997 TT beats GT-R at Ring. Nissan accused of cheating.
#361
10-07-2008, 03:38 AM
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: ga
Posts: 8,934
Rep Power: 551 
For the price that the GTR is selling here in Australia next year - it's definitely going to take away a huge chunk in Porsche's sale, and Porsche has everything to worry about and here's why;
1) GTR premium- AU$153,000
2) Porsche boxter s/ Cayman - around AU$150,000
3) Porsche 911 pdk - AU$240,000
4) Porsche 911 turbo - AU$340,000
So lets assume that the turbo is a little faster than the GTR. Is it still justifiable to pay over 2 times more for it?Die hard fans and brand loyalist would say yes, but a lot of car enthusiasts would say no. There goes one chunk of Porsche's sale.
Now is the GTR faster then the boxter/Cayman? Even the P fanboys will have to say yes to this. GTR is the same price as Boxter/Cayman but is faster - if you're into speed, you wouldn't think twice which car to get now would you? There goes another of Porsche's chunk of sales.
At the end of the day, Porsche is worried and it is of no coincidence that the accusation from Porsche about Nissan cheating coincides with the release of the 911 pdk in Australia. Porsche is trying to save it's sales by putting doubts in potential buyers mind of the GTR.
1) GTR premium- AU$153,000
2) Porsche boxter s/ Cayman - around AU$150,000
3) Porsche 911 pdk - AU$240,000
4) Porsche 911 turbo - AU$340,000
So lets assume that the turbo is a little faster than the GTR. Is it still justifiable to pay over 2 times more for it?Die hard fans and brand loyalist would say yes, but a lot of car enthusiasts would say no. There goes one chunk of Porsche's sale.
Now is the GTR faster then the boxter/Cayman? Even the P fanboys will have to say yes to this. GTR is the same price as Boxter/Cayman but is faster - if you're into speed, you wouldn't think twice which car to get now would you? There goes another of Porsche's chunk of sales.
At the end of the day, Porsche is worried and it is of no coincidence that the accusation from Porsche about Nissan cheating coincides with the release of the 911 pdk in Australia. Porsche is trying to save it's sales by putting doubts in potential buyers mind of the GTR.
Dude, there are only 200 GT-R's going to Australia. And that isnt even enough to satisfy the rabid GT-R fanboys down there. So how are they going to steal Porsche sales with such a paltry number of cars???? And you act like they are the only two cars being sold down there. What about BMW, Holden, Chevy etc.
Do the math and say something useful, your blabbing is annoying. Try to put at least some thought into what you're saying instead of copying and pasting from Nagtroc.
#362
10-07-2008, 03:56 AM
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: ga
Posts: 8,934
Rep Power: 551
For those criticizing Porsche for doing this test. Nissan started this mess by parading around a 997 TT everywhere their GT-R went. Didnt hear much criticizing about that (except from me). I think it's only fair that Porsche get to verify Nissan's findings since they used a Porsche as their "benchmark" and prop to sell their car. That is the most pathetic thing about it. Nissan didnt have enough confidence in the car to sell on it's own, so they had to try and make it seem better than the TT.
Well other than making it a close race in laps, the TT is still better, faster, more dependable, more comfortable, better quality, better service by a mile, better delivery and the list goes on. And that's without PDK which is coming, DI which is coming, weight (coming), more hp (coming) and while it was on lesser tires. Well lap times dont apply to 98% of TT owners, and a similar high percentage of GT-R owners. So for the large majority of people, the GT-R = fail.
Nissan has played their hand, they put as 5 years into this car building from ground up. They put everything they could into the car, and it's still not on the same level as a TT. And when Porsche strikes back, the "outdated technology" is going to put a serious beating on the younr whippersnapper.
Porsche only gave what they were due for the insecure cross-advertising that Nissan did. If you cant take it, dont dish it out NISSAN!!!!!!!
Well other than making it a close race in laps, the TT is still better, faster, more dependable, more comfortable, better quality, better service by a mile, better delivery and the list goes on. And that's without PDK which is coming, DI which is coming, weight (coming), more hp (coming) and while it was on lesser tires. Well lap times dont apply to 98% of TT owners, and a similar high percentage of GT-R owners. So for the large majority of people, the GT-R = fail.
Nissan has played their hand, they put as 5 years into this car building from ground up. They put everything they could into the car, and it's still not on the same level as a TT. And when Porsche strikes back, the "outdated technology" is going to put a serious beating on the younr whippersnapper.
Porsche only gave what they were due for the insecure cross-advertising that Nissan did. If you cant take it, dont dish it out NISSAN!!!!!!!
#363
10-07-2008, 04:13 AM
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Wellington,New Zealand
Posts: 756
Rep Power: 53 
#364
10-07-2008, 04:24 AM
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Wellington,New Zealand
Posts: 756
Rep Power: 53
These threads are funny.
I really hope people dont buy a car based on it's Nurburgring time as it has little resemblance to the driving most of us do everyday.
A few seconds difference over 13 odd miles of track is not much.
These cars are driven on the limit by people whose driving talents are far and beyond what 99% of people who drive these cars on the road possess.
As i have said before there is something called the x factor,some cars have it some cars dont.
When i have my garage door roll up,what would i rather see in there, the timeless rear hunches of a 911 Turbo,or the butch hard edged lines of the GTR.
I would have to say the 911 would get me more fired up about jumping in it and going for a good thrash over my favourite road,and of course to have a GTR in my garage wouldnt hurt matters,but when it comes down to it for me at least, the pedigree,the timeless looks and the prestige of the 911 Turbo win every time.
Would i care that it costs twice as much and is a few seconds slower round a track ill never drive on?Not a chance!
I really hope people dont buy a car based on it's Nurburgring time as it has little resemblance to the driving most of us do everyday.
A few seconds difference over 13 odd miles of track is not much.
These cars are driven on the limit by people whose driving talents are far and beyond what 99% of people who drive these cars on the road possess.
As i have said before there is something called the x factor,some cars have it some cars dont.
When i have my garage door roll up,what would i rather see in there, the timeless rear hunches of a 911 Turbo,or the butch hard edged lines of the GTR.
I would have to say the 911 would get me more fired up about jumping in it and going for a good thrash over my favourite road,and of course to have a GTR in my garage wouldnt hurt matters,but when it comes down to it for me at least, the pedigree,the timeless looks and the prestige of the 911 Turbo win every time.
Would i care that it costs twice as much and is a few seconds slower round a track ill never drive on?Not a chance!
#365
10-07-2008, 07:32 AM
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: ga
Posts: 8,934
Rep Power: 551
Getting better by the minute. You cant even replace the clutch without replacing the whole tranny. So if you wear and tear item clutch goes, you also have to pay for a tranny to go with it.
http://www.nagtroc.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=25374
This is the dumbest smart car I've ever heard of. Nissan completely left the consumer out of the process of the car, from the driving experience (drives itself with gadgets), to completely forgetting that a car's value is not just in the MSRP (which is increasing at 10% a pop, with another increase coming next year). Now if the clutch goes, the guys have to buy a new tranny too, which costs ~20% of the old MSRP.
So if the clutch or gearbox goes, the guys have to pay that amount. Seriously, who would want that??? Nissan has engineered themselves in circles and have now gone crosseyed (austin powers). The poor guys who mod the car are in for a real treat when they get to certain power levels. So much for mod potential. Cant say Nissan didnt warn them.
This is imitation Porsche gone wrong!!!!!!!! Nissan are making the POS service for the GT-R descriptive of the car and not the service.
http://www.nagtroc.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=25374
This is the dumbest smart car I've ever heard of. Nissan completely left the consumer out of the process of the car, from the driving experience (drives itself with gadgets), to completely forgetting that a car's value is not just in the MSRP (which is increasing at 10% a pop, with another increase coming next year). Now if the clutch goes, the guys have to buy a new tranny too, which costs ~20% of the old MSRP.
So if the clutch or gearbox goes, the guys have to pay that amount. Seriously, who would want that??? Nissan has engineered themselves in circles and have now gone crosseyed (austin powers). The poor guys who mod the car are in for a real treat when they get to certain power levels. So much for mod potential. Cant say Nissan didnt warn them.
This is imitation Porsche gone wrong!!!!!!!! Nissan are making the POS service for the GT-R descriptive of the car and not the service.
Last edited by heavychevy; 10-07-2008 at 07:38 AM.
#366
10-07-2008, 07:55 AM
Oh boy!
I guess not many women will be wanting to "jump" in the Turbo with you eh??
CRAZY this post is. Personally I don't care if the next Chevy Cobalt XXR or next Ford Focus SVT-TT is faster, cheaper, has less maintenance and has been driven by Michael Schumacher on the Ring with a time of 10 seconds.
I LOVE Porsche Period. No magazine article or factory driver's input will ever change that. If it's our money we can choose to spend it as we like.
Gees that was hard to type out!
#367
10-07-2008, 08:01 AM
Getting better by the minute. You cant even replace the clutch without replacing the whole tranny. So if you wear and tear item clutch goes, you also have to pay for a tranny to go with it.
http://www.nagtroc.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=25374
This is the dumbest smart car I've ever heard of. Nissan completely left the consumer out of the process of the car, from the driving experience (drives itself with gadgets), to completely forgetting that a car's value is not just in the MSRP (which is increasing at 10% a pop, with another increase coming next year). Now if the clutch goes, the guys have to buy a new tranny too, which costs ~20% of the old MSRP.
So if the clutch or gearbox goes, the guys have to pay that amount. Seriously, who would want that??? Nissan has engineered themselves in circles and have now gone crosseyed (austin powers). The poor guys who mod the car are in for a real treat when they get to certain power levels. So much for mod potential. Cant say Nissan didnt warn them.
This is imitation Porsche gone wrong!!!!!!!! Nissan are making the POS service for the GT-R descriptive of the car and not the service.
http://www.nagtroc.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=25374
This is the dumbest smart car I've ever heard of. Nissan completely left the consumer out of the process of the car, from the driving experience (drives itself with gadgets), to completely forgetting that a car's value is not just in the MSRP (which is increasing at 10% a pop, with another increase coming next year). Now if the clutch goes, the guys have to buy a new tranny too, which costs ~20% of the old MSRP.
So if the clutch or gearbox goes, the guys have to pay that amount. Seriously, who would want that??? Nissan has engineered themselves in circles and have now gone crosseyed (austin powers). The poor guys who mod the car are in for a real treat when they get to certain power levels. So much for mod potential. Cant say Nissan didnt warn them.
This is imitation Porsche gone wrong!!!!!!!! Nissan are making the POS service for the GT-R descriptive of the car and not the service.
Porsche finds Nissan cheating at Ring
Do not use VDC/Launch control or you're f'ed!
The g'dam clutch cannot be replaced separately!
how come no one makes a tranny upgrade?
things I hate about my GTR
I should have bought a GT3
Do not buy these lemon/abused GTR's
I got *** raped by the Nissan dealer, and didn't like it
#368
10-07-2008, 08:15 AM
For those criticizing Porsche for doing this test. Nissan started this mess by parading around a 997 TT everywhere their GT-R went. Didnt hear much criticizing about that (except from me). I think it's only fair that Porsche get to verify Nissan's findings since they used a Porsche as their "benchmark" and prop to sell their car. That is the most pathetic thing about it. Nissan didnt have enough confidence in the car to sell on it's own, so they had to try and make it seem better than the TT.
More importantly...does anyone recall Nissan quoting what they lapped the Nring with the 997TT? Funny how they left that out. Does their lack of comparison time substantiate Porsche's inability to produce a comparable 7:29 GT-R time? Or does it confirm that the 997TT really does lap a 7:38/7:40 and Nissan cheated their way to 7:29?
#369
10-07-2008, 08:16 AM
Nissan Headquarters in Tokyo has forwarded to us the new warranty book, I expect this to be found in every GTR before December 2008. The president Mr. Ghosn himself came up with this idea on 10/24/2007.
#370
10-07-2008, 08:19 AM
My oh my. Reality bites. Even one of the diehard huggers there is comparing used GTR costs to buying a used Ferrari. Pretty soon HC, the Nag's will be worshipping your effigy. Look at the top threads there:
Porsche finds Nissan cheating at Ring
Do not use VDC/Launch control or you're f'ed!
The g'dam clutch cannot be replaced separately!
how come no one makes a tranny upgrade?
things I hate about my GTR
I should have bought a GT3
Do not buy these lemon/abused GTR's
I got *** raped by the Nissan dealer, and didn't like it
Porsche finds Nissan cheating at Ring
Do not use VDC/Launch control or you're f'ed!
The g'dam clutch cannot be replaced separately!
how come no one makes a tranny upgrade?
things I hate about my GTR
I should have bought a GT3
Do not buy these lemon/abused GTR's
I got *** raped by the Nissan dealer, and didn't like it
1. A major recall and retrofit costing millions for Nissan, and putting a major blemish on their supercar.
or
2. GT-Rs will be sitting at a dealer's used car lot, waiting for unsuspecting fanboys to puchase with a "CPO" sticker on the windshield.
Oh BTW, I hear rumors that the Silver GT-R that was taken to Great Lakes Dragway even before the dealer prepped it, was thrashed to the point of being in the shop for transmission issues...with less than 50 miles.
#371
10-07-2008, 08:47 AM
I should do the maths hey? Okay here goes;
-Australia's population is just over 20 million whereas the US population is over 300 million - 15 times more than Australia.
- The US gets an allotment of 2500 GTR's, whereas Australia get's 200 GTR's.
- If you multiply 200 by 15, it comes to 3000. so as a ratio of cars to population, we in Australia actually get more GTR's per person than the US does.
- Now factor in the crazy car tax we have in Australia - the turbo is $340 grand, yet the average income is only AU$35 grand p.a and our dollar is around 80 US cents (up to 94 at one stage) and you can see why not many people can afford a 911 turbo. Hell, not many people would even be able to afford a GTR - let alone the Porsche.
200 cars may not seem like a lot to you HC, but as a ratio to the Australian population - IT IS A LOT.
You should do the maths and maybe think more logical before you start to blabber rubbish next time. Everyone knows your obsession with the demise of the GTR has clouded your senses.
I don't know why i even bother relpying to your statement. Wasted 5 minutes of my life.
-Australia's population is just over 20 million whereas the US population is over 300 million - 15 times more than Australia.
- The US gets an allotment of 2500 GTR's, whereas Australia get's 200 GTR's.
- If you multiply 200 by 15, it comes to 3000. so as a ratio of cars to population, we in Australia actually get more GTR's per person than the US does.
- Now factor in the crazy car tax we have in Australia - the turbo is $340 grand, yet the average income is only AU$35 grand p.a and our dollar is around 80 US cents (up to 94 at one stage) and you can see why not many people can afford a 911 turbo. Hell, not many people would even be able to afford a GTR - let alone the Porsche.
200 cars may not seem like a lot to you HC, but as a ratio to the Australian population - IT IS A LOT.
You should do the maths and maybe think more logical before you start to blabber rubbish next time. Everyone knows your obsession with the demise of the GTR has clouded your senses.
I don't know why i even bother relpying to your statement. Wasted 5 minutes of my life.
Isn't there a GTR forum, shouldn't you be discussing how great it is over there?
#373
10-07-2008, 09:03 AM
-Australia's population is just over 20 million whereas the US population is over 300 million - 15 times more than Australia.
- The US gets an allotment of 2500 GTR's, whereas Australia get's 200 GTR's.
- If you multiply 200 by 15, it comes to 3000. so as a ratio of cars to population, we in Australia actually get more GTR's per person than the US does.
- Now factor in the crazy car tax we have in Australia - the turbo is $340 grand, yet the average income is only AU$35 grand p.a and our dollar is around 80 US cents (up to 94 at one stage) and you can see why not many people can afford a 911 turbo. Hell, not many people would even be able to afford a GTR - let alone the Porsche.
- The US gets an allotment of 2500 GTR's, whereas Australia get's 200 GTR's.
- If you multiply 200 by 15, it comes to 3000. so as a ratio of cars to population, we in Australia actually get more GTR's per person than the US does.
- Now factor in the crazy car tax we have in Australia - the turbo is $340 grand, yet the average income is only AU$35 grand p.a and our dollar is around 80 US cents (up to 94 at one stage) and you can see why not many people can afford a 911 turbo. Hell, not many people would even be able to afford a GTR - let alone the Porsche.
I'm going to have to change my sig again...I rest my case.
Last edited by bbywu; 10-07-2008 at 09:11 AM.
#374
10-07-2008, 09:08 AM
Sounds like Heavy got your girly panties in a wad. How about you take them off and put on some real man boxers before you step up to the plate.
I would not include the aborigines as part of your population count. Last I heard they do not need all that power - but could use more pickup trucks though..
I would not include the aborigines as part of your population count. Last I heard they do not need all that power - but could use more pickup trucks though..
#375
10-07-2008, 09:27 AM
