221.3 mph First shakedown pass of the day. TX mile EVOMS GTXXXX
#151
03-29-2009, 08:45 AM
Registered User
I spit coffee over that one, Sean... Good comeback!
Mike Kelly
#153
03-29-2009, 09:14 AM
all I can say Sean is sweeeeet on future trading,sorry you are stuck in the Jr. college teaching gig.
#154
03-29-2009, 09:39 AM
That's one of the MANY reasons why this car is faster. Remember, they never ran more than 28lbs this weekend. The car has more in it, but is far from maxed out. They also did that 231 pass, white knucke driving, floating around the track, with no belly pans in the bottom of the car because they lost them on Friday's first run. Rob's car was at 30lbs when they did his 1000whp dyno. Trust me, it's a lot more than the studs.
#155
03-29-2009, 09:41 AM
Ya, being surrounded by hot, dumb 19 year olds in a recession proof job that ends at 3 is torture.
Conversely, one of Paulies workers asked for a living wage and health care so Paulie headbutted him.
But back to Joe: Again, it seems to me, and admitedly my review of your build was brief, that the major diff between your car and Robs is the head studs.
I base my claim on this post from Joe on his build thred:
"
It seems the 80 lb claim I got was from the head torque capabilty (vs 50 for other cars).
Conversely, one of Paulies workers asked for a living wage and health care so Paulie headbutted him.
But back to Joe: Again, it seems to me, and admitedly my review of your build was brief, that the major diff between your car and Robs is the head studs.
I base my claim on this post from Joe on his build thred:
"Just wanted to give everyone an update on what is going on with this project.As some of you know already if you have read this thread we made 820 AWHP with the previous setup and we were tearing it down to install a custom grind set of intake and exhaust cams in an effort to make a little more power.As some of you guys already know modding is contagious,so while Evoms was developing the camshafts,Todd Zuccone and John Brey of Evoms went to work on develop a larger head stud to enable us to run more boost reliably.Now we were in for a lot more powerThese studs are the Holy Grail.After thorough testing (these studs were tested in just about every configuration and thread contour until the best combo was achieved)these studs have nearly double the clamping force of the stock studs.Just to give you guys an idea of the difference these studs have made, Evoms is able to now torque the heads to 80 lb ft as compared to 42-45 lb ft with the stock or A.R.P. studs with out any crankase distortion.This is serious.
Anyone thinking of doing a motor build needs these.Evoms feels there will be no problem running 30lbs of boost or more reliably!
It will probably see more in testing.Gone are the days of running 1.5 bar.
Anyone thinking of doing a motor build needs these.Evoms feels there will be no problem running 30lbs of boost or more reliably!It will probably see more in testing.Gone are the days of running 1.5 bar.Some other additions below are the GT3RS crank and intermediate shaft along with the bigger rods.We did this because of where this car is headed power wise and rpm wise.In order to compliment the addition of the new camshafts operating range we felt that this was a must in order to sleep at night.8000+rpm here we come!Everything has been balanced, machined,and prepped.It is in the assembly phase and we should have some good dyno numbers for you guys next week at this time.
Everything has been balanced, machined,and prepped.It is in the assembly phase and we should have some good dyno numbers for you guys next week at this time.I would just like to publically thank Todd Z ,John Brey and all the Evoms guys for all the effort they have put into my car trying to make it the baddest 996 turbo on the planet.
Attached Thumbnails
"
It seems the 80 lb claim I got was from the head torque capabilty (vs 50 for other cars).
#156
03-29-2009, 09:51 AM
Oh, I noticed that Joe has a custom grind cam to go w/ his variocam...Rob also had extensive customization to his cam so I am not sure if there is a difference. Again it seems that the evidence is pointing to the head studs.
We also do not know if Joes car is actually faster than Robs (which of course some confirmed Tx mile/60-130/1/4 mile data would help)...Rob?
Since we can only go by hard, verifiable evidence it seems that Joes verified performance sets the standard.
We also do not know if Joes car is actually faster than Robs (which of course some confirmed Tx mile/60-130/1/4 mile data would help)...Rob?
Since we can only go by hard, verifiable evidence it seems that Joes verified performance sets the standard.
#157
03-29-2009, 09:56 AM
I agree with you Sean. I really dont care about the numbers and I would never have posted any of my dynos graphs..but the peer pressure got to me. I think Joe cars has set some incredible standards and I AM VERY IMPRESSED!
Congrats to EVOMS and Joe!
Robert
Congrats to EVOMS and Joe!
Robert
#158
03-29-2009, 10:08 AM
I remember when we first started the SWDR XXX Project (Powells 996) there was a overall feeling on this board of a limit that had been reached. I'm happy now to be part of something like this, where the spirit of competition has raised the bar to exuberant new heights. Great Job to all you guys, and continued success through 2009.
_Zac
_Zac
#159
03-29-2009, 10:35 AM
Rob I believe what Sean is saying is that you can't compare your car to Joe's without the numbers to prove that comparison.
Having said that I think your car could really raise the bar in the competition I spoke of above, but breaking records requires making personal goals higher than the record it self. The more I read this forum the more I feel you have no goals for the performance of your car, and that's fine, but interjecting in all these performance threads saying you have accomplished what others have with no numbers to show for it is frustrating. Not frustrating because people don't believe you, but because you seemingly refuse to.
Again not trying to discredit Akram's ground breaking build of your car, but let her LOOSE MAN! His business of building these monsters will surely grow as your numbers continue to drop.
_Zac
Having said that I think your car could really raise the bar in the competition I spoke of above, but breaking records requires making personal goals higher than the record it self. The more I read this forum the more I feel you have no goals for the performance of your car, and that's fine, but interjecting in all these performance threads saying you have accomplished what others have with no numbers to show for it is frustrating. Not frustrating because people don't believe you, but because you seemingly refuse to.
Again not trying to discredit Akram's ground breaking build of your car, but let her LOOSE MAN! His business of building these monsters will surely grow as your numbers continue to drop.
_Zac
#161
03-29-2009, 10:59 AM
One difference that is obvious is joes car has demonstrated its ability. It seems hard to compare anything without real results
#162
03-29-2009, 11:00 AM
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Minneapolis, Mn
Age: 48
Posts: 16,073
Rep Power: 1069 
You can say that again. Street racing kills and dyno sheets dont mean sh*t.
#163
03-29-2009, 11:15 AM
First, there is much more to Joe's car than merely superior head studs. It is not my place to disclose the details, but his car has many tweaks, small and large, that contribute to its incredible performance. The head studs are the tip of the iceberg.
Second, Joe did not capitalize on the benefit of his superior head studs during his 231 mph run. He did that run at a similar, or not much higher, boost level than what other high HP 996TTs are running. Joe's head studs permit at least 3 lbs more boost (his high boost tune), and probably even more than that, but Joe and EVOMS elected to be conservative and run the car down the mile at reduced boost, thus not taking full advantage of the head studs.
Third, Joe is not using the GT3 cams that certain other high HP cars are using. Joe's cams are something special. Joe also retained the vario cam, whereas I think most other high HP 996TTs were not able to (or elected not to) retain the vario cam.
Fourth, one cannot compare Joe's objective performance numbers to someone's else's speculative performance based upon a random dyno pull. Joe put his car on the line. He risked failure. He produced objective performance data. Those who have only dyno pulls, but no objective numbers, have no business speculating or comparing their unproven car, and others should refrain from similar speculation. As the old adage goes, put up or shut up.
Fifth, Rob has not come on here comparing his car to Joe's car and, based on comment no. 4, above, others should refrain from said comparisons. Rob has elected not to submit his car to objective performance testing. That is his perogative. Therefoere, Rob has appropriately applauded Joe's objective performance numbers, without suggesting that his car is capable of similar performance. Others shoud follow Rob's lead in this regard.
Thats my 5 cents.
Craig
Second, Joe did not capitalize on the benefit of his superior head studs during his 231 mph run. He did that run at a similar, or not much higher, boost level than what other high HP 996TTs are running. Joe's head studs permit at least 3 lbs more boost (his high boost tune), and probably even more than that, but Joe and EVOMS elected to be conservative and run the car down the mile at reduced boost, thus not taking full advantage of the head studs.
Third, Joe is not using the GT3 cams that certain other high HP cars are using. Joe's cams are something special. Joe also retained the vario cam, whereas I think most other high HP 996TTs were not able to (or elected not to) retain the vario cam.
Fourth, one cannot compare Joe's objective performance numbers to someone's else's speculative performance based upon a random dyno pull. Joe put his car on the line. He risked failure. He produced objective performance data. Those who have only dyno pulls, but no objective numbers, have no business speculating or comparing their unproven car, and others should refrain from similar speculation. As the old adage goes, put up or shut up.
Fifth, Rob has not come on here comparing his car to Joe's car and, based on comment no. 4, above, others should refrain from said comparisons. Rob has elected not to submit his car to objective performance testing. That is his perogative. Therefoere, Rob has appropriately applauded Joe's objective performance numbers, without suggesting that his car is capable of similar performance. Others shoud follow Rob's lead in this regard.
Thats my 5 cents.
Craig
#164
03-29-2009, 11:20 AM
Craig,
You make some good points, and I agree that real world performance trumps dynoes....but the dynos seem to be very similar at the same boost levels.
However I must strongly disagree w/ your claim that we should refrain from comparisons since doing so would kill our fun and eviscerate this board from its raison d'etre
You make some good points, and I agree that real world performance trumps dynoes....but the dynos seem to be very similar at the same boost levels.
However I must strongly disagree w/ your claim that we should refrain from comparisons since doing so would kill our fun and eviscerate this board from its raison d'etre
#165
03-29-2009, 11:21 AM
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seattle WA
Age: 49
Posts: 3,778
Rep Power: 225 That dyno you are refering was last year and I think we were only able to push 26 or 28 pounds of boost, which resulted in overy 1000 HP. Since then we have add more boost, I think the most has been 31 pounds which is limited by my injector size. The motor is much stronger now then it was last year or the year before and just continues to evolve. It would be nice to compare what EVOMS has recently done to what Akram has accomplished two years ago. There is so much that Akram did to keep my heads from lifting under high boost and I think it would help our community out if we just sat down one day to share this information. Once again, congrats Joe!
You did make over 1000rwhp but not on a mustang and as of yet your car has NO objective data. Further, you would like to know all the details of others builds, but do not want to divulge the particulars of your build
