by interceptor-style tuning, do you mean your computer will fake the inputs into the ECU?

- chuck

 

Shiv (or Johnny if you would prefer):

This is the second time that you have enigmatically referenced an undisclosed phantom menace that is purportedly seeking to impede your ascent to the Porsche tuning throne. Please reveal the identity of this depraved and repugnant individual/company, and describe the villainous conduct you cryptically refer to as “questionable means [designed] to diffuse [your] entry into this market.� Absent factual support for your accusations of wrongdoing, one might opine that you are feigning an adversarial conspiracy against you for self-serving reasons, including to bolster the importance of your efforts.

I do not know you, and I have no firsthand experience with your prior tuning pursuits. I have heard both positive and negative anecdotes about your past endeavors. I genuinely hope that your entrance into the Porsche tuning market is wildly successful and you create new and innovative products that advance the industry and benefit us all. I likewise hope that, to the extent that the negative stories about you have any basis in fact, you do not repeat them in the Porsche community. Several posters in this thread have shared positive information about you. I hope they are right. As I have stated several times in this thread, competition is good for everyone. If you build a better mouse trap, and support if through reliable and quality service, you will likely find a market for it here among 996TT owners. I sincerely wish you all the best in this regard. The current mouse trap certainly has room for improvement. Good luck!!!

Regards,

Craig

 

Mike,

Please remember that this is not personal and we are on the same side. We have been through a lot together, watching each other’s trials and tribulations as we endeavored to upgrade our 996TTs. I am not here to fight with you, nor to win a debate with you. We have differing opinions on certain issues. That’s to be expected. We see eye to eye on many other 996TT related issues.

I genuinely interpreted your posts to be suggesting that someone was preventing or impairing access to 996TT ECU code. Rather than go through your prior posts and demonstrate the basis for my interpretation, I will instead acquiesce to your clarification that you never intended such a message, and I will humbly apologize for my misreading of your prior comments in this thread. I am genuinely sorry.

Like you, this is not a game for me. I would much rather have your respect and friendship than prevail in some trivial debate with you. FWIW, you continue to have my unmitigated respect.

Regards,

Craig

 

Craig and Mike.... no reason to argue.
My view on this is that anyone that presents a working approach to self tuning( by a qualified programmer for the sake of argument) has my respect. I do believe that when all this tuning business started tuners were buying third party ecus programs... even the German companies... then reselling them down the food chain.
So it is no surprise that Giac was amongst the first and what seems to be best encrypted ECU up to date. ( don't ask me how I know). They wanted to protect their interests... and I don't blame them.... at $3K a pop it was a lot of money. Heck, I had 3 tuners in my ecu and this is my final 4th.
As far as secrecy goes... well Everything from the Diode( no harm intended ) to the type of compressor wheels in certain turbo kits... in essence it was
hush hush. Only after I sent my K24 race turbos to Kevin that I found out that my K24s were Stock. Yet they were marketed as RACE Turbo chargers( and priced accordingly).
I'm sure I can come up with a few more examples... the point is that meanwhile the 996tt platform came to existence... tuners, in my opinion, kept certain info away from us... I believe one reason was a financial incentive. The less we knew the better for them. We ALL now know the type of turbos are in every turbo kit... it's no secret.
With that said, I don't have anything against any tuner because if I was them I would probably do the same...
Good luck to any one that is attempting to open the motronic code to the end user like me.
markski

 

Vishu - I hope all is well and when you have the product ready please post because I think the closing arguments will be better than the opening statements. I think all who posted on this thread want to see you succeed because in the end all of TT owners will benefit if your product and your expectations are met. Please keep updating this thread.

Aloha

Byron

P.S. Everyone thank you for making this thread so long because most of it was interesting and educational for me.

 

Do you talk like this in real life or do you use a really good thesaurus when posting? It makes me appeplectic trying to elucidate your oratory.

 

Quote:

Good luck to any one that is attempting to open the motronic code to the end user like me.

LOL, that is the reason I would never allow customers to have the files. There are certain elements that have to be in place to work with the system. You can have the program to work it, there are several. But that will not help you in any way. You need more files, and another program. Then you need the watered down version because the file is so complex you would never be able to tune all the paramters. DO not forget the initial program was written by a computer.

These programs do not have a single map or two. Not only that they are interrelated across the board. It is very complicated. So in the end, most tuners will have an issue to DO ALL the things that should be done when tuning these cars.

I spend my day tuning standalone and have since the mid 90s. My choice is a decision not an inability to tune nor the lack of ability to acquire proper programs. I have been tuning longer than some have been driving on these forums. FWIW I do not give my standalone customers access either. I do not need the headache of someone that has a 1/16 of my tuning experience tuning their own car. I did that ONCE. That is all it took
.

 

LOL, damn lawyers.

 

The advantage of modifying the stock ECU (or using a piggy back off of it) is that you don't need to change all the parameters. You only need to modify the maps/load cells which are relevant to your performance objectives. I'd be very surprised if tuners are in there changing the cold start fuel enrichment in a "Stage 2" tune.

 

A box will cause limitations as the turbos change. Maybe Shivs unit will get around that but history has shown otherwise. That is not a dig so please do not misread it.

As far as changing the cold start parameters, actually they are, The entire TB map is rewritten which also changes cold start accleration enrichment rates and time outs. When that map gets changed so do all the other
corresponding maps.

 

It's going to be real interesting to see if the piggy back units have changed. We origionally used TRG's Unichip (actually two of them together) and they had a limitation as to derived hp together with some other issues. I understand TRG later sold whatever rights they had to the Unichip. We removed the Unichip years ago and went wth Protomotive.

So whoever are the first members to try this out, please let us know the results after you have put a few thousand miles on with the unit.

Hopefully another step towards progress is on the way. If t is truly good progress with satisfied owners word will get out and it will be a success. If it is not word will get out and it will fail. Not a thing wrong with trying as long as you go in knowing it is new.

 

Yet you still continue with the same insinuations and self-serving paraphrasing...injecting your own directional conclusions and disrespectful undertones and insults. You've more to make amends for the "Savior" and "Prophet" and "Johnny" references....

[
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig
Shiv (or Johnny if you would prefer):

This is the second time that you have enigmatically referenced an undisclosed phantom menace that is purportedly seeking to impede your ascent to the Porsche tuning throne. Please reveal the identity of this depraved and repugnant individual/company, and describe the villainous conduct you cryptically refer to as “questionable means [designed] to diffuse [your] entry into this market.” ]

Shiv never said he was the one who was looking to release the "open-end" ECU interface....you just conveniently insert words into other's posts - but at least you use the " [" and "]" to illustrate {[your]} point. You must really have it in for Shiv, huh?

And then you post the above... unbelieveable... what happened?...someone force you to take a quick glance in the mirror?

Let the anger go, brother, you'll be so much more at peace. Don't be afraid, change is good, it benefits everyone.

 

Ace,

No matter who it is let's not get personal. If what shiv is doing with the 996tt is new and this is up front and hopefully he has tested it himself with good success then I wish him all the best.

I have pioneered alot of new parts with these cars. Let me give you an example and what I believe shiv may be facing even if the product is good and installed by someone who is competent.

We pioneered the carbon fiber intakes for the 996tt. There is no doubt they provided larger openings along with cooler intake air. They made more power. The problem was if a certain sway bar part wasn't installed or tightened properly the intake could be hit and shattered. This even occurred wth professional tuners who were not familiar with the part or made changes not knowing the part was installed on the car. The people who made the mistake usually started the blame game not wanting to admit their mistake because the end results were costly.

I don't know your product but from what I heard you possibly could be facing the same type of issues in the long run. Just my 2 cents. I really hope I'm wrong. Good luck.

 

CJV,
I hear you, and agree with the "let's not make it personal" sentiment.
As you and I know, there is a way to discuss/debate without insults and disrespect...understanding and respect is usually the result.

No doubt, the engine is not some 2-stroke simple air-pump. The work that is needed to make things work properly, safely, and with the chosen goal is not trivial. Whatever the tool/parts, it always comes down to the tuner/mechanic/engineer to make it work correctly. Tuning is an art and the final result always comes down to the skill of the artist...not the quality of the brush. But the release of a new tool, that can help a tuner do his art and allow the customer to have more choices....that's a good thing.
Time will tell...

Be good,
TomK

 

Thanks for the advice.