well there's already 2 tuners working on stronger internals which will work with LC as many times as you like. Pretty cool if you ask me!

And its pretty lame to talk to the heavycheavy coz the guy just never gives up, his mind cannot accept anything but his own arguments.

 

The tuners are all having difficulty making the thing stronger withing the comfined space. Nissan could always swap their weak box for the super strong Veyron. My guess is that this wont happen any time soon.

 

Next you can tell us all about how the moon landing was faked, and how aliens shot Kennedy.

 

Upgrade costs more than halfa new tranny, and you still have a weak clutch that cant support much more power.

And still warranty void is anything goes wrong that's connected to any of that. I doubt the tuners will want to warranty a 20k tranny either so you risk ending up being out 30k.


Pretty lame being a troll and complaining about being called on it too.

 

It would be cool if NISSAN was working on this instead of forcing customers to go aftermarket and completely blow the drivetrain warranty

 

...The Bugatti is a million dollar car with a transmission that cost more than a GT-R. Of course its gonna be well developed and better engineered. I don't know why they are even being compared as a Bugatti-type trans is way beyond budget constraints. I can understand your frustrations with Nissan's way of marketing this car (kind of like a slick talking politician) because I feel the same way about it. It's a capable car with a LOT OF FINE PRINT AND STRINGS ATTACHED TO IT. They keep hush hush about the "LC function" when mags continue to use it implying to customers that it's ok. They prefer the car to be left completely stock and modifying it is taking a chance; weak trans, plasma lined cylinders. Alot of this keep the fun out of owning a car, but what do you expect when you pay 70 large to get one? Bottom line is that you can't expect to get a car with Porsche Turbo-like reliability and support for half the price. It almost makes the Porsche seem like it's worth the money to save the headaches from owning a GT-R. The only gripe I have with you is your disagreement with real-world performance and track numbers quoted by real people (almost implying them as liars) when it is compared against other stock cars.

When run stock for stock (key phrase) many people and nearly all the media has reported the car as being quicker around a track setting. It's the fan boys that say it's a better car, which I completely disagree with. It might have better tech and be quicker, but it's not a better built car, although that alone doesn't take it away from being a cool car! As always in life you get what you pay for. Would I get one? As long it's built like a Porsche or if I like my cars stock, yes, but it's far from being a Porsche and the fun in owning a car in addition to driving it is modding it so as of now...no. The expensive up-keep, weak links of the car, and Nissan's stringent warranty is more than enough for anyone to shy against it.

I could also understand your frustrations with the media as well, because they hail this car as king and the best out there, but fail to mention what can possibly go wrong by owning one. Don't know if that's a Nissan tactic or media ignorance/naiveness. I just don't go as far as thinking all the tests are shams. The numbers are real, but only under the expense of risking warranty or breaking parts. The only thing Nissan proved with the GT-R is that it can build a car quicker than a Porsche (under track settings), but not better than one.

 

[quote=jpvarghese;2117817]...The Bugatti is a million dollar car with a transmission that cost more than a GT-R. Of course its gonna be well developed and better engineered. quote]

The point is that Bugatti knew they needed to build a better tranny from an existing one. They didn't re-invent the DSG tranny did they? No they modified it know they were putting it under very very high HP and Torque. They did their homework because they had needed it to work and work over time.

Nissan in their infinite wisdom released a tranny that couldn't handle the HP/Torque. So here is a list of things.

1) Over 30 reported problems with the tranny in the US. Do your research I did mine. I will give you a start Florida has over 7 and Georgia has over 4. You come up with the rest. Those are only 2 states. Wait til spring when the upper northern GTR owners get a chance to drive again.
2) Product Manager shows people on video how to use LC!!! SMART FELLA!
3) Nissan voided a few trannies and comes out with another statement saying they do not warranty LC(they admit its there) and then after a few more failures said they will not void tranny warranty exclusively on the VDC being turned off but other factors will have to apply like LC!
4) Clutch is a non-serviceable part.
5) Gears is a non-serviceable part. If they were - VOID DRIVETRAIN WARRANTY.
6) PUMP RECALL ON ALL CARS in JAPAN. And they still have problems.
7) EURO LAWS stalling the delivery for GTR's. Little blackbox denial of warranty doesn't hold up well in Europe.
8) High Cost of up keep when used on track. 1800km suggested fluids flushed? $80 a quart at 10 quarts. Are you kidding me? Thats only one portion of the fluid change requirement/suggestion.
9) Track usage in JAPAN voids ENTIRE WARRANTY! - Wow how nice of them. Limiting the speed and then limit the only reason to have all that power. Let's encourage drag racing and light to light line ups.


Someone asked if Porsche would warranty 30 LC's with their new PDK. I am assuming YES since they show you how to use it and advertise it! WOW i know they admit they have it as a feature! Find me a disclosure form being signed on the new PDK. Show me in the owners manual where they void drivetrain for its usage. Abuse is subjective and that NISSAN FANBOYS is where having a relationship with your dealership can garner you some favors if need be. They can MAKE THEIR OWN DAMN DECISIONS AT THE LOCAL LEVEL! They don't have to call HANS in Germany to get opinion. They don't have to send the whole PDK tranny back to Germany to a complete inspection and have the customer wait 2 MONTHS to get a word on it. Oh wait NISSAN doesn't do that. They just void your warranty and send you a thank you letter.

P.S. Use some of that great engineering and put better fluids in your tranny as well as better gears. Also reduce the tolerance for the tranny temps so therefore if LC is used it won't work when the fluids are boiling. That would also help you on the track where some people have reported issues. Maybe install a metal detector down there while you are at it. Reports of metal shavings on the bottom of the pan is not good is it? They can hook it up to the PS3 and have it beep as more and more parts fall to the bottom.


Any Nissan fanboys want to refute my list of 9?.. Nagroc is not a good source to quote from. They only believe STILL that one tranny was denied warranty.

 

Alpine, I don't refute anything you are saying as the facts are gonna be the facts. I just don't understand what people think they're getting after dropping 70 grand. If the transmission they have on the car is gonna cost 20k with what it can handle, just imagine how much a beefier trans. from the factory will amount to in the total cost of the car. You get what you pay for. Nissan could have easily made a 150k car with all the reliability in the world, but no one is gonna drop that amount ever, on a Nissan. Nissan just misled customers into believing they are getting a bargain by spending 70k on a car that performs like one priced 150k. They just "forgot" to implement the associated costs and mention repercussions. You are also comparing this DSG to a PDK in a car with much less hp/far less torque. Of course it's going to be more forgiving. The only way you can compare the two is if PDK was available on the Turbo, which as of now it is not probably because Porsche knows the limitations of it. The only thing I disagree with many members here is their refusal to accept common, consistent published results and achievements of this car from many mags and owners; calling it a ploy/conspiracy..........regardless of its negatives. How luny does that sound? As I've said before, the GT-R might be quicker, but it's certainly not a better car.

 

It's a bit dull going over the same issues time and time again ...

All cars have warranty issues, especially new models. I have heard horror stories from virtually every prestige manufacturer you can think of (including Porsche, and especially Lamborghini and Ferrari). See what happens when you use the Ferrari launch control and your gearbox turns into shrapnel - no warranty, no help, nothing. Check what BMW's approach with launch control and SMG was in Europe (though they were sensible enough, like Ferrari are, not to let US customers near it).

There is nothing wrong with the GT-R gearbox - in fact, it's awesome to use, by far the best I've tried. I'd say the biggest problem is the fact that the car is cheap in the US, making it accessible to idiots and rednecks, of which there appear to be many. Combine that with the ridiculous litigation culture and a complete refusal to take responsibility for one's own actions in the States and you can see why Nissan should have never have let slip about any launch control. That aside, I can't think of any manufacturer that would ever stand by damage caused by innumerable full-bore standing starts. In any case, launch control is an entirely pointless feature - it excites the teenagers but is completely irrelevant to how an adult will ever use the car - if you are really so hung up about a fraction of a second in the quarter mile, buy a Top Fueler.

As for the gearbox parts and servicing, it uses the BorgWarner DualTronic wet clutches and control system, just like the Veyron does, and just like VAG group cars do. If you took the time to look at how they work, you would understand that it's not quite the same as a normal gearbox and consequently wear, maintenance and replacements are not going to be the same as a standard manual gearbox. The ZF bits in PDK are the same (and, as we have seen, PDK isn't immune to problems ... ).

It seems to me that the GT-R's biggest problems (other than the internet warriors) are Nissan's marketing department and dealers, not the product itself.

 

That's just wonderful--80 grand is cheap, making it accessible to rednecks and idiots in the US who abuse the car. To most Americans, 80 grand is alot of money, certainly not the kind of car most americans can afford. That's around Cayman S territory, actually more, and I can assure you that there aren't a lot of low lifes buying Caymans and abusing them. I have one and I go to the Cayman clubsite often, and the vast majority of owners treat them like babies. I doubt folks are buying GTRs and then running to the dragstrip to tear them up. That is just a ridiculous excuse.

 

Do you think using launch control thirty or forty times before the car is even run in is acceptable?

 

You can not compare the buyer of an 80K rice rocket to an 80K German sports car. The demographics speak for themselves, and while the comments aren't exactly accurate, replace redneck with punk kid and idiot with idiot and you have a pretty realistic picture of who is buying the GTR. Its the Civic, Lancer, STI of the moment, like the old Z, Supra, etc of yesterday. These kids bought these cars thinking they could pop on over to any local ricearoni tuner to get more power to beat other punks at the local stop light. When you are given a piece of paperwork that states void of warranty at delivery will take place by the following actions, you run out of there. Kids don't read, they sign 15% APR loans for 72 months
Let them keep selling GTR's, so far in Chicago I have not seen one on the road, hmmmmm where could they all be?

 

http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=236008

 

At least you are civil about the arguements at hand. I never said the 7:29 didn't happen. I never said the car wasn't as some people described for the money. Our points as most on here have been saying is that the NISSAN FanBOYS came over to throw dirt on the Porsche thinking a few 0-60 times and a 1/4 drag is capable of dethroning a car that has withstood the test of time, mods and economy.

The PDK has been running in the TWIN Turbo Panamera V8 for a while now from what I was told. So that has to be able to handle the Torque. Not sure of a LC but I am sure they will have it available at release. So the PDK is being tested with bigger HP motors at the moment.

Trommel - who is sounding like a broken record? Then you take a stab at the GTR Fanclub by calling them REDNECKS? The last time I checked there weren't too many of them driving the GTRs. I saw 6 this weekend and no REDNECKS..

If 80K is cheap + the markup then I guess I need to be a REDNECK as well.

Your magazine quotes won't help you win an arguement. But your comments about GTR owners will definately not help you win points. I am sure you are not keeping score. Then again who is..

In your infinite wisdom can you tell me how many reported cases can you come up with for the PDK? as well as the SMG in Europe or in US that was refused warranty for ABUSE? I don't mean warranty - I mean warranty for ABUSE...

 

I cant argue with much of what you said. I only made comparison with the Veyron to show what kind of budget or Porsche to show what kind of time it takes to expend the capabilities of a DSG.

I've stated many times which tests dont make sense and without a doubt why I have a problem with them. Never said otherwise. Dont know how many times I can say that.

As far as Nissan being able to build a faster car, never said other than that, in fact, who cant build a car faster than a TT? There are plenty out there. Only stating my case against the test that are obviously rigged, and the discrepancies between the mag world and the real one. If you truly beleive the GT-R can go toe to toe with a CGT, or even a legit driver in a GT3, then we'll just have to disagree, because I've seen otherwise.