like I said ... no more.

 

not sure what that means, but if it is concerning psm, well, you may be a good enough driver not to need it, but most people are not. And I personally know of 3 996GT2's that were destroyed due to lack of psm(well, two for sure the third is pending in trial and not worth talking about).

You obviously know how to handle a car and your time at VIR is excellent, not sure what mods you have. I remember reading of a well modded 996 GT2 hitting 1:59 something which is excellent. But I can't remember what Mikelly or Tom K ran at VIR with the 996TT's.

But hey, you are correct it is all about opinions. I got a little sideways when you indicated that psm is stupid because it truly does save lives in these cars. sorry And just for the record, I hate psm.
When I disable it, there is no restrictions.

 

The PSM in the older cars, like 996TT is really intrusive, when you're driving at the track, even with it disabled, it still active at some level, you can clearly feel it breaking the car.
997.1 is a little better, but not by much. They got much better on the 997.2 cars, where if you're a really smooth driver, you can in some situations benefit from it.

When you say that the GT2s were destroyed by lack of PSM, I have the impression that they got destroyed by lack of good judgment and talent.

All good no offense taken.

 

Just pull the fuse out.

No more PSM on the track. Could do with an LSD though. Still waiting for one for the Tip box And you dont have abs either but never used to have ABS anyway on my rally car.

 

Just pull the precharge pump connector= No PSM whatsoever (no background/core PSM) but keeps full ABS.

The default brake bias on these cars if you just pull fuse is terrible with almost no rear brake force left in it. So if you just pull the fuse you can brake about 0.7G before front end lockup vs 1.2-1.4G if you leave it in.

Measured and tested and has been documented on the forum in other thread.

 

This psm on/off debate always makes me laugh. I just don't get it. Walter Rohrl was only 1 second quicker with it off on the ring. On the whole ring! So some true supermen on this forum. Some of you pulling the fuse out resulting in nearly zero rear brakes as Mr White correctly states. Bravo. It just shows how dimwitted some of you who do this really are.

 

yes, lack of good judgement is always the case. Lets face it, operator error is always involved. And it certainly was in two of the three cases. As for PSM, I have never thought that it was overly intrusive when it's turned off. I have to get pretty extreme before it can be felt when it's off. In inclement(very rainy and slippery) weather on performance tires I have had PSM keep me from loosing it.

 

Good to know, I was sure that's what I used to do. I know there was a fuse but it did not have that effect. I will look into which one. What I do know was that it permanently made the car have an ABS/PSM failure .I still had fully operating brakes but with no psm or abs and it used to stop on a 6 pence. However it didn't even work in the back ground if you really mess up.. which I have done from time to time.
So perhaps saying remove the ABS/PSM fuse was incorrect and I apologise for a misleading comment, I will try and remember which one I did remove. I'm sure in the back of my mind it was something that you would not normally associate with ABS/PSM. for eg steering angle sensor or something like that Might have been something to do with the Tip box
Thanks BTW, its been so long I might have done the wrong thing had I tried it again in the future However , I'm at that stage in life now where my PSM is practically glued on. I'm just not quick enough anymore to play arround.

 

My understanding is that the PSM is off until you hit the brakes. I have never felt it come on when it was switched off unless I was on the brakes. ...and I appreciated the assistance.

I live in canyon and you never know if there is water, gravel, sand, or an accident on the next corner. Even at sporting speeds I'll take PSM all day long under braking.

 

I don't think with psm off it ever comes back on fully. It turns off active stability mgmt and traction control and it never comes back on until you turn it on. The control people feel is yaw control which cannot be turned off. It is yaw control that intervenes when you brake hard. PSM off condition is very similar to what the newer 997gt2 comes with for it's PSM on. Not so intrusive, but very helpful. Hence why I think psm is a good thing. It's the psm off condition that helps a lot.

here are a few old threads explaining the yaw thing:

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...n-control.html

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...realy-off.html

 

I'm curious what happens when I push and hold the PSM button for 10-15 seconds. The PSM off light on the dash goes on initially and then goes off after I hold the button for 10-15 seconds. After you have done this, you can't turn the PSM back on until you turn the key off and back on.

What mode am I in at this time? Could this be a way to completely disable PSM?

Just curious,
Steve

 

Nice find Steve...curious about that myself now that you mention it. Hopefully a guru will chime in?

 

I have one of the only if not the only 996TT’s on the road in the world that is running a full Ohlins TTX suspension set up.

All I can say is it is BLEEPING FANTASTIC. People historically think race car like suspension is stiff and bone jarring; that could not be further from the truth. Those views of a rough ride come from people who use inferior components like PS9 and 10's with drop springs and expect performance. On cheaper components the internal valveing is not on par with a quality shock so higher spring rates are used to control bottoming with lowering springs; and then the shock cannot control rebound effectively.

Sure a cheaper set of shocks will do ok for many people but there is no comparing them to a high quality component. KW's and Motion's are better than a PS9 or 10 by a bunch I bet; and neither of those two are what the Ohlin’s set up is.

I am just so happy with the way my car feels now I just cannot describe it. Before the suspension upgrades the car was as mushy as a VW Passat and it wheel hopped like a kangaroo. It also bottomed out and rubbed almost everything under the car, in fact with the Vogland lowering springs on the car wheel contact destroyed the front wheel well liners and front lip spoiler in less than a month on crappy Canadian roads due to bottoming out and tire rubbing.
Now I will say the tire rubbing issues went away partly due to getting a set of adjustable trailing arms in the car and dog bones to match. But the suspension now controls it all perfectly. Since I have up graded the suspension I have not rubbed a single thing at any time. Think right proper race car built for the street. I have zero complaints with the ride even on rough Canadian roads.
What I will complain about is the creaking and groaning that comes from some component in the back that I have not had the time to track down. I think I know what it is and I think I will be able to get rid of it but who knows; sometimes you have to give stuff up to get.

Now do not get me wrong. This kind of set up is not for some people; but I thought the stock suspension on the 996 was so bad I would not have kept the car if I had to leave it stock. And now if I did not have my buttery smooth A6 family car I would not want to torture myself all the time with my highly modified 996, only 90% of the time.

 

Let's get a bit more detailed here.

Are you saying that the yaw control comes back on with PSM off and the brakes applied? IE there is no intervention whatsoever when there are no brakes being applied, but once you apply the brakes, the PSM system will intervene to straighten out he car.

If so we are saying the same thing as what I stated above has been been my real world experience. You can do big time donuts, drifts, etc... with zero intervention from the PSM when it is deactivated. Hit the brakes though, and the car will come into line in a hurry.

 

^
I Agree about the Ohlins, the race shop that I deal with at Miller showed me the new Ohlins, they looked awesome, I'm going that direction. He is a race engineer for a ALMS team and says nothing really can compare to the new Ohlins tech. They put them on a friends e92 m3 with great results after being very disappointed with his KWs. He has a connection with Ohlins and is getting me the same setup.