ah, that probably explains it....

 

Before this thread dies can we get definitive answers on:

1) If you're in Dallas, TX can you go locally and get the Upsolute Flash done?
2) Were the earlier glitches with the CEL light coming on fixed?
3) Was 'Esemes' 94hp increase with or without an aftermarket exhaust?

For someone like myself that has never really modded a car other than suspension, it seems that this is an inexpensive, simple upgrade. I REALLY don't see myself going too far down the mod path as I will only be keeping the car another couple of years maybe.

 

I have upsolute on my 996tt, they have a money back program, no lights no problems. The problem here is we are all P car owners and the chip manufactures know we can afford to pay more for the same crap they sell on vw audi, bmw etc... upsolute just does it cheaper,

i have a friend that bought a giac for his jetta for 400 bucks, but im supposed to pay 2gs, NO THX. I drive a p car because im knowledgable enough to not get raped. not saying giac is a bad choice, but please everyone dont bash others products, that members may have on their cars (kiko) its immature, and i'd assume we are all gents here on this forum.

BTW for whoever asked the question, upsolute has been good to me, i agree for major mods its not the ideal choice. but bang for the buck, go upsolute, and buy the exhaust.... for the cost of a giac alone, then ask anyone on here with dollar for dollar mod to hit the track against you. the proof is in the pudding. cheers.

the subject is so old.

 

With all due respect Sir, you don't have a clue on what you're saying. This is probably a bad welcome post for a newcomer but when it comes to tuning most of times you get what you pay for.

How do you think Giac, and others came up with price then? By flipping coins and guessing how much a Porsche owner would be willing pay? Com' on!
The price, like in most software's is determined on how many man-hours, dyno-hours, fuel and other expenses ware spent to develop it split by the number of copies they estimate to sell. For Upsolute to provide software at that price they would need be doing one of two things, piracy (this is clearly not the case otherwise they wouldn't have CEL lights problem...) or they could just be tipped on how to get into the Porsche software, find the maps they need in the middle of the incrypted 2700maps and sit in front of a computer screen for a couple of hours and increase X% of fuel, boost and timing, then find someone who's willing to provide a beta tester to check for code's, AFR's and power. What about EGT's (specially worrying when they're squeezing 90bhp hence the CEL lights in cold weather)? What about throttle position maps? What about heatsoaking???Etc, Etc.

If they did any considerable long term testing themselves they would never release products with CEL light issues in the first place. You can probably get away with this in the US for 1/4 miles bursts but in Europe (with continued WOT runs in the Autobahn) the only thing bursting would be the power (heatsoaking and the timing retard), the cats (sky high EGT's), the turbos (overreving and high EGT's) and so on.

By stating that Upsolute is the only company who doesn't rape their clients you're assuming that people like Giac/Evoms, RUF, FVD, Manthey, RS Tuning, Protomotive, etc. which spend hundreds of R&D hours to develop a complete package are rapists! Thats quite a statment! Ever thought that all others might not be raping their clients but just providing a service for the fair price?

Now, use the search function and send some PM's to some of the (many) knowlegeable people in this forum and learn more about your car and the money and interests involved in the Porsche tuning industry.

 

I often like to stay out of these threads for the obvious reasons, I am not a person that bashes other products. Why? Well some are better than others, all have their plus and minus and in the end that doesn't mean that name calling nor trashing company or pointing out all of their errors helps anyone.



So that being said my purpose for popping in here is to address the " I am a Porsche owner and I am getting screwed" This simply is not the case. Kiko has done a wonderful job of pointing out some of the differences. Not to mention the other things we do specifically to tune Porsches verses say a Audi or VW.



We had to buy a specific dyno. Not many will work on the Porsche AWD systems. My dyno....about 100K. Audi's can run on other dynos that are less than half that cost for testing.



Software...Vag-com for VAG cars is 100-200.00. The first computer I had to buy was the PST2 which was 8K used. Now, the new cars will not even read with the PST2 so I had to buy a PIWIS that was 18K.



We had to buy a harness to bench the Porsches because you can not buy just the plugs. Cost....6K. The VAG parts, 20.00.



These are just the tip of the cost it takes to do what we do. In the end how many Porsches are flashed compared to VAG cars? Maybe a 1/4 if we are lucky. So at the end of the day the hundreds of hours spent to tune, the thousands of dollars in equipment all equal a higher price since there are a lower volume of cars to flash.



VAG cars are easy to justify the 400.00. When you are doing that many more, developmental cost are that less of course you will have a 400-600 flash compared to the Porsche stuff.



You are not being singled out because you have a Porsche...If you were I would put it in my car either. I would use the best I could buy for my dollar...

Sorry for the typos if there are any...I am doing this on my damn phone!!

 

I am sure there is a reason a manufacturer makes a 15k exhaust for the 996tt. I do not know why or who spends that kind of money on something like that. Unless you have a oil well or a money tree. I have neither

My point is different price points for different people and budgets. I could afford to do alot of the things I don't do. Like the upsolute chip, I just cannot justify spending 2k more for a tune. It's just a can tune not even a custom dyno tune. ANyhow for my needs a little boost is all I want. If I go crazy then I will have to lay down the money for a more customized tune. Till then I will keep my 2k for hookers and drugs.

 

go for the cheapest thing for the expensive car, sounds right..

 

ROFL! So that's why you want Wilwood brakes!

 

Very well said...BTW any group buys on the hookers & drugs?

 

DO not say so, people can beleiv you..

 

I think that the bottom line of this thread is how to get the most performance out of your car while keeping cash expenditures in check.

What my personal experience has been, not theory, is that there are tons of great tuners out there including Promotive (just ask Tyson about the shootout), GIAC, Upsolute and many others.

That being said, for me the best mods I have done for performance have been PSS-9 suspension nicely set up by Arling at Lucent as well as his excellent work on my Europipe stage II loud exhaust.

I can still take the car up to a 150 or more km or mph? i get the 2 confused in a straight line and i've not been outrun by anyone yet...

My point is that horsepower is totally cool and i've been in a lot of cars that have much more than mine. BTW, the CEL and ABS issues with Upsolute were early issues that people seemed to complain about approx 2 yrs ago and if memory serves, they have been corrected.

My best times behind the wheel over the last 3 years have been with the twisties where propper shifting and handling are more important. Thus, I favor handling and exhaust upgrades.

At the end of the day, it really depends on how far you want to go with your car's horsepower and clearly Upsolute stops at stage 1/2 where GIAC and Promotive and others stop, well do they stop???

hope this helps.

 

It's not only how far you want to go with mods, its also how far you want to go in quality! You're missing the point.

If you bought an Europipe, you know what I mean! You could have bought other exhausts for 1/2 the price!

I don't like bashing but I HATE when people try to make other tuners look like scammers and claim that Upsolute and Giac are the same. THEY ARE NOT for the reason I explained on my previous post.

Personally I paid $4000 for a remap from RS Tuning so I must be not only immature as a fellow 6speeder suggested (maxxr1) but also a fool since I could have bought an Upsolute for peanuts.

Gentlemen, thats it for me.

 

This reminds me why exactly are we paying so much more for the PSS9 suspension than ones for other cars? It should be exactly identical to something say from an E46 except for the mounting points. We're getting charged about 40% more for the same suspension as other car owners.

Sorry guys but in my opinion Porsche owners are getting ripped off simply because we can afford it. Yes there are higher R&D costs involved with a Porsche but not to the extent we are getting charged.

Face it an ECU flash is just that a flash it takes an hour tops and it doesn't cost the developer anything to flash another vehicle. The only costs are the upfront R&D costs and thats pretty much it. I figure by the time he sells 20 ECU upgrades he has broken even, after that its all gravy. Does Upsolute take shortcuts? Maybe but its still good value for money.

Take a look at the body kit upgrades people are charging for on this board, simple fibreglass stuff is going for the thousands when it should costs hundreds.

 

Hehe ok What else do you have done to that GT2 of yours (heh I know it's "stock").

 

Gentleman

Dont kid yourself when it comes to software tuning you pay for what you get............ GIAC has been the leader in Porsche Performance software since day 1.... The results speak for themselves....... Just look around..

Speaking from personal experiance we have the GIAC software on our GT2 and absolutely love the performance.. The power-driveability - throttle response are all drastically improved...This is the same ( GIAC software and GMGWCGT exhaust, completely stock engine with stock turbo's and even ran a stock airfilter) set up we ran on our GT2 in the Eurotuner Superstreet Time Attack Finale at Buttonwillow last month and were well over 3 seconds faster than any other car in our class and the 6th fastest car over all. Not to mention the GT2 is a street car and not a stripped out race car.