997 TT beats GT-R at Ring. Nissan accused of cheating.
#736
10-13-2008, 11:20 AM
The GTR tranny thread has over 100k views and counting. The depreciation on a used GTR is going to be legendary. This is a great example of "live by the internet hype, die by the internet hype"
#737
10-13-2008, 11:40 AM
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#738
10-13-2008, 11:44 AM
I cant believe the hate from the GTR fanboise. It seems like after all those years of having to drive 240sx's and having to watch 40 years of 911s that they cant afford (not that they can afford a 110K GTR with Markup thats not going to stay that way for long with the economy the GTR will be in the 35K range where it belongs) they are just spewing.
thats all it is spewing. They cant even wait till the car gets its bugs worked out. And the bug in the GTR is the WHOLE Tranny!!!! You have ONE faked video to go spewing all over the world with. Not a Race win or a even one qualification but one Youtube video!! its laughable. If this was a Nissan forum I could understand MAYBE the low IQ but in this forum its ridiculous!
You children are speaking to some of the most accomplished owners and racers and you dont even have the brain cells to come in here with some respect for one of the greatest supercars in all of history with over 30 years of history behind it. You have one youtube video LOL!
You GTR guys come off like little kids (probably true) while talking to established owners and a manufacturer that is steeped in racing history.
You look like little whiners that still arent satisfied with the Piece O Crap that was stuffed down your throat at not 50K not 60K not 70K BUT NOW EIGHTY THOUSAND DOLLARS (soon to be 90 and 100K) with at LEAST a 20K-$30k Maintenance fee that Nissan didnt tell any one about, just to be treated like a Sentra owner and having the SAME Sentra mechanics work on their
"common supercar"
Really you guys dont deserve to post here. You should go to the Camaro forums and work your way up to the Corvette forums, and you dont have the history or experience to be there honestly
thats all it is spewing. They cant even wait till the car gets its bugs worked out. And the bug in the GTR is the WHOLE Tranny!!!! You have ONE faked video to go spewing all over the world with. Not a Race win or a even one qualification but one Youtube video!! its laughable. If this was a Nissan forum I could understand MAYBE the low IQ but in this forum its ridiculous!
You children are speaking to some of the most accomplished owners and racers and you dont even have the brain cells to come in here with some respect for one of the greatest supercars in all of history with over 30 years of history behind it. You have one youtube video LOL!
You GTR guys come off like little kids (probably true) while talking to established owners and a manufacturer that is steeped in racing history.
You look like little whiners that still arent satisfied with the Piece O Crap that was stuffed down your throat at not 50K not 60K not 70K BUT NOW EIGHTY THOUSAND DOLLARS (soon to be 90 and 100K) with at LEAST a 20K-$30k Maintenance fee that Nissan didnt tell any one about, just to be treated like a Sentra owner and having the SAME Sentra mechanics work on their
"common supercar"
Really you guys dont deserve to post here. You should go to the Camaro forums and work your way up to the Corvette forums, and you dont have the history or experience to be there honestly
Thats just about the most ignorant post I've seen on the Subject. I asume you must be a troll, as no-one could be so ill-informed in reality!
The GTR does have a lot of history from 1969 and many many race victories and was so successful it was banned from Australian Touring Car racing. Of course since the car was never in the US you probably never noticed that.
The counter to your argument of 'one video' is that with whole internet world is now obssessed with the 'one gearbox failure' that you use to define the whole car and company. The fact that my 996 GT2 gearbox blew-up and needed completely replacing at a cost of over $20k under warranty presumably also renders Porsche a fake producer of crap cars.
I have owned R32, R33 and R34 GTRs and have an R35 on order and have driven it on Silverstone GP track. I also own/owned 993RS/ 996GT2 (with Ruf 630bhp) and 997 GT2. I think that gives me the right to say that the GTR is an amazing car, even more so for the price.
#739
10-13-2008, 11:55 AM
^^^^ Thank you very much for being level headed and mature. I was about to post the history behind the GTR but honestly i'm not that much knowledgeable about it, except for the one in the 80's up to the present. A lot of the hate really extends from the fact that it's a Nissan first of all, so automatically it would be treated with plenty of snobbery and most of all that it is Japanese. Oldguy, In regards to the 7:29 video, it isn't fake, if it is, please prove it.
Last edited by jaeS4; 10-13-2008 at 11:57 AM.
#740
10-13-2008, 11:57 AM
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: ga
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Rep Power: 551 Alpine, i'll give you a good example. The 08 Vette with 430hp at around 3200lbs is just as quick as the e92 M3 with 414hp at 3600lbs. Logic would say that the Vette should walk or at least beat the M3 easily, not the case. The Vette might have a higher trap speed at the end of the 1/4 mile and is quicker by tenths of a second but they're virtually the same. Credit goes to the e92 M3 for putting power to the ground more efficiently but at the end the weight difference eventually puts the Vette ahead. So my point is, it's not always going to be a logical explanation. Much more variables are involved. The GTR is no different, even if i am right with the 540hp theory, it doesn't necessarily would mean it should be quicker or have a higher trap speed in a drag race, the track course would be a complete different story.
#2 The Corvette is 3300 lbs not 3200 (a difference of 350 lbs)
#3 116 mph to 111 mph is a pretty good beating.
How in the heck is that pretty much the same????
You want to say the GT-R is unlike any other car, but make it LESS efficient in it's application of power by requiring more much lower weight/power ratios than other cars to acheive the same performance???
The M3 makes up speed with the DSG!!!!!! If anything this is showing how much less power you need to go fast when you have DSG. NOT MORE POWER!!!!!!.
You are contradicting yourself with each new attempt at futility. Stop while you're behind.
#741
10-13-2008, 12:06 PM
#1 the Corvette is quicker, not just AS quick.
#2 The Corvette is 3300 lbs not 3200 (a difference of 350 lbs)
#3 116 mph to 111 mph is a pretty good beating.
How in the heck is that pretty much the same????
You want to say the GT-R is unlike any other car, but make it LESS efficient in it's application of power by requiring more much lower weight/power ratios than other cars to acheive the same performance???
The M3 makes up speed with the DSG!!!!!! If anything this is showing how much less power you need to go fast when you have DSG. NOT MORE POWER!!!!!!.
You are contradicting yourself with each new attempt at futility. Stop while you're behind.
#2 The Corvette is 3300 lbs not 3200 (a difference of 350 lbs)
#3 116 mph to 111 mph is a pretty good beating.
How in the heck is that pretty much the same????
You want to say the GT-R is unlike any other car, but make it LESS efficient in it's application of power by requiring more much lower weight/power ratios than other cars to acheive the same performance???
The M3 makes up speed with the DSG!!!!!! If anything this is showing how much less power you need to go fast when you have DSG. NOT MORE POWER!!!!!!.
You are contradicting yourself with each new attempt at futility. Stop while you're behind.
The Vette is at 12.4 while the M3 has been clocked as quick as 12.5, so for me that's virtually the same. 0-60 is pretty close, 4.0 for the Vette and around 4.2 for the M3, but that's the quickest i've seen, probably not the norm. The M3 was tested with the regular 6speed manual btw and so as the Vette. I also stated that the Vette has a higher trap speed at the end due to the weight difference, i never said it was close on that regard, just the time. And again please read my post, when i said the GTR is unlike any other car, that's not meant to praise the GTR, i'm just saying it's different not necessarilly better, that is all. So yes, the M3 is just as quick as the Vette. And i guarantee that the Ring time of the M3 is probably quicker than the Vette, i could be wrong but i'm almost sure i read it somewhere that it's quicker.
EDIT: I stand corrected, the M3 is 12.8 at 113mph and 4.3 to 60. Still pretty close considering it's over 3600lbs.
Never mind about the Ring time, was thinking about Autozeitung test track, in Germany with the Z06. Here it is.
BMW M3 Sedan (E90) 1:38.7 ´07 420 / 1680 Autozeitung
Lamborghini Gallardo Spyder 1:39.0 ´06 520 / 1720 Autozeitung
Chevrolet Corvette Z06 1:39.4 ´05 513 / 1420 Autozeitung
Last edited by jaeS4; 10-13-2008 at 02:18 PM.
#742
10-13-2008, 12:11 PM
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: ga
Posts: 8,934
Rep Power: 551 The counter to your argument of 'one video' is that with whole internet world is now obssessed with the 'one gearbox failure' that you use to define the whole car and company. The fact that my 996 GT2 gearbox blew-up and needed completely replacing at a cost of over $20k under warranty presumably also renders Porsche a fake producer of crap cars.
I have owned R32, R33 and R34 GTRs and have an R35 on order and have driven it on Silverstone GP track. I also own/owned 993RS/ 996GT2 (with Ruf 630bhp) and 997 GT2. I think that gives me the right to say that the GTR is an amazing car, even more so for the price.
Besides the GT2 is a manual, and you are just as likely to have caused the gearbox to blow up as it just being a faulty part. (percentage wise, not saying you did) The GT-R uses electronics to control everything, so not so much the case.
Also there are more than one gearbox failure,a whole slew of them in Japan, some grey market cars, some media cars, and now a few in the states. This is a limited production car, so there are only a few thousand built so far period.
#743
10-13-2008, 12:22 PM
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Rep Power: 551 The Vette is at 12.4 while the M3 has been clocked as quick as 12.5, so for me that's virtually the same. 0-60 is pretty close, 4.0 for the Vette and around 4.2 for the M3, but that's the quickest i've seen, probably not the norm. The M3 was tested with the regular 6speed manual btw and so as the Vette. I also stated that the Vette has a higher trap speed at the end due to the weight difference, i never said it was close on that regard, just the time. And again please read my post, when i said the GTR is unlike any other car, that's not meant to praise the GTR, i'm just saying it's different not necessarilly better, that is all. So yes, the M3 is just as quick as the Vette. And i guarantee that the Ring time of the M3 is probably quicker than the Vette, i could be wrong but i'm almost sure i read it somewhere that it's quicker.
For example the 405 hp C5 Z06 is still faster than both of the new generation C6's (400 hp and 436 hp) And the C6 has still been clocked at 12.2's, so NO the M3 is not as quick as the vette even with the Vette having a programmed handicap because of GM's poor build quality.
The C6 is an anomaly because it has a programmed hinderance, and will still walk away from the M3 from a roll or after 1/4 mile speeds.
#744
10-13-2008, 01:03 PM
^^^^^^^^Again HC, i said virtually as quick. 12.4 to 12.8 is not much of a difference, probably 1/3 of a car lenght. But i agree that 112 to 119 is a huge difference especially after the 1/4 mile where the Vette will pull away. But i have seen races from a roll from 50mph where the M3 pulled away, but that could be easily the drivers fault.
#745
10-13-2008, 02:24 PM
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Now it's possible that Nissan may have driven the ring with the VDC off, but wont allow customers to do so. At any rate, is that standard production is it's being driven in an unallowed mode??
The fact that the intent of VDC off is to cut off all electronic aids completely so more power can get to the wheels (according to Nissan). And the cars are losing a few mph in trap speed compared to VDC off.
Any opinions?
The fact that the intent of VDC off is to cut off all electronic aids completely so more power can get to the wheels (according to Nissan). And the cars are losing a few mph in trap speed compared to VDC off.
Any opinions?
#747
10-13-2008, 02:37 PM
That would be great at the 'ring, but don't forget that the GTR has already beaten the CGT on the Top Gear Test Track.
The car used for that is a personal imported car, bought in Japan, by a friend of a close friend of mine and was totally stock when tested. There are still no Euro-spec cars available, so all the cars that are in the UK currently are Jap-spec cars imported over here, either new or used by enthusiasts.
The car used for that is a personal imported car, bought in Japan, by a friend of a close friend of mine and was totally stock when tested. There are still no Euro-spec cars available, so all the cars that are in the UK currently are Jap-spec cars imported over here, either new or used by enthusiasts.
#748
10-13-2008, 02:38 PM
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#749
10-13-2008, 02:39 PM
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Rep Power: 60 Guy, am no way trying to offend you but you have to agree with me that Nissan is being fishy here, launch control, warranty void, transmission problems, and the list continues, I certainly should be worried if I have one of these...