Nice vid, I really need to get to the track

 

Good info. Thanks! Sounds like they're as good as the Pagids for about 1/3rd the price. Wish I had had this info a couple weeks ago My $600 pads are going in this morning with some goodridge stainless lines and some fresh Motul race fluid. Along with some 997 GT3 ducts. I just couldn't justify the $300 996 cup ducts.

By way, here are the part numbers for the left side brake ducts courtesy of TRG. This really explains what is what. It's somewhat confusing as some of the vehicles have smaller ducts than you'd expect.

996 standard 997.341.483.xx
996 GT3 996.341.117.xx
996 Cup 996.341.117.xx
997 standard 997.341.483.xx
997 GT3 997.341.483.xx (MY 07)
997 Cup 997.341.483.xx
997 GT3RS (street) 996.341.117.xx (race only) 997.341.483.xx

The 2 I carry 996.341.117.xx (large)
997.341.483.xx (small)

 

RW: Where in Florida are you?

 

hey andrew. for the brake ducts, skip the cheaper GT3 ones, they are only slightly better than stock and get the GT3RS ones which are like 270/pair. they are MUCH bigger and much better. i have a set of those on my car

also, something to consider is Protomotive/Protosport has a bigger brake rotots upgrade which you should look into. i think he wanted to charge $800 to upgrade both the front brake rotors and still use your stock calipers. i think they make custom brackets

 

and Andrew, while you're at it, get the rear GT2 brake ducts too. i picked up a set from suncoast.

 

here are a few links to help:

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...h-fiction.html

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...ake-ducts.html

 

I went with the 7GT3's. You're right. They are not much bigger. But they are slightly larger with better air channeling. For $30 it was a cheap upgrade. I just couldn't justify the $300 expense for the 6Cup ducts. Not to mention I'm pretty sure I would tear them off in short order. That would not make me happy to see a $300 piece of plastic in my rear view flapping around in the road

I think my next step will be just to go to a larger brake system. I can't see spending that kind of money just for rotors without also getting larger calipers. If I find a bargain on some used GT3 brakes front and rear and it's not too much of a hassle, I may go that route. The aftermarket kits are wayyyy expensive.

 

I didn't even know they had rear ducts. How much were they?

I literally melted my brake pad wear sensors into lumps of plastic they got so hot at Sebring last time. I had my tech take them off the calipers and wire tie them up out of the way. With my spiffy new $600 brake pads I shouldn't need new pads for a while, or at least I better not!

 

Well, I don't know if the HP+ are as good as the Pagid but I'd be surprised if the Pagids are worth 3 times the price.

Location? I live in Dunedin, FL.

Oh, and the GT3 ducts aren't that much bigger but I haven't knocked them off yet. I added the frame tie downs and they drag all over town. They must protect the brake ducts.....LOL

 

Well, the pagids won't leave brake dust that will melt to your wheels However, I think they are wayyy over priced. You're righton the ducts. The 997GT3 ducts aren't much bigger, but they are designed slightly better than the standard ducts and for 30 bucks, why not?

I'm in Dunedin too. Small world.

Are you going to Porsches in the Park tomorrow. We're meeting at the Dunking Donuts at 730 tomorrow morning if you would like to join us?

 

I would but I'm in Miami for the weekend. I went last year and it was very cool. Have a margarita at Tommy Bahama Cafe for me :-)

I've talked to Joe Vatter at German Tech about brake cooling. If I still had an issue, I'd be running a duct straight to the caliper like what we used to do on the older 911's. I have a Gemballa style front bumper and wouldn't mind some kind of duct attached straight to a hose going straight to the caliper. The old ones weren't even that big....maybe 2 inches in diameter. For what it's worth, Joe would like me to go to Pagids next....that's what they use all the time.

Do we know each other? Dunedin's not that big.....

This pic is pre coilovers. It about drags on the track now

 

Haven't seen yours before. Here's mine:




Why aren't you going to Vortex to get your work done?

 

The "wet" specs are really more important than the dry. Brake fluid is hydoscopic (absorbs water) and it starts absorbing as soon as you put it in. There are plenty of average fluids with high dry boiling points, but few have a high "wet" figure.

The Castrol SRF is expensive, but worth it IMHO.

 

If you didn't flush before an event, you're right. The Wet BP is the number for a fluid that is "saturated" with moisture. That's not going to happen in a day or a week or even a month if you're careful, use new fluid to flush and don't do something stupid. So, if you're lazy and don't flush before an event, then Castrol SRF ABSOLUTELY. If you (like I do) flush before every event, ignore the wet point and use your choice of hi dry point fluid.

Quoting from the description page for Castrol SRF:
Due to the extreme operating temperatures of a high performance brake system, standard 'off-the-shelf' brake fluids are not recommended. Of critical importance in determining a fluids ability to handle high temperature applications is the Dry Boiling Point and compressibility.
For maximum performance, start with the highest Dry Boiling Point available, flush the system completely, and flush it regularly, especially after severe temperatures have been experienced.

Here's a nice rundown from a Corvette forum:

DOT 3 VS. DOT 4 and 5.1
AFCO's 570º brake fluid is a DOT 3 type fluid. However, it has a dry boiling point that is 52º higher than DOT 5.1 specifications, 124º higher than DOT 4 specifications and 169º higher than DOT 3 specifications. AFCO's 570º fluid meets or exceeds all DOT 3, 4, and 5.1 lubrication, corrosion protection and viscosity specifications.

WET VS. DRY BOILING POINT
The term boiling point when used regarding brake fluid means the temperatures that brake fluid will begin to boil.

WET BOILING POINT
The minimum temperatures that brake fluids will begin to boil when the brake system contains 3% water by volume of the system.

DRY BOILING POINT
The temperatures that brake fluid will boil with no water present in the system.

MOISTURE IN THE BRAKE SYSTEM
Water/moisture can be found in nearly all brake systems. Moisture enters the brake system in several ways. One of the more common ways is from using old or pre-opened fluid. Keep in mind, that brake fluid draws in moisture from the surrounding air. Tightly sealing brake fluid bottles and not storing them for long periods of time will help keep moisture out. When changing or bleeding brake fluid always replace master cylinder caps as soon as possible to prevent moisture from entering into the master cylinder. Condensation, (small moisture droplets) can form in lines and calipers. As caliper and line temperatures heat up and then cool repeatedly, condensation occurs, leaving behind an increase in moisture/water. Over time the moisture becomes trapped in the internal sections of calipers, lines, master cylinders, etc. When this water reaches 212º F the water turns to steam. Many times air in the brake system is a result of water that has turned to steam. The build up of steam will create air pressure in the system, sometimes to the point that enough pressure is created to push caliper pistons into the brake pad. This will create brake drag as the rotor and pads make contact and can also create more heat in the system. Diffusion is another way in that water/moisture may enter the system.

Diffusion occurs when over time moisture enters through rubber brake hoses. The use of hoses made from EPDM materials (Ethlene-Propylene-Diene-Materials) will reduce the amount of diffusion OR use steel braided brake hose with a non-rubber sleeve (usually Teflon) to greatly reduce the diffusion process.

THINGS TO REMEMBER

• Brake fluids dry boiling point is more important then wet boiling point when used in a racing brake system.
• Passenger cars very rarely will undergo a brake fluid change making the wet boiling point more important.
• Racing brake system fluid is changed often and a system with fresh fluid will most likely not contain water.
• Because of this, racers should be concerned with the dry boiling point.
• Racing fluid exceeds DOT 3, 4, and 5.1 dry boiling point specifications.
• Never use silicone based fluids in racing brake systems.
• Using racing brake fluid will increase performance of the braking system.
• Never reuse fluid. º Never mix types or brands of brake fluid.
• Use smaller fluid containers that can be used quicker.
• If fluid remains in container be sure to tightly seal and do not store for long periods of time.
• Purge system (complete drain) and replace fluid often.

Below list provided by "The ultimate brake fluid comparison chart" (I would like to add more to this).

Arranged by Dry L

• DRY:401F -- WET:284F --- DOT3 MINIMUM (GLYCOL BASE)
• DRY:446F -- WET:311F --- DOT4 MINIMUM (GLYCOL BASE)
• DRY:500F -- WET:356F --- DOT5 MINIMUM (SILICONE BASE)
• DRY:500F -- WET:356F --- DOT5.1 MINIMUM (GLYCOL BASE)
• DRY:527F -- WET:302F --- AP RACING 551 ($12.95/0.5L OR 16.9 OZ)
• DRY:527F -- WET:347F --- VALVOLINE SYNPOWER DOT3 & DOT4
• DRY:536F -- WET:392F --- ATE SUPERBLUE/TYP200 ($9.95/1L)
• DRY:543F -- WET:349F --- Endless The truth DOT 4 ($35/1L)
• DRY:550F -- WET:284F --- PERFORMANCE Friction Z rated ($6.27/16 OZ)
• DRY:550F -- WET:284F --- FORD HEAVY DUTY DOT 3 ($4/12 OZ)
• DRY:570F -- WET:284F --- WILWOOD 570 ($5.65/12 OZ)
• DRY:572F -- WET:284F --- US Brake/AFCO Racing 570 Gold
• DRY:572F -- WET:421F --- US Brake/AFCO Racing Ultra HTX
• DRY:577F -- WET:300F --- Brake Man
• DRY:585F -- WET:421F --- Earl's Hypertemp 421
• DRY:590F -- WET:410F --- AP RACING Super 600 ($16.95/0.5L OR 16.9 OZ)
• DRY:593F -- WET:420F --- MOTUL RBF600 ($12.95/0.5L OR 16.9 OZ)
• DRY:590F -- WET:518F --- CASTROL SRF ($69.00/1L 0R 33.8 OZ)
• DRY:601F -- WET:399F --- BREMBO LCF 600 PLUS ($26.75/0.5L OR 16.9 OZ)
• DRY:610F -- WET:421F --- NEO SYNTHETICS SUPER DOT 610($11.95/12 OZ)
• DRY:610F -- WET:421F --- PROSPEED GS610 ($39.95/16 OZ)
• DRY:617F -- WET:413F --- Endless RF-450 ($45/1L)
• DRY:620F -- WET:425F --- COBALT SUPER XRF [seem to no longer be available]
• DRY:622F -- WET:424F --- Endless RF-650
• DRY:626F -- WET:417F --- WILWOOD EXP 600 ($16.95/0.5L 16.9 OZ)

Arranged by wet boiling point:

• DRY:401F -- WET:284F --- DOT3 MINIMUM
• DRY:550F -- WET:284F --- PERFORMANCE Friction Z rated
• DRY:550F -- WET:284F --- FORD HEAVY DUTY DOT 3
• DRY:570F -- WET:284F --- WILWOOD 570
• DRY:572F -- WET:284F --- US Brake / AFCO Racing 570 Gold
• DRY:577F -- WET:300F --- Brake Man
• DRY:527F -- WET:302F --- AP RACING 551
• DRY:446F -- WET:311F --- DOT4 MINIMUM
• DRY:527F -- WET:347F --- VALVOLINE SYNPOWER DOT3 & DOT4
• DRY:543F -- WET:349F --- Endless The truth DOT 4
• DRY:500F -- WET:356F --- DOT5.1 MINIMUM (GLYCOL BASE)
• DRY:500F -- WET:356F --- DOT5 MINIMUM (SILICONE BASE)
• DRY:536F -- WET:392F --- ATE SUPERBLUE/TYP200
• DRY:601F -- WET:399F --- BREMBO LCF 600 PLUS
• DRY:590F -- WET:410F --- AP RACING Super 600
• DRY:617F -- WET:413F --- Endless RF-450
• DRY:626F -- WET:417F --- WILWOOD EXP 600
• DRY:572F -- WET:421F --- US Brake/AFCO Racing Ultra HTX
• DRY:585F -- WET:421F --- Earl's Hypertemp 421
• DRY:593F -- WET:420F --- MOTUL RBF600
• DRY:610F -- WET:421F --- NEO SYNTHETICS SUPER DOT 610
• DRY:610F -- WET:421F --- PROSPEED GS610
• DRY:622F -- WET:424F --- Endless RF-650
• DRY:620F -- WET:425F --- COBALT SUPER XRF [seem to no longer be available]
• DRY:590F -- WET:518F --- CASTROL SRF

 

Hmm, your google powers are strong.....

Again, as soon as you open the can your brake fluid starts absorbing moisture. If you change before every event you should be fine with the brembo stuff.