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what is the HP/boost limitations of the stock block? I would imagine a pair of hybrid k16s can meet that. unless the OP is building the block, does it make sense to go with anything larger than a k16hybrid?
Safe limit of the stock rods is 600wlb. Want guys running high hp stock motors do is torque limit tuning. Keep boost low around 3500 rpm where peak torque is around and hit that 600wlb mark, them keep increase boost to redline and keep basically a flat torque curve all the way through. The boost limit though is really dictated my the fuel you're using. On pump, you will start hitting the knock limit before the end potential of the turbos hp in the high rpm range. With race gas or e85, you can keep raising it within reason to redline to keep adding hp.
On my car we are rolling in 12-13 psi a peak torque and running up to 25psi at redline on e85.
As for going larger, a k24 hybrid is a solid choice to over the k16, especially if you're on track mainly because you can maintain lower egts over the long period of a session. It's up to needs and goals. If you want faster reacting turbo with a sacrifice in some higher egts and less overall end potential with a built motor, a k16 hybrid will be all you need. Also if you are limited to pump gas only, you'll need a larger turbo to continue making power due to knock limits
Proven and potential are two different things. It has not been proven at all. Will wait and see.
There are 2 dyno results posted here with 20g size turbos making over 750whp at 25psi. That is proven right there. The potential to hit 900whp is there but not proven yes.
Safe limit of the stock rods is 600wlb. Want guys running high hp stock motors do is torque limit tuning. Keep boost low around 3500 rpm where peak torque is around and hit that 600wlb mark, them keep increase boost to redline and keep basically a flat torque curve all the way through. The boost limit though is really dictated my the fuel you're using. On pump, you will start hitting the knock limit before the end potential of the turbos hp in the high rpm range. With race gas or e85, you can keep raising it within reason to redline to keep adding hp.
On my car we are rolling in 12-13 psi a peak torque and running up to 25psi at redline on e85.
As for going larger, a k24 hybrid is a solid choice to over the k16, especially if you're on track mainly because you can maintain lower egts over the long period of a session. It's up to needs and goals. If you want faster reacting turbo with a sacrifice in some higher egts and less overall end potential with a built motor, a k16 hybrid will be all you need. Also if you are limited to pump gas only, you'll need a larger turbo to continue making power due to knock limits
To correct things regarding my car lol...
Hybrid K24 based turbos. These are 7+ years old and I'm having a hard time recalling the shop that built them. There's a post here of near 650rwhp prior to my owning it at above 1.2bar and likely race gas with the stock DME and a tune. I have since swapped intercoolers, Y-pipe, throttlebody, plenum, exhaust, fuel system, and the car had maxspeed headers on it already too. I make around 640rwhp on 93 with a safe tune, around 730rwhp on E85. My tune is indeed gimped to save both rods and transmission. The backpressure rati on my turbos was fairly high which limited total boost but I was okay not trying to squeeze any more out of it. Garth can give more details on the tune itself and what he did to limit things but I don't think we were going to get more top end boost out of it safely - intercoolers kept it cool.
You probably have the cast 18g wheel in there rated at 40lb min. The blouch billet or the other 68mm billet should be able to supply 800 to the wheels. A larger turbo like the SRM 71 hybrid should be able to close in on 900 wheel I imagine. I don't think anyone has done this because when guys build their motors they usually move up from a hybrid based turbo.
You probably have the cast 18g wheel in there rated at 40lb min. The blouch billet or the other 68mm billet should be able to supply 800 to the wheels. A larger turbo like the SRM 71 hybrid should be able to close in on 900 wheel I imagine. I don't think anyone has done this because when guys build their motors they usually move up from a hybrid based turbo.
See this is an interesting question compressor wise which will actually flow the most. The srm with the k24 hot side will increase the ability of the turbo up tip but as for straight comp wheel they are close but different.
Srm is a 50/71mm extended tip (don't know the tip size)
Hta68 is a 51.2/68mm extended tip (again don't know the tip size)
My billet 20g wheel is 52.5/68/73.2mm extended tip.
I would say they all flow very close though. The turbine side though will eventually control the total max hp though as yu have to be able to flow enough out of the hot side to be efficient at very high comp flow rates.
I do asked some tuners over here and they all do not clip the turbine wheel on a k16 hybrid. So the spool will be same but the punsh will be bigger.
I do need to control the torque at low revs via software for sure. I was told that fast and small spooling turbos can bend rods easily.
Ok I wanted to add some results from garth on a car from yesterday (I should have my dyno results today as well). This was a k24/billet 20g car though.
Ok this car was k24/20g, e75, proefi 112......stock motor, stock intercoolers, stock y pipe, stock clutch, filters on turbos.
Top was 22 psi on e75. The 600whp was 93 at 18 psi.
Ok I wanted to add some results from garth on a car from yesterday (I should have my dyno results today as well). This was a k24/billet 20g car though.
Ok this car was k24/20g, e75, proefi 112......stock motor, stock intercoolers, stock y pipe, stock clutch, filters on turbos.
Top was 22 psi on e75. The 600whp was 93 at 18 psi.
Badass results on Chris' car, great to see my old turbos see new life on this build. My 6062 results should be in soon
You were saying the turbos themselves were not capable of producing that. I completely understand that it's different running 2 on a 911 than a single on an evo.
As for the pineapple express again, not even close to maxing the turbos. Running 26 psi is not maxing out the turbos. They can flow much more pushing 30+psi on a motor with rods and head studs.
Again in due time I will hit that mark. Most likely going to build my motor this winter and will push them to the max after.
Also ball bearing turbos means nothing to hp. amount, only in spool. Wheel flow and turbine and compressor housing ar size controls flow amounts.
I'm just catching wind of this thread...the turbos for sure had more in them. I made 775RWHP (E85) on a DJ, yes its not a Mustang. Dyno numbers always get blown out of proportion, it should be a personal measure for gain. It is not the best comparator of say my car in NJ and someone else in another part of the country.
The original plan for build V3 was just build the motor and crank them up. I was only going to upgrade from Garth's K24/20s if I got good money for the setup. While my car was down, a friend decided to take the plunge as well (Chris' grey car you see above) so I made him a deal on the turbos and upgraded to 6062s
07-25-2016 | 01:09 PM
Amazing numbers from some of these hybrids.