Detecting Aftermarket Chips w/ PIWIS?
#1
Detecting Aftermarket Chips w/ PIWIS?
I am told the new PIWIS scanner can detect aftermarket chips pretty easily, including GIAC, REVO, etc... Seems PCA is going to start scanning as part of tech inspection at club racing events (starting at Daytona next week). I'm all for stopping cheating but I really can't swallow that the system can actually detect the program without running a check sum or doing a raw data dump to compare against all known possible OE files. Very time consuming...And with the encryption used, it isn't even reliable....
Can some of you more experienced with the PIWIS comment on this possibility.....
thanks
dave w
Can some of you more experienced with the PIWIS comment on this possibility.....
thanks
dave w
#2
Originally Posted by DAVE W
I am told the new PIWIS scanner can detect aftermarket chips pretty easily, including GIAC, REVO, etc... Seems PCA is going to start scanning as part of tech inspection at club racing events (starting at Daytona next week). I'm all for stopping cheating but I really can't swallow that the system can actually detect the program without running a check sum or doing a raw data dump to compare against all known possible OE files. Very time consuming...And with the encryption used, it isn't even reliable....
Can some of you more experienced with the PIWIS comment on this possibility.....
thanks
dave w
Can some of you more experienced with the PIWIS comment on this possibility.....
thanks
dave w
Neil
#3
The DME also records whether and how often programs are loaded onto the ECU. So the whole flashloader thing becomes irrelevant.
The ONLY way around this is to reprogram the ECU and keep a "Zero" count on all "unathorized" ECU transfer.
The 997TT is far from unmoddable - it just helps a bunch when you have access to the security code! and dont have to "hack " things. Porsche has many layers of security. the common failing in the obd programs is that they often change part of the program, but leave the main program there.
This is why an OBD-flashed program is never really "on your ECU". When you lose power or even when a dealer snoops around, its possible to "erase" the program. The ONLY way to ensure you have a permanent program is to erase the ROM and replace the data with a new program. This "firmware update" requires compliance with Porsche security routines and codes. It also means that you cant use a single program for all cars - as they all have subtle differences.
For example, the engine code and VIN# are interspersed throught the whole encrypted ECU. Pretty sneaky eh?
The ONLY way around this is to reprogram the ECU and keep a "Zero" count on all "unathorized" ECU transfer.
The 997TT is far from unmoddable - it just helps a bunch when you have access to the security code! and dont have to "hack " things. Porsche has many layers of security. the common failing in the obd programs is that they often change part of the program, but leave the main program there.
This is why an OBD-flashed program is never really "on your ECU". When you lose power or even when a dealer snoops around, its possible to "erase" the program. The ONLY way to ensure you have a permanent program is to erase the ROM and replace the data with a new program. This "firmware update" requires compliance with Porsche security routines and codes. It also means that you cant use a single program for all cars - as they all have subtle differences.
For example, the engine code and VIN# are interspersed throught the whole encrypted ECU. Pretty sneaky eh?
#4
Hey guys, what if I buy another ecu... tune it and swap back to the original when going in for service?
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2001 996TT 3.6L and stock ECU
9.66 seconds @ 147.76 mph 1/4 mile click to view
160 mph @ 9.77 seconds in 1/4 mile click to view
50% OFF ON PORSCHE ECU TUNING BLACK FRIDAY SPECIAL
2001 996TT 3.6L and stock ECU
9.66 seconds @ 147.76 mph 1/4 mile click to view
160 mph @ 9.77 seconds in 1/4 mile click to view
50% OFF ON PORSCHE ECU TUNING BLACK FRIDAY SPECIAL
#5
So neil says no, but kevin says yes... ???
what I;m really looking for is tech info on exactly what the PIWIS can see and not see in this regard. Those of you that say it see the tuner code, I'd like to know what screen and what data. I mean its just a scan tool that reads data, so it displays whatever the program in the ecu tells it to display. Certainly the tuners know this and tell it to display factory info. SO short of reading the file off the ecu and comparing it to all OE files, what else can be read. I also do not believe it counts ROM flashes...can you point me to the screen in the PIWIS that does this??
dw
what I;m really looking for is tech info on exactly what the PIWIS can see and not see in this regard. Those of you that say it see the tuner code, I'd like to know what screen and what data. I mean its just a scan tool that reads data, so it displays whatever the program in the ecu tells it to display. Certainly the tuners know this and tell it to display factory info. SO short of reading the file off the ecu and comparing it to all OE files, what else can be read. I also do not believe it counts ROM flashes...can you point me to the screen in the PIWIS that does this??
dw
#6
Originally Posted by DAVE W
So neil says no, but kevin says yes... ???
dw
dw
#7
I didn't realize that GIAC was "multiplier" code as you call it. This would suggest that it retains the OE maps but then tells the ecu to edit its output based upon some algorthim and values stored in a seperate table. I thought it used OE code, that was modified with tuned values but stored in empty space on the ROM and the ECU was redirected to read these values instead of the OE maps.
Either way I am still not comfortable with comments that PIWIS can easily detect the program. Not if its written well...and to display stock data when accessed by a scanner.
dw
Either way I am still not comfortable with comments that PIWIS can easily detect the program. Not if its written well...and to display stock data when accessed by a scanner.
dw
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#14
Originally Posted by Kevin
"I" have software tools/editors that "I" use to modify the Motronic 7.8 code structure.
I now have a programmer that allows me to reload the stock program, put a valet program in or a big hp/torque increase program.
Cheers,
Mark
#15
I guess who cares who writes it...if it gets you want you want? Anyway, I have it also and Kevin is absolutely great at supporting his product. I'm about to upgrade my wastegates/DVs and intake and of course Kevin will modify the programmer to suit. You won't be disappointed.