My thoughts on the Protomotive 650 package
#46
06-18-2008, 02:57 PM
Registered User
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Lo Barnechea & Viņa del Mar
Age: 52
Posts: 1,036
Rep Power: 64 
I have OEM K-24 Stage 4+ kit with a full full weith TT and I am at the 7.8 range as well.
#47
06-18-2008, 04:31 PM
Todd's in the process of building me a set of IC and pipes already so it's only a matter of time. I need to get a V-Box ordered, probably next on my short list. I need to weigh the car as well, the new clutch works awesome and I'm sure the savings in rotation mass should help my times as well.
#48
06-19-2008, 09:01 PM
Hey guys,
Well it seems that I can't stay away from modding the turbo... First it was an IA Stage 4 package, then GT640, now PE650...all in less than a year!!! I can now say that I'm done for a while because I'm thrilled with the PE650 package.
It started with the Stage 4 package, which was an AWESOME package. I had Stephen @ IA install it, and it was really a well put together package...I really liked it!! The car drove just like stock, except it had 50% more power...can't beat that. It consisted of k16/24 turbos, 1bar wastegates, DV's, boost hoses, headers, EP2Q exhaust, and a v-flow. It produced great power in the midrange and up top, and didn't have much lag at all...just a tiny bit more than k16's.
Being as happy as I was with the Stage 4 kit, I thought the next logical step was the GT640. Since I liked the power delivery of the k16/24's in the Stage 4, I assumed that the k16/GT28's in the GT640 kit would preform the same, just with more power throughout the rev range. Unfortunately, that wasn't the case. The GT640 kit produces instant power, as the GT28's spool FAST, but they are almost too peaky IMO, and they seem to fizzle out on the top end...at least mine did. Coming from the Stage 4, I actually felt like I lost power, which I wasn't expecting. I just wasn't happy with the GT640 - please keep in mind this has nothing to do with the kit being bad, I just didn't like the way the turbos delivered power...that's it!!
Just yesterday I received tuning from Todd @ Protomotive to go with the K24/18g's that were put on last week. BTW, Todd was great to work with - he answered all my questions and replied to emails VERY quickly...not to mention his software is excellent. Once the software was installed I took the car for a spin and was ECSTATIC!!! The car drove just like my Stage 4, except there was more power...just what I wanted. The power delivery is smooth and linear...not peaky like the GT640. I can't ask for more, as this is just what I've been looking for!!! I must admit that I was worried about lag going with a k24 based turbo, but I'm happy to report that the lag is hardly noticeable. Boost comes on around 3,000rpm, and by 4,000rpm I'm at 1.1 bar. The power is VERY STRONG and intoxicating.
These are just my observations about 3 different kits...nothing more, nothing less. I'm not bashing any tuners or individuals here...just giving my honest opinions. I want to thank Stephen @ Imagine Auto for all the great work on my car. They run a great shop and I would recommend them to anyone. I also want to thank Todd at Protomotive for building a great kit that I'm thrilled with!!!
Regards,
Adam
Well it seems that I can't stay away from modding the turbo... First it was an IA Stage 4 package, then GT640, now PE650...all in less than a year!!! I can now say that I'm done for a while because I'm thrilled with the PE650 package.
It started with the Stage 4 package, which was an AWESOME package. I had Stephen @ IA install it, and it was really a well put together package...I really liked it!! The car drove just like stock, except it had 50% more power...can't beat that. It consisted of k16/24 turbos, 1bar wastegates, DV's, boost hoses, headers, EP2Q exhaust, and a v-flow. It produced great power in the midrange and up top, and didn't have much lag at all...just a tiny bit more than k16's.
Being as happy as I was with the Stage 4 kit, I thought the next logical step was the GT640. Since I liked the power delivery of the k16/24's in the Stage 4, I assumed that the k16/GT28's in the GT640 kit would preform the same, just with more power throughout the rev range. Unfortunately, that wasn't the case. The GT640 kit produces instant power, as the GT28's spool FAST, but they are almost too peaky IMO, and they seem to fizzle out on the top end...at least mine did. Coming from the Stage 4, I actually felt like I lost power, which I wasn't expecting. I just wasn't happy with the GT640 - please keep in mind this has nothing to do with the kit being bad, I just didn't like the way the turbos delivered power...that's it!!
Just yesterday I received tuning from Todd @ Protomotive to go with the K24/18g's that were put on last week. BTW, Todd was great to work with - he answered all my questions and replied to emails VERY quickly...not to mention his software is excellent. Once the software was installed I took the car for a spin and was ECSTATIC!!! The car drove just like my Stage 4, except there was more power...just what I wanted. The power delivery is smooth and linear...not peaky like the GT640. I can't ask for more, as this is just what I've been looking for!!! I must admit that I was worried about lag going with a k24 based turbo, but I'm happy to report that the lag is hardly noticeable. Boost comes on around 3,000rpm, and by 4,000rpm I'm at 1.1 bar. The power is VERY STRONG and intoxicating.
These are just my observations about 3 different kits...nothing more, nothing less. I'm not bashing any tuners or individuals here...just giving my honest opinions. I want to thank Stephen @ Imagine Auto for all the great work on my car. They run a great shop and I would recommend them to anyone. I also want to thank Todd at Protomotive for building a great kit that I'm thrilled with!!!
Regards,
Adam
Great post and comparison. My car is currently running a mixed up set of parts and due to this has been providing reliability issues. I am now looking at a bolt on kit that will give me good progressive, yet brutal power and your post seems to indicate to me that the PE650 would be good.
I am wondering however why you did not decide to go with the PE700? Before pulling the trigger on any kit (I was initially just going to go with a Techart engine upgrade but have now decided to open my options to Protomotive as it is apparently bolt on), I would like feedback on the PE700 as well as I dont want to feel the need to upgrade again within the next year
From my reading it appears that the key change to the PE650 and PE700 is the fuel system? In that case I will need to take this into consideration as I am running bigger fuel lines etc already as part of my prior mods.
The concept of plug and play is extremely important for me as there are no good engine builders here in Singapore, I would need to just bring the parts to the Porsche AD and get them to install for me. That is why I had initially thought of the Techart kit- there is an agent for Techart here in Singapore.
Man, how I wish that this car had been built from one kit from the start... sigh.
Thanks for any feedback.
Last edited by Harold; 06-19-2008 at 09:26 PM.
#49
06-20-2008, 06:47 AM
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Quincy, IL
Posts: 937
Rep Power: 69 
Adam,
Great post and comparison. My car is currently running a mixed up set of parts and due to this has been providing reliability issues. I am now looking at a bolt on kit that will give me good progressive, yet brutal power and your post seems to indicate to me that the PE650 would be good.
I am wondering however why you did not decide to go with the PE700? Before pulling the trigger on any kit (I was initially just going to go with a Techart engine upgrade but have now decided to open my options to Protomotive as it is apparently bolt on), I would like feedback on the PE700 as well as I dont want to feel the need to upgrade again within the next year
From my reading it appears that the key change to the PE650 and PE700 is the fuel system? In that case I will need to take this into consideration as I am running bigger fuel lines etc already as part of my prior mods.
The concept of plug and play is extremely important for me as there are no good engine builders here in Singapore, I would need to just bring the parts to the Porsche AD and get them to install for me. That is why I had initially thought of the Techart kit- there is an agent for Techart here in Singapore.
Man, how I wish that this car had been built from one kit from the start... sigh.
Thanks for any feedback.
Great post and comparison. My car is currently running a mixed up set of parts and due to this has been providing reliability issues. I am now looking at a bolt on kit that will give me good progressive, yet brutal power and your post seems to indicate to me that the PE650 would be good.
I am wondering however why you did not decide to go with the PE700? Before pulling the trigger on any kit (I was initially just going to go with a Techart engine upgrade but have now decided to open my options to Protomotive as it is apparently bolt on), I would like feedback on the PE700 as well as I dont want to feel the need to upgrade again within the next year
From my reading it appears that the key change to the PE650 and PE700 is the fuel system? In that case I will need to take this into consideration as I am running bigger fuel lines etc already as part of my prior mods.
The concept of plug and play is extremely important for me as there are no good engine builders here in Singapore, I would need to just bring the parts to the Porsche AD and get them to install for me. That is why I had initially thought of the Techart kit- there is an agent for Techart here in Singapore.
Man, how I wish that this car had been built from one kit from the start... sigh.
Thanks for any feedback.
If you are looking for brutal power, look no further than PE650 or PE700. I went with the 650 kit because I didn't want to spend the extra $$ on the fuel system and intake system, which are the primary differences between the 650 and 700 kits.
When doing the 700 kit, the motor needs to be dropped to install fuel injectors and an upgraded fuel rail. None of this is required with the 650 kit, as it uses a 5bar FPR and stock injectors/pumps/rails, so it is more bolt-on than the 700.
Since you already have some of the components needed for either kit, the cost should be significantly less. The biggest $$ parts you would need are turbos, and software. Turbos could be installed at your Porsche dealer, and you could install the software via your laptop in about 15 minutes.
If you are interested in doing one of these kits, I would call or email Todd at Proto and have a chat with him. He is very knowledgeable on Porsche cars, and can guide you through any upgrade you want.
Good luck, bro! You can't go wrong with either kit.
#50
06-20-2008, 08:02 PM
Hi Harrold,
If you are looking for brutal power, look no further than PE650 or PE700. I went with the 650 kit because I didn't want to spend the extra $$ on the fuel system and intake system, which are the primary differences between the 650 and 700 kits.
When doing the 700 kit, the motor needs to be dropped to install fuel injectors and an upgraded fuel rail. None of this is required with the 650 kit, as it uses a 5bar FPR and stock injectors/pumps/rails, so it is more bolt-on than the 700.
Since you already have some of the components needed for either kit, the cost should be significantly less. The biggest $$ parts you would need are turbos, and software. Turbos could be installed at your Porsche dealer, and you could install the software via your laptop in about 15 minutes.
If you are interested in doing one of these kits, I would call or email Todd at Proto and have a chat with him. He is very knowledgeable on Porsche cars, and can guide you through any upgrade you want.
Good luck, bro! You can't go wrong with either kit.
If you are looking for brutal power, look no further than PE650 or PE700. I went with the 650 kit because I didn't want to spend the extra $$ on the fuel system and intake system, which are the primary differences between the 650 and 700 kits.
When doing the 700 kit, the motor needs to be dropped to install fuel injectors and an upgraded fuel rail. None of this is required with the 650 kit, as it uses a 5bar FPR and stock injectors/pumps/rails, so it is more bolt-on than the 700.
Since you already have some of the components needed for either kit, the cost should be significantly less. The biggest $$ parts you would need are turbos, and software. Turbos could be installed at your Porsche dealer, and you could install the software via your laptop in about 15 minutes.
If you are interested in doing one of these kits, I would call or email Todd at Proto and have a chat with him. He is very knowledgeable on Porsche cars, and can guide you through any upgrade you want.
Good luck, bro! You can't go wrong with either kit.
#51
06-20-2008, 08:30 PM
Adam,
Your comparison is beyond valuable to me and probably many others. Like Harold, my car is running a mix of parts and no matter what I try, it never seems to yield the additional results I'm looking for/expecting. Your description and experience with the various mods and power levels sheds a very clear light for me on what my next step is. I have already been in touch with Todd this week, and plan to move on the PE650 kit very soon.
Thanks a bunch!
Your comparison is beyond valuable to me and probably many others. Like Harold, my car is running a mix of parts and no matter what I try, it never seems to yield the additional results I'm looking for/expecting. Your description and experience with the various mods and power levels sheds a very clear light for me on what my next step is. I have already been in touch with Todd this week, and plan to move on the PE650 kit very soon.
Thanks a bunch!
#52
06-20-2008, 08:57 PM
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Quincy, IL
Posts: 937
Rep Power: 69 Adam,
Your comparison is beyond valuable to me and probably many others. Like Harold, my car is running a mix of parts and no matter what I try, it never seems to yield the additional results I'm looking for/expecting. Your description and experience with the various mods and power levels sheds a very clear light for me on what my next step is. I have already been in touch with Todd this week, and plan to move on the PE650 kit very soon.
Thanks a bunch!
Your comparison is beyond valuable to me and probably many others. Like Harold, my car is running a mix of parts and no matter what I try, it never seems to yield the additional results I'm looking for/expecting. Your description and experience with the various mods and power levels sheds a very clear light for me on what my next step is. I have already been in touch with Todd this week, and plan to move on the PE650 kit very soon.
Thanks a bunch!
Now that I've had this setup for about a month and have driven it quite a bit, I'm still very happy with it. It runs smooth and strong, and is still as refined as the day I bought it. I can run to the store in it, or take it on long trips, which says a lot about a modified vehicle with 650+ HP.
I have been doing more 60-130 runs as well, and have clocked a 6.96 second run with ms103. Even with the stock fuel system, my AFR's are mid to high 11's, so I don't feel like I'm running on the ragged edge.
#56
07-02-2008, 05:04 PM
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Quincy, IL
Posts: 937
Rep Power: 69
It's hard to say exactly since I had several of the parts beforehand. All I had to do was add turbos and software, but for someone starting out from scratch it would be different.
Member O-Ace has a basic PE650 package with turbos, software, 5bar FPR, boost controller, and exhaust...that's it!! His car runs extremely strong, so this kit is is cost effective while producing "mad power", as oak would say.
I have a few extras on my car...some of which produce extra power, and some for peace of mind. I would get in touch with Todd from Protomotive if you're interested in a similar setup...he'll get you squared away.
Member O-Ace has a basic PE650 package with turbos, software, 5bar FPR, boost controller, and exhaust...that's it!! His car runs extremely strong, so this kit is is cost effective while producing "mad power", as oak would say.
I have a few extras on my car...some of which produce extra power, and some for peace of mind. I would get in touch with Todd from Protomotive if you're interested in a similar setup...he'll get you squared away.
#57
07-02-2008, 11:44 PM
It's hard to say exactly since I had several of the parts beforehand. All I had to do was add turbos and software, but for someone starting out from scratch it would be different.
Member O-Ace has a basic PE650 package with turbos, software, 5bar FPR, boost controller, and exhaust...that's it!! His car runs extremely strong, so this kit is is cost effective while producing "mad power", as oak would say.
I have a few extras on my car...some of which produce extra power, and some for peace of mind. I would get in touch with Todd from Protomotive if you're interested in a similar setup...he'll get you squared away.
Member O-Ace has a basic PE650 package with turbos, software, 5bar FPR, boost controller, and exhaust...that's it!! His car runs extremely strong, so this kit is is cost effective while producing "mad power", as oak would say.
I have a few extras on my car...some of which produce extra power, and some for peace of mind. I would get in touch with Todd from Protomotive if you're interested in a similar setup...he'll get you squared away.
#58
07-03-2008, 01:52 AM
I ended up pruchasing the full PE700 from Todd with the K24/18s. Why would the K24/20s be more appropriate?
#59
07-03-2008, 01:57 AM
I purchased the full PE700 kit for consistency purposes (will let go of my entire IA kit even though there may be some duplication).
The full kit before shipping was approx USD20k. One more thing, Todd was incredibly responsive with ALL my queries, and that was a major thing for swinging the purchase of this set up from Todd... this is invaluable for me as I am living halfway around the world and need someone who can remote control my mechanics over here to get the car running.
The full kit before shipping was approx USD20k. One more thing, Todd was incredibly responsive with ALL my queries, and that was a major thing for swinging the purchase of this set up from Todd... this is invaluable for me as I am living halfway around the world and need someone who can remote control my mechanics over here to get the car running.
Last edited by Harold; 07-03-2008 at 02:00 AM.
#60
07-03-2008, 09:53 AM
The 650 kit will be dependent on turbos ie new out of the box or a setof 24's to start with. Mine ran about $6200 w/ turbos & wg's, tune, Greddy, 5bar. I did the install myself.
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