonable market price and thats a fact, look at the first post in this thread! Now I could get on that crack pipe and tell you that my GT2 with the 196K MSRP with only 3500 miles is still holding 70 percent of its value like the Z06's are, but would you believe me? 
Not to mention I don't get any comfort pretending my ****s worth more than the market has shown me its not.
Not to mention I don't get any comfort pretending my ****s worth more than the market has shown me its not.
Last edited by Mikelly; 11-07-2007 at 05:39 PM.
#51
11-07-2007, 05:41 PM
In late 2004 (I believe it was August), you could buy an '04 Z06 new for $42500. It was almost too good to pass up, but I managed.
#52
11-07-2007, 06:09 PM
I just had to chime in.
It is refreshing to hear this sentiment, since many enthusiasts will overlook the facts about the marketplace when their vehicle's reputation is at stake.
Cars are certainly not the greatest investment in the world!
#53
11-07-2007, 06:27 PM
When most people find out that I am enthusiast and have a 911 turbo, 2 words always accompany the next sentences...."Viper" and "Z06". Although I politely say that both cars have their strengths, this always pulls a "they are faster than a turbo" response. I used to get irritated at the knee jerk canned comments but now I just laugh and put it on driver skill.
I did drive a current Z06 this last summer, and while numerically it was an excellent car, I felt that all the cool things (HUD, NAV etc...) and quick acceleration desperately were trying to distract me from the fact that its still a chevy with a fisher price interior, kind of like a chevy trying not to be a chevy for lack of better words. What is impressive is I think Chevy gets this and are sincere about turning that corner of change. I wont even bother you with the viper, it just looks like a clown shoe and would expect any car with a V10 to be quick.
As much as my retired Union Father would love for me to buy 'Murican Iron, I just cant. It could have 1000hp and tq, do low 9's in the 1/4 and 7.1x's on the 'ring... but I cant buy a Z06 or any other American car and it isnt about depreciation as 99.9% cars depreciate at a sickening rate. It's more about ownership experience (I wish this was a rating somewhere tangible). A few posters hit on the Dealership Bubba's, which is a big deal for me, I simply need to be able to support the car I buy, even if out of warranty. I will eventually need a part....the right part and hopefully this week. the other factor is that whoever is designing interiors for Chevy desperately needs to retire, the fisher price philosophy was tolerated in the 80's but really, enough already- seriously RETIRE already! Last but not least is the dreaded dealer experience. I wont go into a tirade here, but lets just say they can learn something from just about any Japanese or German brand for that matter (there will always be exceptions), and Yes, it's that bad.
These are the major reasons (at least for me) why American car builders are going to shiite- Qaulity control, Design input and execution (get rid of the fisher price-esque designs and YES retire already) and dealership experience. If the UAW/Big 3 would fix these issues, American cars would be something to be proud of once again, impressive performance numbers just aren't going to do it for me, and I'm guessing for quite a few others as well.
Btw, I would love to see 1/4 and track times in real world weather on real world roads :-)
I did drive a current Z06 this last summer, and while numerically it was an excellent car, I felt that all the cool things (HUD, NAV etc...) and quick acceleration desperately were trying to distract me from the fact that its still a chevy with a fisher price interior, kind of like a chevy trying not to be a chevy for lack of better words. What is impressive is I think Chevy gets this and are sincere about turning that corner of change. I wont even bother you with the viper, it just looks like a clown shoe and would expect any car with a V10 to be quick.
As much as my retired Union Father would love for me to buy 'Murican Iron, I just cant. It could have 1000hp and tq, do low 9's in the 1/4 and 7.1x's on the 'ring... but I cant buy a Z06 or any other American car and it isnt about depreciation as 99.9% cars depreciate at a sickening rate. It's more about ownership experience (I wish this was a rating somewhere tangible). A few posters hit on the Dealership Bubba's, which is a big deal for me, I simply need to be able to support the car I buy, even if out of warranty. I will eventually need a part....the right part and hopefully this week. the other factor is that whoever is designing interiors for Chevy desperately needs to retire, the fisher price philosophy was tolerated in the 80's but really, enough already- seriously RETIRE already! Last but not least is the dreaded dealer experience. I wont go into a tirade here, but lets just say they can learn something from just about any Japanese or German brand for that matter (there will always be exceptions), and Yes, it's that bad.
These are the major reasons (at least for me) why American car builders are going to shiite- Qaulity control, Design input and execution (get rid of the fisher price-esque designs and YES retire already) and dealership experience. If the UAW/Big 3 would fix these issues, American cars would be something to be proud of once again, impressive performance numbers just aren't going to do it for me, and I'm guessing for quite a few others as well.
Btw, I would love to see 1/4 and track times in real world weather on real world roads :-)
#54
11-07-2007, 06:58 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Woodbridge Virginia
Posts: 510
Rep Power: 59 
Mike you will meet me monday and I am sure we will have a good time! Mike I didn't just buy 1 Z06, I bought 3 of the Commemorative Vettes for that price! I don't b.s. any one that knows me knows that. I bought my car from Chriswell in August 2004 and the other 2 I bought or should I say I put the deal together for. I believe from Les Stanford in MI for my business partner and his cousin who both still own theirs. Maybe you didn't look HARD enough because the 12k off was the ADVERTISED PRICE no negotiating what so ever and the only reason I bought one. I am almost postive my window was 56,500 but its been a while and I could be off a grand maybe. I kept the car for about 6 months and heard about the new 505 hp Z06 and decided to cut my loss's and sold the car for 42k in less than 5 days. I might even still have the contract somewhere and if I do you can see it monday. I know for sure I can find my current one that shows I bought my 07 Brand New from Les Stanford also for 67k or 10,500 off window and if you want to see it I would be more than happy to show it to you. I actually think you are confused a little bit, I think you were looking for the 2004 in the summer of 2003 and they were not discounting those because they still had 2003 in inventory but by the summer of 2004 12k discounts were common on the 2004 inventory. Mike there is no doubt some broken Chevys out there, but didn't you post last week your Porsche broke?
I thought this thread was about a corvette maintaining a good residual value which some people felt it was a oppurtunity to bash corvettes or probably anything else that is not in their garage! I love my GT2, but its not the only car ever built thats for sure!
And from a Porsche TT owner which I am, stock to stock the Z06 will annihilate the TT with equal drivers, wouldn't even be a race!
I thought this thread was about a corvette maintaining a good residual value which some people felt it was a oppurtunity to bash corvettes or probably anything else that is not in their garage! I love my GT2, but its not the only car ever built thats for sure!
And from a Porsche TT owner which I am, stock to stock the Z06 will annihilate the TT with equal drivers, wouldn't even be a race!
Last edited by jamie furman; 11-08-2007 at 05:39 AM.
#55
11-07-2007, 07:04 PM
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I remember the 40k Vette's, Kurt Warner's dealership in Vancouver was advertising that pretty heavily locally.
Aren't the 08's getting discounted below 70k now brand new? I thought I remember reading that on corvetteforums recently.
Aren't the 08's getting discounted below 70k now brand new? I thought I remember reading that on corvetteforums recently.
#56
11-07-2007, 07:22 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Woodbridge Virginia
Posts: 510
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Zulu12 you are correct there are some 8k discounts on the 2008 Z now, and you can buy a 432 hp model in the low 40's.
#57
11-07-2007, 08:52 PM
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Ahhhhh. Glad to see someone brought the Vipers into the equation. Simple, easy questions easily solved by adding fire.
I agree on the P car depreciation. Thats why I buy used. Bought my 2001TT for 70k and traded for 65k one year later. Bought my Z new for 72.5k and traded it a year and a half later for 58k. Bought my 04TT for 74.5k and traded 3 months later for 73.9k. All were trade-in's. Keep in mind that I paid full tilt on the Z and my new Ruf, but I got what I wanted on my trade. Either way it is a game.
Want what you have and don't have what you want. Very noble and poetic. Not for me. If it sucks and pisses me off, the ***** goes down the road. German, American, Italian or whatever.
Buy it. Drive it. Enjoy it. If you can afford it, do it over and over again.
I think I need a Viper in the garage next. Haven't had one of those yet. What do you think?
I agree on the P car depreciation. Thats why I buy used. Bought my 2001TT for 70k and traded for 65k one year later. Bought my Z new for 72.5k and traded it a year and a half later for 58k. Bought my 04TT for 74.5k and traded 3 months later for 73.9k. All were trade-in's. Keep in mind that I paid full tilt on the Z and my new Ruf, but I got what I wanted on my trade. Either way it is a game.
Want what you have and don't have what you want. Very noble and poetic. Not for me. If it sucks and pisses me off, the ***** goes down the road. German, American, Italian or whatever.
Buy it. Drive it. Enjoy it. If you can afford it, do it over and over again.
I think I need a Viper in the garage next. Haven't had one of those yet. What do you think?
#58
11-07-2007, 08:59 PM
Ok my two cents as a car guy only not a porschephile etc.
I have owned in recent years a:
04 Z06
05 C6 Z51
04 Cobra
05 Viper SRT-10
04 F360
05 Gallardo
03 Murci
Now my point is this. The "value" argument holds water, and on all of the domestics listed above at the time I bought them it was near year end. But the Z06 was $10K off MSRP, the same for the C6 Z51, $5 k off on the Cobra and $12K off on the Viper. So for money they go like stink, they turn reasonably etc. BUT they simply don't have the refinement that the others do (and I have driven a bunch of 996 and 997's just haven't pulled the infamous trigger yet). The Viper was literally like driving a sauna on any day over 60 deg out, the Corvette (Z06) felt like sitting in my wifes Tahoe with less leg room, the Z51 was nice, but the seats I swear were made from balsa wood and paper mache'. (The viper trunk finally gave up the ghost when the fiber broke at the latch. It left my garage permanently THAT very day!) So for the value, you now need to add proper seats, climate control, yadda, yadda and now you have decent car.
BUT, again they aren't porches, F-cars, or Lambos. They "sports" feel isn't there. And as much as we might all hate the service costs at the semi- to real exotic dealers, I would GLADLY pay that over going to the Chevy dealer and seeing a 17 yo lot jock grab the keys to my Vette to "pull it around back". Plus the toothless wonder behind the counter trying to check me in that can't understand why I am adamant about not scratching the paint, hand washing, fender covers and the like.
So the "value" is there, but you sure get what you pay for. Now off to WalMart for some discount shoes to go with my vette.........
I have owned in recent years a:
04 Z06
05 C6 Z51
04 Cobra
05 Viper SRT-10
04 F360
05 Gallardo
03 Murci
Now my point is this. The "value" argument holds water, and on all of the domestics listed above at the time I bought them it was near year end. But the Z06 was $10K off MSRP, the same for the C6 Z51, $5 k off on the Cobra and $12K off on the Viper. So for money they go like stink, they turn reasonably etc. BUT they simply don't have the refinement that the others do (and I have driven a bunch of 996 and 997's just haven't pulled the infamous trigger yet). The Viper was literally like driving a sauna on any day over 60 deg out, the Corvette (Z06) felt like sitting in my wifes Tahoe with less leg room, the Z51 was nice, but the seats I swear were made from balsa wood and paper mache'. (The viper trunk finally gave up the ghost when the fiber broke at the latch. It left my garage permanently THAT very day!) So for the value, you now need to add proper seats, climate control, yadda, yadda and now you have decent car.
BUT, again they aren't porches, F-cars, or Lambos. They "sports" feel isn't there. And as much as we might all hate the service costs at the semi- to real exotic dealers, I would GLADLY pay that over going to the Chevy dealer and seeing a 17 yo lot jock grab the keys to my Vette to "pull it around back". Plus the toothless wonder behind the counter trying to check me in that can't understand why I am adamant about not scratching the paint, hand washing, fender covers and the like.
So the "value" is there, but you sure get what you pay for. Now off to WalMart for some discount shoes to go with my vette.........
#59
11-07-2007, 09:35 PM
When most people find out that I am enthusiast and have a 911 turbo, 2 words always accompany the next sentences...."Viper" and "Z06". Although I politely say that both cars have their strengths, this always pulls a "they are faster than a turbo" response. I used to get irritated at the knee jerk canned comments but now I just laugh and put it on driver skill.
I did drive a current Z06 this last summer, and while numerically it was an excellent car, I felt that all the cool things (HUD, NAV etc...) and quick acceleration desperately were trying to distract me from the fact that its still a chevy with a fisher price interior, kind of like a chevy trying not to be a chevy for lack of better words. What is impressive is I think Chevy gets this and are sincere about turning that corner of change. I wont even bother you with the viper, it just looks like a clown shoe and would expect any car with a V10 to be quick.
As much as my retired Union Father would love for me to buy 'Murican Iron, I just cant. It could have 1000hp and tq, do low 9's in the 1/4 and 7.1x's on the 'ring... but I cant buy a Z06 or any other American car and it isnt about depreciation as 99.9% cars depreciate at a sickening rate. It's more about ownership experience (I wish this was a rating somewhere tangible). A few posters hit on the Dealership Bubba's, which is a big deal for me, I simply need to be able to support the car I buy, even if out of warranty. I will eventually need a part....the right part and hopefully this week. the other factor is that whoever is designing interiors for Chevy desperately needs to retire, the fisher price philosophy was tolerated in the 80's but really, enough already- seriously RETIRE already! Last but not least is the dreaded dealer experience. I wont go into a tirade here, but lets just say they can learn something from just about any Japanese or German brand for that matter (there will always be exceptions), and Yes, it's that bad.
These are the major reasons (at least for me) why American car builders are going to shiite- Qaulity control, Design input and execution (get rid of the fisher price-esque designs and YES retire already) and dealership experience. If the UAW/Big 3 would fix these issues, American cars would be something to be proud of once again, impressive performance numbers just aren't going to do it for me, and I'm guessing for quite a few others as well.
Btw, I would love to see 1/4 and track times in real world weather on real world roads :-)
I did drive a current Z06 this last summer, and while numerically it was an excellent car, I felt that all the cool things (HUD, NAV etc...) and quick acceleration desperately were trying to distract me from the fact that its still a chevy with a fisher price interior, kind of like a chevy trying not to be a chevy for lack of better words. What is impressive is I think Chevy gets this and are sincere about turning that corner of change. I wont even bother you with the viper, it just looks like a clown shoe and would expect any car with a V10 to be quick.
As much as my retired Union Father would love for me to buy 'Murican Iron, I just cant. It could have 1000hp and tq, do low 9's in the 1/4 and 7.1x's on the 'ring... but I cant buy a Z06 or any other American car and it isnt about depreciation as 99.9% cars depreciate at a sickening rate. It's more about ownership experience (I wish this was a rating somewhere tangible). A few posters hit on the Dealership Bubba's, which is a big deal for me, I simply need to be able to support the car I buy, even if out of warranty. I will eventually need a part....the right part and hopefully this week. the other factor is that whoever is designing interiors for Chevy desperately needs to retire, the fisher price philosophy was tolerated in the 80's but really, enough already- seriously RETIRE already! Last but not least is the dreaded dealer experience. I wont go into a tirade here, but lets just say they can learn something from just about any Japanese or German brand for that matter (there will always be exceptions), and Yes, it's that bad.
These are the major reasons (at least for me) why American car builders are going to shiite- Qaulity control, Design input and execution (get rid of the fisher price-esque designs and YES retire already) and dealership experience. If the UAW/Big 3 would fix these issues, American cars would be something to be proud of once again, impressive performance numbers just aren't going to do it for me, and I'm guessing for quite a few others as well.
Btw, I would love to see 1/4 and track times in real world weather on real world roads :-)
They just aren't for me, but great performance car's indeed, I am just spoiled by German feel and engineering!
BTW sounds like awesome updates for the 08 Z06, no brainer if someone were contemplating on buying one over an 07!
#60
11-07-2007, 10:04 PM
Guest
Posts: n/a
I love the c6 Zo6... I drove one at Byron dragway last weekend, I pulled off a 11.80 at 124mph on street tires, no launch, no power shifting, hot off the highway from the hour long drive up there with ease..
If someone did not bust an axle on it I woulda cracked low 11's before we left
If someone did not bust an axle on it I woulda cracked low 11's before we left