E85 Tuning...
#47
01-02-2011 | 03:16 PM
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Kevin - I will be fighting this issue this week on the lambo build. I agree 100% - if you lose the start up manners and driveability what is the point. If it was a race car or a occasional driver - maybe. But if you plan to drive it like I do it has to behave properly. - Eric
That is why I am very interested in seeing your car. There have been a few Supra that were running on E85 a year ago but now they are no where to be found??? They claimed to make 4 digits to the rear tires but what happened to them?? I think Tommy Baun built a couple of them??
Happy New Years
Robert
#48
01-02-2011 | 06:34 PM
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Eric
That is why I am very interested in seeing your car. There have been a few Supra that were running on E85 a year ago but now they are no where to be found??? They claimed to make 4 digits to the rear tires but what happened to them?? I think Tommy Baun built a couple of them??
Happy New Years
Robert
That is why I am very interested in seeing your car. There have been a few Supra that were running on E85 a year ago but now they are no where to be found??? They claimed to make 4 digits to the rear tires but what happened to them?? I think Tommy Baun built a couple of them??
Happy New Years
Robert
#49
01-02-2011 | 07:07 PM
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My car although a 997TT is running perfectly on E85 with no cold start issues since Aug 2010.
I believe the cold start issue comes into play if the tuner does not have mastery over the tune i.e cold start tabels etc, my tuner does(Todd K/Protomotive).
In fact Todd K tune corrects the fuel level display and onboard mpg for E85.
The only mod my 997TT with the current setup needed was to upgrade to to 83lbs injectors as it comes with dual pumps from the factory.
Have driven over 5K on E85 and loving it. Race gas(MS 109) timing and boost @ $2.40/gallon.
Boost builds noticeably earlier(400 to 600 rpm earlier then on 93Oct) on E85.
I believe the cold start issue comes into play if the tuner does not have mastery over the tune i.e cold start tabels etc, my tuner does(Todd K/Protomotive).
In fact Todd K tune corrects the fuel level display and onboard mpg for E85.
The only mod my 997TT with the current setup needed was to upgrade to to 83lbs injectors as it comes with dual pumps from the factory.
Have driven over 5K on E85 and loving it. Race gas(MS 109) timing and boost @ $2.40/gallon.
Boost builds noticeably earlier(400 to 600 rpm earlier then on 93Oct) on E85.
Last edited by venkatreddytx; 01-02-2011 at 07:15 PM.
#51
01-02-2011 | 09:44 PM
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Eric
That is why I am very interested in seeing your car. There have been a few Supra that were running on E85 a year ago but now they are no where to be found??? They claimed to make 4 digits to the rear tires but what happened to them?? I think Tommy Baun built a couple of them??
Happy New Years
Robert
That is why I am very interested in seeing your car. There have been a few Supra that were running on E85 a year ago but now they are no where to be found??? They claimed to make 4 digits to the rear tires but what happened to them?? I think Tommy Baun built a couple of them??
Happy New Years
Robert
As far as Kevin's car goes - I don't know of another car with his power level that has tried to go E85 and still produce those big of numbers. I'm sure it can be done but it will take an upgraded fuel system and some serious tuning. I do not know if the stock ECM will be able to do what is needed to make it workable under Kevin's parameters.
#53
01-03-2011 | 09:59 AM
Kevin,
Some thoughts.. You need a higher capacity fuel system if you wish to hit 900+rwhp on E85, your injectors will need to be uprated as well...
Like Nick mentioned, fuel qualities often change around depending on when and where you get your fuel. One solution would be to run a true flex fuel system that would sense what the ethanol content is currently, then blend the maps to form the ideal tune. You could run on just one file and change boost but if your E content varies at all you could either go low on power or hurt the engine. This may or may not be an issue if you find a supply that is accurate year around.
As for cold-starts, the only time I ever saw an issue with it was a GTR running E99 @ 38*F. Just find a vacuum line a squirt some 93 in it if you have an issue..
Some thoughts.. You need a higher capacity fuel system if you wish to hit 900+rwhp on E85, your injectors will need to be uprated as well...
Like Nick mentioned, fuel qualities often change around depending on when and where you get your fuel. One solution would be to run a true flex fuel system that would sense what the ethanol content is currently, then blend the maps to form the ideal tune. You could run on just one file and change boost but if your E content varies at all you could either go low on power or hurt the engine. This may or may not be an issue if you find a supply that is accurate year around.
As for cold-starts, the only time I ever saw an issue with it was a GTR running E99 @ 38*F. Just find a vacuum line a squirt some 93 in it if you have an issue..
#54
01-03-2011 | 10:08 AM
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Kevin,
Some thoughts.. You need a higher capacity fuel system if you wish to hit 900+rwhp on E85, your injectors will need to be uprated as well...
Like Nick mentioned, fuel qualities often change around depending on when and where you get your fuel. One solution would be to run a true flex fuel system that would sense what the ethanol content is currently, then blend the maps to form the ideal tune. You could run on just one file and change boost but if your E content varies at all you could either go low on power or hurt the engine. This may or may not be an issue if you find a supply that is accurate year around.
As for cold-starts, the only time I ever saw an issue with it was a GTR running E99 @ 38*F. Just find a vacuum line a squirt some 93 in it if you have an issue..
Some thoughts.. You need a higher capacity fuel system if you wish to hit 900+rwhp on E85, your injectors will need to be uprated as well...
Like Nick mentioned, fuel qualities often change around depending on when and where you get your fuel. One solution would be to run a true flex fuel system that would sense what the ethanol content is currently, then blend the maps to form the ideal tune. You could run on just one file and change boost but if your E content varies at all you could either go low on power or hurt the engine. This may or may not be an issue if you find a supply that is accurate year around.
As for cold-starts, the only time I ever saw an issue with it was a GTR running E99 @ 38*F. Just find a vacuum line a squirt some 93 in it if you have an issue..
#56
01-03-2011 | 04:32 PM
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Kevin,
Some thoughts.. You need a higher capacity fuel system if you wish to hit 900+rwhp on E85, your injectors will need to be uprated as well...
Like Nick mentioned, fuel qualities often change around depending on when and where you get your fuel. One solution would be to run a true flex fuel system that would sense what the ethanol content is currently, then blend the maps to form the ideal tune. You could run on just one file and change boost but if your E content varies at all you could either go low on power or hurt the engine. This may or may not be an issue if you find a supply that is accurate year around.
As for cold-starts, the only time I ever saw an issue with it was a GTR running E99 @ 38*F. Just find a vacuum line a squirt some 93 in it if you have an issue..
Some thoughts.. You need a higher capacity fuel system if you wish to hit 900+rwhp on E85, your injectors will need to be uprated as well...
Like Nick mentioned, fuel qualities often change around depending on when and where you get your fuel. One solution would be to run a true flex fuel system that would sense what the ethanol content is currently, then blend the maps to form the ideal tune. You could run on just one file and change boost but if your E content varies at all you could either go low on power or hurt the engine. This may or may not be an issue if you find a supply that is accurate year around.
As for cold-starts, the only time I ever saw an issue with it was a GTR running E99 @ 38*F. Just find a vacuum line a squirt some 93 in it if you have an issue..
Robert
#57
01-03-2011 | 05:51 PM
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Chad, thanks for the input, but as you can imagine you are in another world, perhaps another galaxy and there is a slight chance it is another universe to me
. I appreciate the input, but I have spent much, upgraded more and am just trying to get an everyday fuel that will get me more power than 700 on 93. I really have spent as much as I care to spend on this car. A few more dollars on tuning and minor hardware is OK, but a wholesale re-do is out. Thank you.
Rob, happy New Year to you as well! Are you saying youy are having driveability issues now, or that the next injector upgrade will be an issue? I really like the fact my car idles pefectly,never stalls and is generally OK with cold starts. Not sure I want to give any of that up.
Mike, thanks. Let me get and umbrella while you rain on my parade!
JC, thanks for the input. I am not sure how I get to double the size injector for what has been said is a 30% upgrade in fuel, but that is why we ask questions
Thanks!
. I appreciate the input, but I have spent much, upgraded more and am just trying to get an everyday fuel that will get me more power than 700 on 93. I really have spent as much as I care to spend on this car. A few more dollars on tuning and minor hardware is OK, but a wholesale re-do is out. Thank you.Rob, happy New Year to you as well! Are you saying youy are having driveability issues now, or that the next injector upgrade will be an issue? I really like the fact my car idles pefectly,never stalls and is generally OK with cold starts. Not sure I want to give any of that up.
Mike, thanks. Let me get and umbrella while you rain on my parade!
JC, thanks for the input. I am not sure how I get to double the size injector for what has been said is a 30% upgrade in fuel, but that is why we ask questions
Thanks!
Judging by your input the Aquamist system injecting water only would get you the anti knock you desire for the the power you are running with pump gas. Chances are you would be able to retune and obtain even more power (if you so desired) on the 93.
The cost of install is also very reasonable.
Last edited by cjv; 01-03-2011 at 05:57 PM.
#58
01-03-2011 | 07:43 PM
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Kevin,
Judging by your input the Aquamist system injecting water only would get you the anti knock you desire for the the power you are running with pump gas. Chances are you would be able to retune and obtain even more power (if you so desired) on the 93.
The cost of install is also very reasonable.
Judging by your input the Aquamist system injecting water only would get you the anti knock you desire for the the power you are running with pump gas. Chances are you would be able to retune and obtain even more power (if you so desired) on the 93.
The cost of install is also very reasonable.
#59
01-03-2011 | 10:48 PM
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E85 has more costs than Kevin wants to entertain. Methanol is another product usually not available at the station. 93 octane and water is. 93 and water injection will give Kevin approximately the same detonation protection as 100 octane fuel. He can tune it for 100 octane performance and be basically care free with the added benefit of 100 octane performance at 93 octane cost.
I have no issue with methanol myself, however I'm sure you are aware methanol has a very destructive downside. Tuning a motor to run on high percentages of methanol is nice. Cut those high percentages of methanol by let's say 50% and detonation (or leaning your motor) will be your reward.
Last edited by cjv; 01-03-2011 at 10:59 PM.
#60
01-04-2011 | 08:19 AM
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Spoke to Kevin yesterday, had a discussion about E85. ( Kevin's fuel system is far from stock..Same system that 1200 hp cars are running from Evoms) We agreed that MAYBE his best bet is to tap out the current fuel system for a pump file (e85) & whatever it is-it is..he will be at least 800-850 on pump everyday.
He can keep the race file for C16 when needed..
but then again We re not tuners 
He can keep the race file for C16 when needed.. but then again We re not tuners