997 TT beats GT-R at Ring. Nissan accused of cheating.

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#616

10-11-2008, 11:32 AM

cannga

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You've lost your cool, AND the argument my friend.

The thousands of posts on this show how tainted this car is. Too late.

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsherboy

HC, Cannga, Alpine....you guys are like the 3 stooges. Seriously, video footage from Nissan is STILL BETTER PROOF than a few words from a Porsche engineer!!! What part of that don't you guys understand?!!! Need i mention all the telemetary data that Nissan recorded and has published, along with the Dunlops that Nissan has kept for the 7:29 lap as well?

A person with half a brain can see that all these evidence from Nissan added up would be more believable than just a few words from a Porsche Engineer. C'mon, what crap are you guys going to pull out now? Oh, the usual "but the car has more hp than stock", "oh Nissan paid Dunlop to manufacture slicks that would look like normal Dunlops" Ahahahaha

#617

10-11-2008, 11:35 AM

cannga

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At this point, any "intelligent" shopper would NOT buy the GT-R without a detailed report of history, including whether VDC has ever been pushed.

<link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CCANPHA%7E1%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5 Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w

ontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><style>  </style> I have no doubt "intelligent" shoppers will NOT buy chrisn's car for example. If Nissan knows, that car no longer has a valid warranty. Oh how exquisite.<o>

</o>

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALPINE_997

Can - yeah - its good reading material while I am watching Football

I ask any GTR owner one question. If purchasing a pre-owned GTR would you consider it knowing you can't get any data from the dealership or the seller about how many times the VDC was turned off or the LC used?

Last edited by cannga; 10-11-2008 at 12:02 PM.

#618

10-11-2008, 11:39 AM

Prche951

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Quote:

Originally Posted by porsherboy

^^ Chrisn, you can't try and talk sensible logic to these bafoons. To beat them, you gotta bring yourself down to their level.

Why are you even in here. You are obviously not a porsche fan, so don't you go back and play with the other PS2 game players. You are definitely the idiot in here.

Chrisn, you forgot to add, that Nissan lies and you still have not explained how a 4000lb car with 500 hp can outrun a 3000lb car with 6000 hp and racing bred suspension (carrera GT) Do you think anyone with any sense is going to believe Nissan. Please explain this in physical and mechanical terms please.... In order for the GTR to even have a chance on the straights with the Carrera GT it would have to have 770 BHP!!!! Even then the extra 800 lbs of the GTR wold kill it in the corners!!!! please explain this amazing feat of defying the laws of physics to us.

I will keep on asking you this question until you can answer it.....

#619

10-11-2008, 11:50 AM

cannga

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Chris,

I hope you realize from my posts, I don't make things up even as I enjoy teasing about the GT-R so much.

Let's not beat around the bush about that VDC, despite of the rationalization and reassurance, bottom line is this: VDC on means the warranty is voided.

I know you are knowledgeable and experienced, from the mere fact that you imply here 7:29 is an impossible dream ("who cares" you wrote, and I agree, who cares, except that Nissan uses it with intention to deceive and to hurt competitor's reputation -- a line of basic honesty has been crossed), so let's not beat around the bush either about the cost to fix the tranny or to replace worn clutch.<link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CCANPHA%7E1%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5 Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w

ontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><style>  </style> No, it's not just "expensive," it's PROHIBITIVE.<o></o>
The car is fast. That I give you. But not THAT fast, and any intelligent shopper must be out of his mind to buy this car at this time. (I have this feeling you would not have bought yours had you known. You are too intelligent to do that.) Am I the only one seeing the problem here?! Why oh why am I the only one seeing the big problem here?

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisn

This thread is so long that some things need repeating:

Use of LC or VDC (PSM) "Off" do not "Void" the warranty. Nissan, however, can deny a claim if they think excessive LC caused the problem.

Does anyone really believe that this result would be different for any other car? Anyone out there with a 997 GT2 or F430 want to let me go to 20 LCs in a row? IF something gets fried, do you really think the manuf will cover it?

On 7:29 v 7:38: who cares. I've never ben to the Ring and prob never will. It's an interesting trivia fact whether they managed the mind-blowing 7:29 lap in a stock car, but that is but one piece of data from a MOUNTAIN of other data (HC: please note; a Mountain, not "none") tha suggests the GT-R is very very very very fact around tracks. Probably faster than the 997TT around most tracks with most drivers.

Tires: Dunlaps are standard on the base car; Potenzas are standard on the Premium car. I have no idea why the Dunlaps are faster in some tests (including Ring test) than the Potenzas (which are supposed to be max performance have have lower tread rsting (i.e., softer)). In other words, Dunlaps are NOT an "extra cost" option. In judging what is "stock" or not, contrast this to the MSPC which are not available on USDM TTs.

In terms of intelligent or dumb and believe versus deny, no one here has anything meaningful to add. The GT-R is surprisingly quick given its weight and power. Is that news? Do we need 49 pages to argue about that?

Maintenance costs are high; tranny is expensive if you nuke it. No one yet knows whether the car will hold up to "normal" abuse (tracking) long term. It's a risk.

Last edited by cannga; 10-11-2008 at 11:55 AM.

#620

10-11-2008, 11:51 AM

cannga

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Too late. I ain't talking to you any more. You've lost your cool and now are being ignored.

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsherboy

And why not? Chrisn has never used LC on his car before. The GTR, along with its transmission was built for track use - where LC is not needed. Ill be surprised if a GTR transmission breaks down from normal track use.
You guys aren't really interested in the truth are you? You and your buddies and your hero magician have made up your mind about the GTR long before it was even released.

#621

10-11-2008, 12:03 PM

kilodawg

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Uhm, maybe it's just me but I'd take the word of the Porsche engineer.

And the car is still freakin' ugly....

#622

10-11-2008, 12:10 PM

cannga

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^^^ "It only hurts when you smile."

#623

10-11-2008, 12:17 PM

kilodawg

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It's Porsche by the way.....but a profound statement none the less on your part

Can't you go play someplace else now for a while now?

#624

10-11-2008, 12:42 PM

USCCayman

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Kilodawg, I believe you have a good point. I think Porsche engineers know a thing or two about cars. It's Porsche engineers who have won Daytona more times than any other make, it's Porsche engineers who have won Le Mans more than any other make, it's Porsche engineers who have won Sebring more than any other make, it's Porsche enginners who designed and built the 956/962 which is the most successful racing prototype ever, It's Porsche engineers who built the 917/30 which was so successful it killed the CanAm, it's Porsche engineers who designed and built the 917/30 that ran the 221 mph lap at Talladega that set the world closed track record that stood for over a decade, It's Porsche engineers who give us the Porsche RS Spyder which not only has cleaned up in ALMS LMP2 for the last 3 years and, until they made it heavier could run neck and neck and defeat the LMP1 cars... I just got tired of typing " It's Porsche engineers", so I'll just type: that gave us the TAG Porsche motor that won the Formula 1 world championship three years in a row during the 1980's, that gave us the twin clutch transmission, the 959, that gave us the uber successful 935 that could actually turn laps faster than Formula 1 cars of the time, that built a hybrid car more than 100 years ago, and it was a Porsche engineer (old Ferdinand himself) who was voted the greatest automotive engineer of the 20th century. So yes, I agree with you, I'd have no trouble accepting the word of a Porsche engineer.

Last edited by USCCayman; 10-11-2008 at 12:44 PM.

#625

10-11-2008, 12:45 PM

Prche951

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Quote:

Originally Posted by porsherboy

asking Porshe what they think about Nissan is like asking a chick her age. You'll never get the truth.

Keep at it porsherbaby, because I see Bannishment in your future. You have brought nothing to this discussion as typical of a little troll. Not you or the other trollsh ave answered my last question because you cannot.

Nissan is good at lying, that is the only thing we have proven here on this thread. Some of the car companies porsche has on their radar as competitors is Ferrari, Dodge(viper), Chevy(corvette), Toyota and Acura(LMP2 class). Nissan is so far below the radar that the only way that they could surface and have Porsche take notice is to try and slander the 911 turbo with lies and have magazines propagate their lie. Good job nissan. you suck!!!!

#626

10-11-2008, 12:59 PM

USCCayman

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Another thing, some of the best race car drivers in the world have driven Porsches: Pedro Rodriguez, Alain Prost, Nikki Lauda, A J Foyt, Mark Donahue, Walter Rohl, Derek Bell, Joe Siffert, Al Holbert, Teo Fabi, Timo Bernard, etc., etc. It is completely ludicrous to suggest that Nissan could teach Porsche and it's drivers a thing or two about driving...at the N'Ring, no less!

#627

10-11-2008, 01:00 PM

kilodawg

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USCCayman,

You got my drift. In Germany engineering is a well respected profession. Porsche engineers are right up there with the best. I have no problem aligning myself with them at this point.

#628

10-11-2008, 01:15 PM

stradaONE8

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Quote:

Originally Posted by heavychevy

While I agree to a certain point, me driving a GT-R isnt going to be any confirmation of a ring time. I fully acknowledge that its a fast car, but until I see them without obviously inconsistent mag results, some of which obviously rigged, and beating the guys I knowto be fast in GT3's and Z06's, then I wont be convinced.

There is no way to really make a comparison based judgement unless you are driving them all GT2,GT3, GT-R, Z06, CGT, Scud etc etc etc. I have no interest in driving the GT-R either, so it will have to be a case where I'm asked to do so, because there wont be any where I will seek the opportunity.

I agree and fully support a independent fully verified test so we can see who is lying and what is true so this can be set to rest once and for all so people can go back to doing whatever they want, oh wait they already will, regardless of how much you ***** and moan.

That being said, you always use the "magazine racer" argument to discredit anyone arguing against you. But you ARE NOT any different than them, you simply choose to ignore it in respect to yourself.
Point is, if you're going to make the argument about others not having driven a GTR, then expect to be called out on that point yourself.
I don't care who you are, I am in no way intimidated by your presence, and since others don't care to point out/notice the glaring logically fallacies in your arguments, I do.

Beyond that, this is a forum of mostly grown men here posting, so telling them what to do isnt going to carry any weight. I get the most heat in this thread from the fanboys, and onversely the most support from people with similar opinions.

And again, I'm not enforcing a stop discussion, I've said many times I love to discuss cars. I merely point out how moot the point is until the independent head to head occurs and how silly the bickering is.
Also, if you happen to not know the definition of moot, it's an argument that is purely academic with little practical value or meaning.
I'm sorry if my take on what apparently is your life's crusade to defend Porsche/discredit Nissan offends you because I think it's petty and pointless.
I'm glad you have all day to argue on the internet with anonymous people and think that it actually matters in the least, I'm still going to make fun of you for it when I find time.

So like I always say, until you can balance out your arguement, which is clearly one sided (and on foreign turf no less), and show yourself a reputable member of this forum, your demands and ctiticisms wont gain much ground.

Umm, my argument is that there isn't a good one until things are verified. You can pull up facts that favor Porsche others can do so for Nissan. I understand why you are skeptical and I'm saying until someone dispels that, all you are doing is have a slap fight with GTR fans. It isn't as productive nor as meaningful as you convince yourself it is.

And for the final time, I'm on 6speed for other reasons than this and I don't care how reputable a bunch of people I've never met think I am. Their opinon of me has little relevance to my life.
And anyways, I am a bigger Porsche fan than a Nissan one when considering each manufacturer anyways. Just because I have a G35 doesn't mean I care about the company.
In the battle between the 997TT vs GTR, I DONT CARE either way, I'd like to know the result, but I could give a rats *** the outcome.

Don't project your obsession with this battle onto me, I have bigger fish to fry.

Please don't use your "not enough time" excuse in reply to this. Let's be honest, you apparently have little better to do than argue cars for hours on end.
You know you're going to read what I wrote, if you have anything to say it, or just stay tuned for me to point out where you arguments are flawed again at some point in time. And don't ask me to defend the GTR, if you haven't figured it out, I don't care.

#629

10-11-2008, 01:17 PM

Prche951

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Quote:

Originally Posted by stradaONE8

Please don't use your "not enough time" excuse in reply to this. Let's be honest, you apparently have little better to do than argue cars for hours on end.
You know you're going to read what I wrote, if you have anything to say it, or just stay tuned for me to point out where you arguments are flawed again at some point in time. And don't ask me to defend the GTR, if you haven't figured it out, I don't care.

if you didn't care you would not continue replying would you.

#630

10-11-2008, 01:26 PM

USCCayman

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Quote:

Originally Posted by kilodawg

USCCayman,

You got my drift. In Germany engineering is a well respected profession. Porsche engineers are right up there with the best. I have no problem aligning myself with them at this point.

If you think about it, German engineers were responsible for every type automobile motor: 4 stroke "Otto Cycle", Diesel, and Wankle (rotary. Although you'd be surprised at how many people think Mazda is resposible for the rotary). So yes, I have no problem with the veracity and knowledge of German engineers when it comes to cars.