Engine case damage....But not a TT...
#1
12-09-2015, 04:45 PM
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal Canada
Age: 69
Posts: 2,806
Rep Power: 266 
Engine case damage....But not a TT...
Being a long time member of this forum I would like to ask specialist a question even if it is not TT related. I normally only work on 996TT but I'm trying to help a friend with his 1976 coupe (not bad looking at all but...). I took the engine out last Saturday for a heavy oil leak that seems to come from the oil thermostat and some other littles issues...We have a lobe damage on the case (see pic) and would like to know what you think about it, can it be rebuild by a good welder, can we live with it....I remember when I got my coolant pipes welded it was difficult due to impurities in the casting.....The second picture is only to show you one of many issues I am struggling with :roll eyes: There are many marrets especially behind the cluster.....
#3
12-09-2015, 04:57 PM
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal Canada
Age: 69
Posts: 2,806
Rep Power: 266 Just went on Pelican engine rebuilding forum and it seems to be magnesium ????
#5
12-09-2015, 05:48 PM
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal Canada
Age: 69
Posts: 2,806
Rep Power: 266 
#6
12-09-2015, 06:04 PM
Guys at Unobtanium are indeed awesome. Honestly if it cat be welded I'd find an aluminum tube and epoxy it in?
From a quick google search it looks like magnesium transfer cases get welded but that it's a specialized process. An industrial welder or someone skilled like the guys at Unobtanium could likely do it. If the distance is too far perhaps he knows someone, he is pretty active in the Weld P0rn forum type places and probably knows who's good. He's a good guy IMO and was very helpful when my exhaust was being done.
From a quick google search it looks like magnesium transfer cases get welded but that it's a specialized process. An industrial welder or someone skilled like the guys at Unobtanium could likely do it. If the distance is too far perhaps he knows someone, he is pretty active in the Weld P0rn forum type places and probably knows who's good. He's a good guy IMO and was very helpful when my exhaust was being done.
#7
12-09-2015, 06:19 PM
No worries JP!
just trying to return favours
Mag case isn't the end of the world, but is generally more problematic then the alu cases
If the case isn't numbers matching, and a lot ended up not being due to replacement early-on in life as well as general replacements over the years, I'd consider replacing with a fresher case.
Cheers,
Rob
just trying to return favours
Mag case isn't the end of the world, but is generally more problematic then the alu cases
If the case isn't numbers matching, and a lot ended up not being due to replacement early-on in life as well as general replacements over the years, I'd consider replacing with a fresher case.
Cheers,
Rob
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#8
12-09-2015, 06:23 PM
Very good point, perhaps find another motor and take your time rebuilding this one if funds allow - it's a beautiful car! Figure out the numbers first and go from there, that damage doesn't look like the end of the world.
#9
12-09-2015, 06:27 PM
That's not horrible jp. One option would be to make sure there are no stress concentrations by smothing with a micro file. Make new washers out of .10 inch thick sst with a bigger od and use a flange nut.
#10
12-09-2015, 07:03 PM
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal Canada
Age: 69
Posts: 2,806
Rep Power: 266
Of course Pat solution is the cheapest and easiest way to go for now and we will see other possibilities after the result of this quick fix.... Thanks for all the suggestions guys! I just found Unobtainium Welding in Langdon, Alberta...Interesting and beautiful work!!!
#11
12-09-2015, 08:24 PM
With a little extra support it would probably last until the car falls apart, I would prefer it was repaired correctly tho. Side note I have welded a cast iron block that was leaking oil and it held= totally different but interesting.
#13
12-10-2015, 01:06 AM
Hi JP,
As you've discovered, this should be a mag case. The only production 911s with aluminum cases in 1976 were turbos and Carrera 3.0s. Being a late mag case, the engine number should end in 7R. Then again, unless it is a Carrera 3.0 the body on a 1976 911 should be narrow - and this one has Carrera/SC flares in the back. If major work was done, the engine could have been swapped too. Maybe it is a later 3.0L.
I have seen welded mag cases, but unless your welder is 150% sure of the results he can provide, I would probably tend to the washer solution similar to what Pat suggested. The flange is quite large and despite the fact that you are directly below the oil pump, you should be able to get enough clamping force to keep things dry. Better an external solution than a warped case...
Please post results!
As you've discovered, this should be a mag case. The only production 911s with aluminum cases in 1976 were turbos and Carrera 3.0s. Being a late mag case, the engine number should end in 7R. Then again, unless it is a Carrera 3.0 the body on a 1976 911 should be narrow - and this one has Carrera/SC flares in the back. If major work was done, the engine could have been swapped too. Maybe it is a later 3.0L.
I have seen welded mag cases, but unless your welder is 150% sure of the results he can provide, I would probably tend to the washer solution similar to what Pat suggested. The flange is quite large and despite the fact that you are directly below the oil pump, you should be able to get enough clamping force to keep things dry. Better an external solution than a warped case...
Please post results!
Last edited by stevemfr; 12-10-2015 at 01:11 AM.
#14
12-10-2015, 05:33 AM
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal Canada
Age: 69
Posts: 2,806
Rep Power: 266 Hi JP,
As you've discovered, this should be a mag case. The only production 911s with aluminum cases in 1976 were turbos and Carrera 3.0s. Being a late mag case, the engine number should end in 7R. Then again, unless it is a Carrera 3.0 the body on a 1976 911 should be narrow - and this one has Carrera/SC flares in the back. If major work was done, the engine could have been swapped too. Maybe it is a later 3.0L.
I have seen welded mag cases, but unless your welder is 150% sure of the results he can provide, I would probably tend to the washer solution similar to what Pat suggested. The flange is quite large and despite the fact that you are directly below the oil pump, you should be able to get enough clamping force to keep things dry. Better an external solution than a warped case...
Please post results!
As you've discovered, this should be a mag case. The only production 911s with aluminum cases in 1976 were turbos and Carrera 3.0s. Being a late mag case, the engine number should end in 7R. Then again, unless it is a Carrera 3.0 the body on a 1976 911 should be narrow - and this one has Carrera/SC flares in the back. If major work was done, the engine could have been swapped too. Maybe it is a later 3.0L.
I have seen welded mag cases, but unless your welder is 150% sure of the results he can provide, I would probably tend to the washer solution similar to what Pat suggested. The flange is quite large and despite the fact that you are directly below the oil pump, you should be able to get enough clamping force to keep things dry. Better an external solution than a warped case...
Please post results!
I'm back on the school bench
Need to learn a lot about these older cars! Thanks for these valuable informations, I will start my research next time I work on this car and keep you inform!
#15
12-10-2015, 05:51 AM
That can be repaired via welding no problem. If you want it done right send it to a machine shop that specializes in air cooled VW cases. All factory air cooled VW cases are mag based and have been getting welding repairs/upgrades for decades.
Even a decent shop/welder that does mag should be able to weld that without warping it. With the case bolted securely to a flat surface(like a thick stainless plate) and a stainless bolt in that location you can weld-build that site without any issue. I have not done that exact job on a VW case but have done similar (meaning where warping the case on the split line would be bad news).
Even a decent shop/welder that does mag should be able to weld that without warping it. With the case bolted securely to a flat surface(like a thick stainless plate) and a stainless bolt in that location you can weld-build that site without any issue. I have not done that exact job on a VW case but have done similar (meaning where warping the case on the split line would be bad news).
Last edited by mxracer; 12-10-2015 at 09:47 AM.