Want to guess who gets smashed if they run a 2010 GTR as opposed to an '09? This really is getting to be quite a trend. A 2006 GT3 Race Car catches up with a tuned R32 (1989) and now the 2010 911T has caught the '09 GTR..... maybe... and this in a magazine that drives 911s better than they do other cars.


Well your link says the GT1 was based on the Z06. So you post a link to prove a point then say it's wrong??? Frankly it matters not. So if the ZR1 chassis isn't superior to a Z06's, why did they build the ZR1 for homologation purposes (getting back to the original argument, now many moons ago). Just love these strawman diversion.

WHAT? WHAT? You take it in the....



2.5.


Yeah we know, you've used it for the 911T enough times. The difference is that when you used it 2 production cars were being compared, not a dry carbon bodied race car. Wonder what would happen if someone dry carbon bodied a GTR?

But congrats you beat a tuner R32 (1989) with a professional race car. There's progress.

Millions? Really? So the HKS Evo parts and labour cost millions? You're talking tosh again.

What class would that be below Street Class? Street class for retarded kids? The Mines GTR often competes up a class but it is a Street Class car not an Open Class one.

None of those cars had more money in it than that GTR. Hence why none of them were full dry carbon fibred. I mean can it even be classed as the same chassis when that's done. **** we'll just put the Mine's or XS engine in a GT500 GTR and put Toyo Proxes RA-1s on it. Surely that classes as a tuner car no?

 

Man. From reading these posts, you would think that BD works for Nissan? Or at least own a couple of these GTR's. Passionate indeed.

 

You haven't been around enough tuners to know the tips and tricks they use to make cars fast, I'll give you a hint, it's the same stuff used to make race cars fast. The Cup Car still was down well over 200 hp. And GOTO racing had an almost 800 whp car at the same place this year and ran roughly the same time. 1:49. Almost twice the hp in a car they are building to Speed WC specs. But a 450 hp GT3 cup still runs with it.

Who's outclassed again?

 

He'd need to be a little smarter to work for Nissan.

Oh wait, maybe not, that mentality is what made them build a 4000 lb track car.

He doesn't or never will own a GT-R, but he stayed at a holliday in express last night.

 

Nobody cares except Porsche, Corvette, Aston Martin, Ferrari, etc. You think everyone who watches Le Mans is only there for the prototypes?
The GT1 Nissan you're talking about has the V8 and is RWD, correct?

So what you're saying is that when you specify the optional $3k color on the GT-R, the car is no longer stock? After all, if it were stock, you shouldn't have to pay extra for it.
How much are Nissan charging for the Spec V?
My comparison with the modded Vette is relevant: it's using modified vs stock, just like you were using. Don't cry about it simply because a Vette with $20k in mods will beat the GT-R. (It's actually closer to $30k, BTW.)

I'm going to prove myself right, by using a test that you YOURSELF posted:
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...1-post199.html
That is not a 2008 GT-R. You = owned.

Seats = entire car? Go ahead and tell me you can customize a GT-R the same way you can a Porsche.
There are also elements in the Porsche designed to give more driver satisfaction. It's not just about going faster.

There can't be reasons for owning a Porsche other than for straightline speed? I'll bet you there are. And it is a bang-per-buck argument. You've pretty much said that anyone who buys anything else other than a GT-R is a fool, and even used modified vs stock comparison to make your point, oblivious to the fact that a base 'Vette with $30k in mods will walk all over the GT-R.

 

The never-ending argument/debate continues.

Corvette owners everywhere are rejoicing since instead of Porsche 911 Turbo versus Z06, the GTR has everyone's collective attention now.

Having driven both, I can tell you that the GTR is a VERY different car than my 996TT, and if you're into the entire experience of driving and feeling like you're contributing to the process, the Porsche is in a different league.

In terms of what is ultimately faster/quicker, this isn't an argument that is going to be won or lost here, or on any other internet thread. I'm thankful for the R35 GTR since it heavily influenced the 997.2 TT...competition improves the breed for all of us to enjoy (and debate endlessly).

 

This is interesting: http://www.motortrend.com/features/l...lap/index.html

"No caveats here. No cheater tires or modifications allowed."

 

BD you are 0-2 in calling BS. And continue to make false statement after false statement. You could at least be a good googler if you're going to google.

No one cares about GT2 racing? HAHAH it was the only thing that kept ALMS alive this year. NO ONE cares about GT1 cars that don't resemble street cars in any way. That's why Corvette left after acing themselves for a year and only a handfull of cars at Lemans in GT1. There were only 4-5 total prototypes at some races. The manufacturers care about GT2 because every else does which is why real GT racing sells cars.

Name one other racing series that has more manufacturer FACTORY involvement that ALMS GT2...........

Porsche
Ferrari
BMW
Corvette
Jaguar
Aston Martin

Plus privateer teams with some factory help from:

Dodge
Panoz
Ford

Even lexus had plans on entering

You can't name a series because there isn't one. Even F1 only had:

Ferrari
Mercedes
Renault
BMW
Toyota

And most of those are leaving , not coming. Honda left last year, only to be followed by BMW, and possibly Renault and Toyota this year, Lotus is coming only as a chassis manufacturer.

All have FACTORY teams racing. But Nissan decides to go to Europe and race vs a bunch of privateers in car that doesn't resemble the street car much and has many changes to the chassis.

Don't try to diminish the series because the GT-R can't compete in it, due to a fat, useless for racing chassis and concept.

And who cares about Tuner R34's? Where are they nationally and internationally broadcasted? How many of them run in LeMans? And aren't you the one bragging about Targa Tasmania...... hahahahahah, the nerve of some people.

When the GT-R's win something outside of Japan in real GT-R chassis, then you can talk, until then............. 911 > GT-R when it comes to racing, PERIOD. And that's not including the rest of Porsche > Nissan. Porsche has 3 different 911's capable of beating the rest of the World on the track and in the street, Nissan has one gun (or lap) in the barrel and Dunlop to thank for their success.

You are very passionate about how you feel and that is ok, but you are completely, how would you say, "out-classed" in this discussion. Your ACTUAL knowledge of the subject is infantile, and your perception of reality is quite skewed.

Time to accept the fact that you can't out google real knowledge and passion for racing. When you start to really care about racing, maybe you'll gain some real knowledge.

 

Oh look a Shelby GT500 is almost as fast as a 911 Turbo. What a great test. Next.

 

Why are you so relentless? Just stop!!!

 

His avatar is hella cute though!

 

Oh yes, I've been proved wrong re: tuner cars because a full-on professional racing Porsche can beat a tuned R32. You get funnier every day chevy.

Did we start a new game because I thought the score, including 997.1 arguments and 997.2 arguments was about 30-something to nothing?

You think anyone actually sits down in front of the TV and watches an endurance racing event from start to finish like an F1 GP? Most people only see the headlines, which look at the higher categories. That's why as an advertising aid to a company it sucks, hence nobody really bothers much with it. Much like Grp N rallying results. I mean who won this year? Who knows. I could tell you who won the F1 but these hokey-pokey categories, who gives a monkey's ***.

Name one racing event that has more manufacturer investment than F1? Plus Ferrari, BMW, Mercedes, McLaren, Renault, Lotus (next year), Toyota (get well soon - went the way of Porsche - OUT!),

Well they've been pseudo-relegated from F1 so they have to go to the nearest soup kitchen.

Name a series that has $150m of investment per team. Porsche couldn't hang.

Maybe that's because they can build a car that works better on the street and couldn't give a rats *** about a 12 hour long race on slicks that has about as much applicability to a road car as the Red Bull air race has to Red Bull. The 911 succeeds in such long races because it doesn't use it's tyres very well. When I decide to go at it hard, how my car will be consistently performing an hour later means jack diddly squat to me.

"Oh you've just span off a roundabout, too bad because you could have done the same roundabout at 95% of the speed 300 times over with me, the GT3." Yes, thanks for that.

Could you explain why Porsche lost in GT300 against a 350Z and an IS350 anyway.

You mean like you try to diminish F1 because Porsche can't compete in it.

How many people who make comments like this actually run in Le Mans themselves? I'll give a **** about Le Mans when I'm a Le Mans driver. I.e. never. All the time I here people referring to lap times set by Le Mans drivers in cars that they'd never be able to drive anywhere near as fast. It's nice to know that the outright abilities of a 2010 GTR are better than a GT3 but it's even nicer to know that it's a car I could drive twice as fast as those other cars without being Jacky f'kin' Ickx. Tuner RB GTRs are a car I know I can drive without holding back. Same for most people. Hence the applicability. I don't have to find a nice flat road or track in order to start tempting a triple-axle backflip into oblivion.

Could the GT3R not compete in Japan.... against 350Zs.

Well so far Porsche has no street cars that can beat the 2010 GTR. Keep up the good work.

This looks like a win to me in a real road situation in a very stock-looking car:

http://www.gtrblog.com/tag/targa-tasmania/,,that/


Heavy, nobody is out-classed by you. There are stool samples in a perspex container which you are incapable of out-classing

I do have a passion for cars but I'm not a delluded middle-aged freak who spends half my time pretending I'm the Fonz and the other half pretending I'm a Le Mans champion (who didn't even know which side of tyres wore quickest in another thread).

 

What are you and Heavy arguing about?

THE GTR WON THE COMPARO. AUTOBUILD ALSO SAID IT WAS BETTER.

The 997.2TT is substacially lighter and more powerful than the GTR. Yet $154,000 later, it is still slower around a track than the GTR.

We've all heard Heavy's excuse for the Turbo losing. But so far, two different German publications have given the same result.

You dont need to give reasons for why the GTR won. Excuses are for losers.

 

Yes, they often do but they're not an Unlimited Class car. If you knew anything you would know this much. It's a Street Class car, fact.

Only in chevyworld.

Comparisons on a home track. You then moved to a different Porsche racecar and a different track and still barely managed to beat a proper tuner R32 running low boost. Well done. Give yourself a round of applause then a round in the head.


Oh so you're including design & development and engineering costs for the parts HKS make. Well why didn't you say. Now lets start totting up the design and development cost for all the racing parts and CF body in the GMG car + testing. That's what 10s of millions. 100s maybe. I mean Motons, how much did they cost to develop? Dummy.


Wrong. 2009 spec. was the first Euro Spec.

Next year we will get a Euro-spec 2010
http://www.motorward.com/2009/11/201...european-spec/

 

Originally Posted by BD-

You think anyone actually sits down in front of the TV and watches an endurance racing event from start to finish like an F1 GP? Most people only see the headlines, which look at the higher categories. That's why as an advertising aid to a company it sucks, hence nobody really bothers much with it. Much like Grp N rallying results. I mean who won this year? Who knows. I could tell you who won the F1 but these hokey-pokey categories, who gives a monkey's ***.


You are not serious right? Some people watch F1 from start to finish and some people watch ALMS start to finish. It all depends on what kind of racing you are fan of. I for one try to watch ALMS every week. From start to finish if I have the time. Your statement just shows how narrow minded you are. What makes you think that people only watch F1 racing and that is the only series that matters? I watch F1 too, but I don't find it as enjoyable as ALMS because the palying field is really not even as it could be in F1. Also, I relate better to road going race cars in the GT2 class. For you to make a wise *** narrow minded comment like "hokey-pokey categories" makes me wonder what kind of motorsport fan you really are? So based on your statement, Nascar, Indy, and even the JGTC (where GTR's race) are all useless series right?


Originally Posted by BD-
Name one racing event that has more manufacturer investment than F1? Plus Ferrari, BMW, Mercedes, McLaren, Renault, Lotus (next year), Toyota (get well soon - went the way of Porsche - OUT!),

I thought part of your argument was that the GTR is a better bank for the buck supercar. Now you want to use how much F1 teams spend as part of your argument? Where is the value story in how much F1 teams spend? BTW, Nissan isn't even in F1, so what's the point?


Originally Posted by BD-
Name a series that has $150m of investment per team. Porsche couldn't hang.

Porsche doesn't need to hang. They have nothing more to prove in motorsports.


I was actually enjoying this debate between you and heavy until this.