What Saint has and what Landjet has is a totally different set up and my post was to Landjet only, he runs Motons like my good self... I think he should take your advice though and not anything what I have to offer.
I take the advice from the owner of the company and I will continue to do so, it works well for me, infact Jean also passed on similar advice to me, look "JEAN" up, he has been passing on advice to a lot of track guys here for many years.
Anyway not getting into this, you are correct!!!

 

BTW... If anyone is looking for good solid advice on suspension etc do look up Jean's posts he has been here for many years and has a lot of experience to offer.

 

Depends on for what reason you need to adjust.

We can start on bumpiness:
- If you're running a curb or there are bumps on track or edges where the track has been patched with new tarmac, a too hard compression will "launch" you from that (very noticable front on Porsches - at rear a bit more compliant but you'll feel very hard hits coming through the seats even if the car may not feel like it launches). You can swallow some of that with softer compression - but if you have a good match of tire temps and compression and these short launches don't make your laptimes suffer don't change, instead...

...think about how quick you can make the tires "land on the ground' again. If too hard rebound, the wheels will fly with the car until the car lands because the shock won't release the wheel downwards. If softer, the tire will spring out quicker and regain control, steering, braking function, even before the actual car/body has settled down again.

Now, on an ideal smooth track (no bumps or flying on curbs):
Your spring and shock compression should work to run your tire at ideal temp. If you have too cool temps all the time, and you know you are running at the limit, it's common that the shocks are too hard (creates a "flat skid") for the tire and build some, but not full, tire temp. A tire that really works perfect with the suspension becomes hotter. If you are way too soft on compression, not very common though, you will also lack grip because the compression is not serving to push the tire into the ground hard enough, the car folds over and rolls a lot on entry etc. It a bit is more difficult to find out b/c it can be hidden by a very firm rebound. So best tell tale for ideal compression is you don't have excessive body roll at least, and to look at tire temps and lat G, given you are at the correct tire pressures and don't do a lot of wheel spin to skew the tire temp value.

Rebound, if too soft, will make the car feel out of control, "swimming" on the straights, unprecise steering, a lot of dive on braking and roll on entry, nose will go high on corner exit+accel. The good thing to run it soft, is it serves to keep tires on the ground as much as possible, but in S-turns can be very hard to control. Ususally a rule of thumb is to run as soft as you can without experiencing that the car is much of a handful / too too much body movement / too little body control. You can run harder rebound = less transition body movement on brake, entry, exit, accel on a flat nice track (better for aero and geometry) than on a bumpy track where you just have to keep tires on the ground to drive fast at all (perfect examples are Spa vs Nordschleife that Stevo mentioned in earlier post).

 

Ok cool you're clearing that up, we're just writing from differnt perspectives, me on the general side for anyone getting a coil-over kit and you more specified indication for settings for the Motons since you have good driving experience on those and are connected to their source of development.

All good on my side and again I want to tell you I wasn't out to go after you, just helping readers by serving up a way to work out "a blank canvas" on their own. Cheers

 

Very helpful, thanks again. That does make it clearer.

 

In my honest opinion, and take it for what it's worth! I think the information and personal experiences from everyone is GREAT, BUT... It is not practical for most of us track guy's to be going crazy with our suspensions, especially for different tracks and events we will attend from another (let's say a bumpy track and next weekend smoother) ... I think one must find a great solid setup that is compatible with the DRIVER, and then just use skill and experience to master what you have to work with, instead of constantly changing something, switching a setting, etc.. Just my advice, as most of the time if you can cope with what you are working with, it can make you become a better/smoother driver, if the setup isn't exactly "ideal" for the conditions you are driving in !

 

I absolutely agree. If you are a professional Racer and getting paid to win, have a full support crew and every last 100th of a second is important, then OK, work on every last setting on your suspension to get that last bit out of it .. But for track days and local PCA/NASA or similar racing events, find a sweet spot where you can rely on the Car to be consistently balanced and you can get a TON of seat time with that setup, I agree that you will end up getting more out of the Car. Familiarity with every aspect and nuance of the Car can pay huge dividends over time.

 

So, how's the HEED laddie?

 

Well, this might interest some of you to know……..

Finally had a chance to test my LSD diff (or as I call it now my Paper Weight) as per 996TT_Stevo suggestion. Because something was still bothering me about how the car handles and I couldn’t believe it was all to do with the suspension.

Thanks Mikymu for your very informative post, your symptoms are exactly what I am feeling. +1 Rep points to you.
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/gt3-gt2-gt/192286-lsd-buster.html

So I jacked one side up and tried to spin the wheel as directed and what do you know………….it spins freely, the wind could blow it, it’s that free.

So now I am left to think about my options.

Questions
1. Has anyone else had this problem?
2. What did you do?
3. What company do you recommend?
4. What Locking Ratio would you use?
5. Does anyone offer core exchange or only new?
6. If core exchange are they as good as new, any issues here?
7. Any other things I should know or consider?

Thanks

NB. I have posted this in both the ***NEW*** GT2 KW Competition 3 Way Suspension Installed to keep the information in this post going and also as a new thread so that I can get the input of others who are not following the KW post.

 

Yip... to get the best from your car you need to have that LSD working well ( YOU NEED TO HAVE A LSD ) .... but hey what do I know!!!

 

Stick with your stock diff and get the plates upgraded to the Cup Plates... plenty threads on it Loren... best guys to speak to are Matt at Guards or Erik at GBox... they can sell you Plates.

 

I'd also look in to the OS Giken diff. Have yet to hear about anyone being disappointed with one. And the results are pretty substantial (beating the AWD cars on wet track in the one lap of America on street tires in a GT2).

Erik can be a little bit abrasive in terms of his marketing approach, but the product seems to be getting the job done.

Can't go wrong with Guard either. However the down time will be significant shipping off for upgrades to stock diff.

 

YUP, I will be going with this setup soon as well!

 

Thanks Guys

 

I rode in a GT3 this past weekend fitted with KWV3's and KW's suggested spring rates and I can say their recommendation for a street/track car was AWEFUL. It had 1000 lbs rear and 300 lbs front. The front was so soft, it would bounce twice on the tires under load. Felt like the old Cadillac's in the front of the car. The whole chassis was twisting and contorting in the corners (and you could both see and feel it) because the back end was planted and solid while the front end was rolling all over the place. The fender liners were scorched in areas from the constant rubbing. The only reason the GT3 was not going steady oversteer was that the NT-01's on the car completely negated the low torque numbers of the GT3. Considering the GT3 is the lightest GT based 911 platform in a long time, I would assume that on heavier cars the result would be that much more exaggerated.

I will also add that I have another buddy who got KW V3's on his Supra and is not happy with the spring rates because they too are far too soft in the front. Both people will be changing front springs ASAP. I think KW assume that if you get V3's or suggest you will drive the car on the street occasionally, you do not intend to track them hard if at all so they suggest ride comfort spring rates which will not work well on the track, especially with R-compound tires.


HOWEVER, my impression of the KW's is that they are an excellent shock, the adjustments are a PITB to reach, but they work well and are predictable. Just know what you want before you buy and get the right spring rates. There is no coincidence that this is now three people including saint that are having problems with KW's suggested spring rates. These soft front spring rates are NOT the way to go unless you got the coilovers for ride height adjustment and street driving only. For the price, they are a steal as long as you can get proper spring rates.