Porsche Turbo cab or 360 Spyder
#1
02-10-2008, 08:28 AM
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Topsfield, MA
Posts: 9
Rep Power: 0 
Porsche Turbo cab or 360 Spyder
The other day I visited my Porsche dealer and found that the build date for the ’08 Turbo Cab I ordered is the 7<sup>th</sup> of March. This should put the car here in April or May just in time for summer. This is exciting, but also made me wonder if I was making the right decision. Yesterday on a fluke I stopped by a Ferrari dealership and test drove a 360 Spyder. I had owned a Testarossa a couple of years ago and did not like it at all as it was not an easy car to drive and seemed to have a never ending list of things going wrong. But, I have to say that the 360 is a great car to drive and is approximately the same price as the turbo cab.
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I’d assume that some on this board have had the pleasure of owning both cars. Assuming you had the choice of either, which would you choose and why? I will put about 5K miles on the car a year and have no desire to track the car. The tradeoffs as I see them are: New car with warrantee vs. used with no warrantee, 4 year old vs. 10 year old technology, 480hp vs. 400 hp, the Ferrari has already taken the major depreciation hit, creature comforts are a bit better in the Porsche, Ferrari repair costs vs. Porsche (probably not a major issue on the 360), exotic vs. mass market (not that any $150K vehicle is mass market).
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Any guidance in this decision will be greatly appreciated. <!--[endif]--><o></o>
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I’d assume that some on this board have had the pleasure of owning both cars. Assuming you had the choice of either, which would you choose and why? I will put about 5K miles on the car a year and have no desire to track the car. The tradeoffs as I see them are: New car with warrantee vs. used with no warrantee, 4 year old vs. 10 year old technology, 480hp vs. 400 hp, the Ferrari has already taken the major depreciation hit, creature comforts are a bit better in the Porsche, Ferrari repair costs vs. Porsche (probably not a major issue on the 360), exotic vs. mass market (not that any $150K vehicle is mass market).
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Any guidance in this decision will be greatly appreciated. <!--[endif]--><o></o>
#3
02-10-2008, 10:38 AM
I've got about 4000 miles worth of experience on a 2003 F1 tranny 360 spider so can offer a view, albeit, I haven't taken delivery of my 997TT yet so impressions of the Porsche are somewhat limited. The 360 is a very nice car. It looks sensational, makes good noises, is generally usable as a regular driver, visibility is decent, trunk space up front is more than the 997 and gas mileage isn't terrible. The HVAC works sufficiently well, navigation is crap, sound with the upgraded stereo is decent. F1 transmission is actually pretty good but not as smooth or as quick as newer F1 transmissions such as the 430, 612 or 599. Top is quick up and down and well insulated but window sealing is a bit finiky sometimes. Cubby bins are somewhat limited though so I always have to stick my phone in the door release. Footwell is also somewhat small and there is no dead pedal for resting left foot. Auto up-down on widows is complete junk and never works the right way. Ride is quite good, better in fact than my B6 S4 Avant. Beautiful car and a real sense of occasion when you're driving it...gets lots of looks.
That all said....
It is fast but not absurdly so. It doesn't develop much power until the second half of the rev counter. Check the torque numbers versus the 997TT. Traction is also an issue in my mind. It has very quick turn-in but doesn't have the planted feel of the 997TT. The AWD on the 997 offers a hugh benefit in the dry but in particular in the rain. You can slap snow tires on the 997TT and use it all year round. No way you can or would want to do the same in the 360. Better interior on the P-car. Clearly not as exotic as the Ferrari but effectively a better car for a lot of reasons.
That all said....
It is fast but not absurdly so. It doesn't develop much power until the second half of the rev counter. Check the torque numbers versus the 997TT. Traction is also an issue in my mind. It has very quick turn-in but doesn't have the planted feel of the 997TT. The AWD on the 997 offers a hugh benefit in the dry but in particular in the rain. You can slap snow tires on the 997TT and use it all year round. No way you can or would want to do the same in the 360. Better interior on the P-car. Clearly not as exotic as the Ferrari but effectively a better car for a lot of reasons.
#5
02-10-2008, 10:49 AM
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I've got about 4000 miles worth of experience on a 2003 F1 tranny 360 spider so can offer a view, albeit, I haven't taken delivery of my 997TT yet so impressions of the Porsche are somewhat limited. The 360 is a very nice car. It looks sensational, makes good noises, is generally usable as a regular driver, visibility is decent, trunk space up front is more than the 997 and gas mileage isn't terrible. The HVAC works sufficiently well, navigation is crap, sound with the upgraded stereo is decent. F1 transmission is actually pretty good but not as smooth or as quick as newer F1 transmissions such as the 430, 612 or 599. Top is quick up and down and well insulated but window sealing is a bit finiky sometimes. Cubby bins are somewhat limited though so I always have to stick my phone in the door release. Footwell is also somewhat small and there is no dead pedal for resting left foot. Auto up-down on widows is complete junk and never works the right way. Ride is quite good, better in fact than my B6 S4 Avant. Beautiful car and a real sense of occasion when you're driving it...gets lots of looks.
That all said....
It is fast but not absurdly so. It doesn't develop much power until the second half of the rev counter. Check the torque numbers versus the 997TT. Traction is also an issue in my mind. It has very quick turn-in but doesn't have the planted feel of the 997TT. The AWD on the 997 offers a hugh benefit in the dry but in particular in the rain. You can slap snow tires on the 997TT and use it all year round. No way you can or would want to do the same in the 360. Better interior on the P-car. Clearly not as exotic as the Ferrari but effectively a better car for a lot of reasons.
That all said....
It is fast but not absurdly so. It doesn't develop much power until the second half of the rev counter. Check the torque numbers versus the 997TT. Traction is also an issue in my mind. It has very quick turn-in but doesn't have the planted feel of the 997TT. The AWD on the 997 offers a hugh benefit in the dry but in particular in the rain. You can slap snow tires on the 997TT and use it all year round. No way you can or would want to do the same in the 360. Better interior on the P-car. Clearly not as exotic as the Ferrari but effectively a better car for a lot of reasons.
#6
02-10-2008, 12:16 PM
This is very interesting to me because I went through EXACTLY the same dilemma. When I purchased my 997TT I also debated long and hard about buying a 360 Modena coupe and spyder. I looked seriously at 2 2005 models with about 4-5K miles on them. I test drove them and looked them over several gimes. The spyder was red and the coupe was yellow. Both looked great and sounded like a Ferrari ('nough said). I actually think that the Modena looks better than the F430 - more symmertrical and I like the recessed tail lights. They were asking $140 K for the coupe and $170 K for the spyder. Like you say, right in the 997TT range.
This was a very tough decision for me. It has always been my dream to own a Ferarri. I was coming from a heavily modified V8 Mercedes SLK55 with around 400 bhp as a point of comparison. After driving the 360 several times I made a list of positives and negatives. It went something like this.
Ferrari
Pros:
Engine sound
Great throttle response in low RPM range
Ferarri cache
V8 engine
F1 paddle shift tranny
Cons
Underpowered (400 hp/373 tq)
Interior appointments limited
Expected cost of ownership in the $1.67 per mile range
Feels a bit like driving a china cup - but this could have been in my head
Repairs cost $$$ and take a long time
Bad reputation among enthusiasts - not amongst the best Ferraris ever produced (and thus their affordability as oppposed to F430).
Obviously, my list of "Cons" was pretty long. But let me tell you, once you sit in the Ferrari and fire it up, the engine note is simply intoxicating. Driving around in it is like walking the red carpet in Hollywood. You just feel like a million dollars! You just can't beat the psychological aspects of driving a Ferrrari.
I also had my eye on the 997TT and had read a sea of articles on how great it was. When I drove the 997TT I also made a list of pros and cons. It went like this:
997TT
Pros
Great power numbers (480 hp/505 tq with overboost)
Incredible pickup in high RPM range
Best handling car ever
AWD system
Nice interior appointments
Super solid construction - feels bullett proof
Manual transmission
Tight chassis
Cons
Flat 6 engine
Turbo lag
Torque curve is weaker than it should be at low RPM - even with overboost (thus throttle response could be better)
Weak exhaust note
Somewhat ubiquitous
It's not a Ferrari
Steep learning curve to drive it well
In the end, the real selling points came down like this: I liked the Ferrari because it was a Ferrari and the exhaust note. I liked the 997TT because I felt like I was getting more for my money and it was faster in the high RPM range. But the deciding moment occurred for me when I got back in my SLK55 after test driving the 360 Modena. It was just plain obvious that my SLK55 was faster through the entire RPM range that the 360. I felt like I would be taking a step backwards in performance with the 360 as opposed to my SLK. But after 3K RPM, the 997TT was a totally new driving experience.
With the Ferarri I kept focusing on the reactions I would get from people when I drove up in it and that great exhaust note out on the road. With the 997TT I couldn't stop thinking about what it felt like when the turbos got spooled up around 4K RPM and the feeling of that perfect shift from 3rd to 4th at 4500 RPM and the surge forward when you let the clutch out just right.
It basically came down to form vs substance and substance won. So I bought the 997TT. The Ferrari will have to wait.
Through this experience I realized that the Ferarri cache would wear off pretty fast - probably around the first time I had to put it in the shop. But the thrill of the 997TT was going to last. I relished the challenge of learning how to drive it without having to worry about destroying it. I have had the 997TT for 3 months now and do not regret my decision at all. When I see 360 Modenas on the road now I still note how great they look and sound, but I also know that I simply have the superior car. And you now what, the Ferarri driver knows it too.
I will own a Ferrari someday. I love them and think they are the best cars ever made. But the 997TT is the right car for me right now. If this had been between an F430 and the 997TT, we would be having a very different conversation. But that is best left for another discussion on another day.
That's my (very long-winded) 2 cents. Hope it was helpful. Good luck.
This was a very tough decision for me. It has always been my dream to own a Ferarri. I was coming from a heavily modified V8 Mercedes SLK55 with around 400 bhp as a point of comparison. After driving the 360 several times I made a list of positives and negatives. It went something like this.
Ferrari
Pros:
Engine sound
Great throttle response in low RPM range
Ferarri cache
V8 engine
F1 paddle shift tranny
Cons
Underpowered (400 hp/373 tq)
Interior appointments limited
Expected cost of ownership in the $1.67 per mile range
Feels a bit like driving a china cup - but this could have been in my head
Repairs cost $$$ and take a long time
Bad reputation among enthusiasts - not amongst the best Ferraris ever produced (and thus their affordability as oppposed to F430).
Obviously, my list of "Cons" was pretty long. But let me tell you, once you sit in the Ferrari and fire it up, the engine note is simply intoxicating. Driving around in it is like walking the red carpet in Hollywood. You just feel like a million dollars! You just can't beat the psychological aspects of driving a Ferrrari.
I also had my eye on the 997TT and had read a sea of articles on how great it was. When I drove the 997TT I also made a list of pros and cons. It went like this:
997TT
Pros
Great power numbers (480 hp/505 tq with overboost)
Incredible pickup in high RPM range
Best handling car ever
AWD system
Nice interior appointments
Super solid construction - feels bullett proof
Manual transmission
Tight chassis
Cons
Flat 6 engine
Turbo lag
Torque curve is weaker than it should be at low RPM - even with overboost (thus throttle response could be better)
Weak exhaust note
Somewhat ubiquitous
It's not a Ferrari
Steep learning curve to drive it well
In the end, the real selling points came down like this: I liked the Ferrari because it was a Ferrari and the exhaust note. I liked the 997TT because I felt like I was getting more for my money and it was faster in the high RPM range. But the deciding moment occurred for me when I got back in my SLK55 after test driving the 360 Modena. It was just plain obvious that my SLK55 was faster through the entire RPM range that the 360. I felt like I would be taking a step backwards in performance with the 360 as opposed to my SLK. But after 3K RPM, the 997TT was a totally new driving experience.
With the Ferarri I kept focusing on the reactions I would get from people when I drove up in it and that great exhaust note out on the road. With the 997TT I couldn't stop thinking about what it felt like when the turbos got spooled up around 4K RPM and the feeling of that perfect shift from 3rd to 4th at 4500 RPM and the surge forward when you let the clutch out just right.
It basically came down to form vs substance and substance won. So I bought the 997TT. The Ferrari will have to wait.
Through this experience I realized that the Ferarri cache would wear off pretty fast - probably around the first time I had to put it in the shop. But the thrill of the 997TT was going to last. I relished the challenge of learning how to drive it without having to worry about destroying it. I have had the 997TT for 3 months now and do not regret my decision at all. When I see 360 Modenas on the road now I still note how great they look and sound, but I also know that I simply have the superior car. And you now what, the Ferarri driver knows it too.
I will own a Ferrari someday. I love them and think they are the best cars ever made. But the 997TT is the right car for me right now. If this had been between an F430 and the 997TT, we would be having a very different conversation. But that is best left for another discussion on another day.
That's my (very long-winded) 2 cents. Hope it was helpful. Good luck.
Last edited by Barrister; 02-11-2008 at 05:31 PM.
#7
02-10-2008, 01:04 PM
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Topsfield, MA
Posts: 9
Rep Power: 0
I'd like to thank all of you who have commented. There have been some very good thoughts raised that I had not considered and I'm going to keep researching before making a final decision. I believe that the difficulty with a decision like this is that it cannot be reduced to objective criteria. It's clear that either way I go I will not be disappointed.
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#8
02-10-2008, 03:15 PM
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Long Island, New York
Posts: 295
Rep Power: 29
Barrister said it all. I would add that if your looking for a daily driver that can reliably handle 10K-15K miles per year, hands down, the TT is your ride. If you want a car where you'll only drive it 2K-3K miles per year, tops, then I'd shoot for the 05 F1 Modena. You should ask around, but it is very rare to drive a 360/430 10K-15K miles per year.
#9
02-10-2008, 07:06 PM
I went through a similar dilemma before I went from a 996TT to 997TT.
I have to agree with everyone else. The Ferrari, while less powerful, sounds incredible. It drives incredible...and despite being a generation old, still looks classic.
I went to the 997TT because of every day usability. I skipped used GT2s (even had a chance to buy a MK2 GT2 - pretty rare...I think there are only like 5 or 6 imported in 2005) because I wanted every day supercar usability. While there are other cars faster, better track handlers, and exotic, my 997TT is the perfect balance of looks, exclusivity, usability, winter drive-ability, and durability.
I have to agree with everyone else. The Ferrari, while less powerful, sounds incredible. It drives incredible...and despite being a generation old, still looks classic.
I went to the 997TT because of every day usability. I skipped used GT2s (even had a chance to buy a MK2 GT2 - pretty rare...I think there are only like 5 or 6 imported in 2005) because I wanted every day supercar usability. While there are other cars faster, better track handlers, and exotic, my 997TT is the perfect balance of looks, exclusivity, usability, winter drive-ability, and durability.
#10
02-11-2008, 02:16 AM
Only 5k miles a year. That means about 2-3k maintenance on the Ferrari yearly if nothing breaks. Which is not bad at all. 360 spyders look awsome. Better than the f430 imo. Even though the turbo cab is a little faster, the driving experience is completely different. The sound of starting a Ferrari is worth 20 bucks everytime INO. Nothing beats a Ferrari exhaust note. I intend on driving my BMW as a daily driver and purchasing an f360cs or f430 in a few years. For me, nothing compares to a Ferrari.
Ferrari is a scaled down version of God - Jeremy Clarkson
Ferrari is a scaled down version of God - Jeremy Clarkson
Last edited by dakine; 02-11-2008 at 02:20 AM.
#11
02-11-2008, 10:45 AM
It is a tough call, and a nice position to be in. The Ferrari engine sounds are so enticing to mere mortal men I hope to own an F430 in the future.
However, I have recently sold an 05 Gallardo. Awesome sound and performance, but not used very much. I could not justify my expense for a Sunday driving car at best. You will have to deal with nerve racking parking worries and excess attention.
If you have a few choice cars in your stable and you plan to use the Ferrari occasionally, then go for it.
With the Porsche 911 Turbo , you will find yourself more often on the road then not.
I hope to own an F430 in the future.However, I have recently sold an 05 Gallardo. Awesome sound and performance, but not used very much. I could not justify my expense for a Sunday driving car at best. You will have to deal with nerve racking parking worries and excess attention.
If you have a few choice cars in your stable and you plan to use the Ferrari occasionally, then go for it.
With the Porsche 911 Turbo , you will find yourself more often on the road then not.
#12
02-11-2008, 01:22 PM
This is very interesting to me because I went through EXACTLY the same dilemma. When I purchased my 997TT I also debated long and hard about buying a 360 Modena coupe and spyder. I looked seriously at 2 2005 models with about 4-5K miles on them. I test drove them and looked them over several gimes. The spyder was red and the coupe was yellow. Both looked great and sounded like a Ferrari ('nough said). I actually think that the Modena looks better than the F430 - more symmertrical and I like the recessed tail lights. They were asking $140 K for the coupe and $170 K for the spyder. Like you say, right in the 997TT range.
This was a very tough decision for me. It has always been my dream to own a Ferarri. I was coming from a heavily modified V8 Mercedes SLK55 with around 400 bhp as a point of comparison. After driving the 360 several times I made a list of positives and negatives. It went something like this.
Ferrari
Pros:
Engine sound
Great throttle response in low RPM range
Ferarri cache
V8 engine
F1 paddle shift tranny
Cons
Underpowered (400 hp/373 tq)
Interior appointments limited
Expected cost of ownership in the $1.67 per mile range
Feels a bit like driving a china cup - but this could have been in my head
Repairs cost $$$ and take a long time
Bad reputation among enthusiasts - not amongst the best Ferraris ever produced (and thus their affordability as oppposed to F430).
Obviously, my list of "Cons" was pretty long. But let me tell you, once you sit in the Ferrari and fire it up, the engine note is simply intoxicating. Driving around in it is like walking the red carpet in Hollywood. You just feel like a million dollars! You just can't beat the psychological aspects of driving a Ferrrari.
I also had my eye on the 997TT and had read a sea of articles on how great it was. When I drove the 997TT I also made a list of pros and cons. It went like this:
997TT
Pros
Great power numbers (480 hp/505 tq with overboost)
Incredible pickup in high RPM range
Best handling car ever
AWD system
Nice interior appointments
Super solid construction - feels bullett proof
Manual transmission
Tight chassis
Cons
V6 engine
Turbo lag
Torque curve is weaker than it should be at low RPM - even with overboost (thus throttle response could be better)
Weak exhaust note
Somewhat ubiquitous
It's not a Ferrari
Steep learning curve to drive it well
In the end, the real selling points came down like this: I liked the Ferrari because it was a Ferrari and the exhaust note. I liked the 997TT because I felt like I was getting more for my money and it was faster in the high RPM range. But the deciding moment occurred for me when I got back in my SLK55 after test driving the 360 Modena. It was just plain obvious that my SLK55 was faster through the entire RPM range that the 360. I felt like I would be taking a step backwards in performance with the 360 as opposed to my SLK. But after 3K RPM, the 997TT was a totally new driving experience.
With the Ferarri I kept focusing on the reactions I would get from people when I drove up in it and that great exhaust note out on the road. With the 997TT I couldn't stop thinking about what it felt like when the turbos got spooled up around 4K RPM and the feeling of that perfect shift from 3rd to 4th at 4500 RPM and the surge forward when you let the clutch out just right.
It basically came down to form vs substance and substance won. So I bought the 997TT. The Ferrari will have to wait.
Through this experience I realized that the Ferarri cache would wear off pretty fast - probably around the first time I had to put it in the shop. But the thrill of the 997TT was going to last. I relished the challenge of learning how to drive it without having to worry about destroying it. I have had the 997TT for 3 months now and do not regret my decision at all. When I see 360 Modenas on the road now I still note how great they look and sound, but I also know that I simply have the superior car. And you now what, the Ferarri driver knows it too.
I will own a Ferrari someday. I love them and think they are the best cars ever made. But the 997TT is the right car for me right now. If this had been between an F430 and the 997TT, we would be having a very different conversation. But that is best left for another discussion on another day.
That's my (very long-winded) 2 cents. Hope it was helpful. Good luck.
This was a very tough decision for me. It has always been my dream to own a Ferarri. I was coming from a heavily modified V8 Mercedes SLK55 with around 400 bhp as a point of comparison. After driving the 360 several times I made a list of positives and negatives. It went something like this.
Ferrari
Pros:
Engine sound
Great throttle response in low RPM range
Ferarri cache
V8 engine
F1 paddle shift tranny
Cons
Underpowered (400 hp/373 tq)
Interior appointments limited
Expected cost of ownership in the $1.67 per mile range
Feels a bit like driving a china cup - but this could have been in my head
Repairs cost $$$ and take a long time
Bad reputation among enthusiasts - not amongst the best Ferraris ever produced (and thus their affordability as oppposed to F430).
Obviously, my list of "Cons" was pretty long. But let me tell you, once you sit in the Ferrari and fire it up, the engine note is simply intoxicating. Driving around in it is like walking the red carpet in Hollywood. You just feel like a million dollars! You just can't beat the psychological aspects of driving a Ferrrari.
I also had my eye on the 997TT and had read a sea of articles on how great it was. When I drove the 997TT I also made a list of pros and cons. It went like this:
997TT
Pros
Great power numbers (480 hp/505 tq with overboost)
Incredible pickup in high RPM range
Best handling car ever
AWD system
Nice interior appointments
Super solid construction - feels bullett proof
Manual transmission
Tight chassis
Cons
V6 engine
Turbo lag
Torque curve is weaker than it should be at low RPM - even with overboost (thus throttle response could be better)
Weak exhaust note
Somewhat ubiquitous
It's not a Ferrari
Steep learning curve to drive it well
In the end, the real selling points came down like this: I liked the Ferrari because it was a Ferrari and the exhaust note. I liked the 997TT because I felt like I was getting more for my money and it was faster in the high RPM range. But the deciding moment occurred for me when I got back in my SLK55 after test driving the 360 Modena. It was just plain obvious that my SLK55 was faster through the entire RPM range that the 360. I felt like I would be taking a step backwards in performance with the 360 as opposed to my SLK. But after 3K RPM, the 997TT was a totally new driving experience.
With the Ferarri I kept focusing on the reactions I would get from people when I drove up in it and that great exhaust note out on the road. With the 997TT I couldn't stop thinking about what it felt like when the turbos got spooled up around 4K RPM and the feeling of that perfect shift from 3rd to 4th at 4500 RPM and the surge forward when you let the clutch out just right.
It basically came down to form vs substance and substance won. So I bought the 997TT. The Ferrari will have to wait.
Through this experience I realized that the Ferarri cache would wear off pretty fast - probably around the first time I had to put it in the shop. But the thrill of the 997TT was going to last. I relished the challenge of learning how to drive it without having to worry about destroying it. I have had the 997TT for 3 months now and do not regret my decision at all. When I see 360 Modenas on the road now I still note how great they look and sound, but I also know that I simply have the superior car. And you now what, the Ferarri driver knows it too.
I will own a Ferrari someday. I love them and think they are the best cars ever made. But the 997TT is the right car for me right now. If this had been between an F430 and the 997TT, we would be having a very different conversation. But that is best left for another discussion on another day.
That's my (very long-winded) 2 cents. Hope it was helpful. Good luck.
#13
02-11-2008, 02:08 PM
#14
02-11-2008, 02:17 PM
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Burlington/Marco island
Age: 63
Posts: 5,763
Rep Power: 267 
I've had two 360 spiders and two 997tt's. The analysis is very simple. If you intend to use the car as transportation, get the P. Fun car to bomb around in, be seen in? F, hands down.
