5.90sec 60-130mph Record - 997.2 Turbo - PTF protune and exhaust, pump gas
#31
12-02-2014 | 01:35 PM
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For the record, 100 RON is not 100 "octane" fuel and so on.
Octane = RON+MON/2. Generally for pump fuels there is an 8-10 spread between RON and MON
For example, premium 93 octane fuel in the US generally has a RON of 98.x and MON of 87-88.x
Octane = RON+MON/2. Generally for pump fuels there is an 8-10 spread between RON and MON
For example, premium 93 octane fuel in the US generally has a RON of 98.x and MON of 87-88.x
#32
12-02-2014 | 01:36 PM
That would make sense
Unfortunately the UK is a little stringent with their pump fuel and the max is 99 Ron.
I went to Germany earlier in the year and they have 102 octane at the pump there, and the difference in how the car ran was huge.
With 100 octane fuel and good conditions, I would say those results are pretty good.
However it's not comparable to most people's pump fuel access.
Would be more of a race fuel tune for us over here and US pump fuel users.
Unfortunately the UK is a little stringent with their pump fuel and the max is 99 Ron.
I went to Germany earlier in the year and they have 102 octane at the pump there, and the difference in how the car ran was huge.
With 100 octane fuel and good conditions, I would say those results are pretty good.
However it's not comparable to most people's pump fuel access.
Would be more of a race fuel tune for us over here and US pump fuel users.
We've tuned countless BMW N54s and N55s on the German 102 RON sold there by Aral. It performs far better than typical US 93 octane or Euro 98 RON. I can only wish we had that up here locally to us, let alone E85.
#33
12-02-2014 | 01:55 PM
@wolfehedge, I'm sorry but please have the courtesy to us in this thread. If we do find anything that even remotely points at a falsified record we will have it addressed publicly and will have this removed accordingly. Until then I'd ask you to please stop repeatedly insinuating at least the nitrous usage on this car as we've taken the time to explain in multiple posts why using nitrous on this particular car in such a way/volume would have potential catastrophic side effects on the motor given fuel limitations.
Through testing we have taken this car to 24.5psi peak and incurred fuel pressure drops at the HPFP in multi-gear pulls in mid 5k range in 4th gear. There is no room for nitrous on a 997.2 with the OEM fuel system and no secondary fueling in place at all.
Through testing we have taken this car to 24.5psi peak and incurred fuel pressure drops at the HPFP in multi-gear pulls in mid 5k range in 4th gear. There is no room for nitrous on a 997.2 with the OEM fuel system and no secondary fueling in place at all.
#34
12-02-2014 | 02:07 PM
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Let's get some civility back in this thread or action will be taken...in a civil discussion your point can be made without name calling or just being insulting/rude
#35
12-02-2014 | 02:21 PM
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Pump gas in greece as far as i know is pretty bad.. maybe like 94US octane at its best
I know PTF from n54 forums, Dzenno is a nice guy and a good professional
To get to the point, I dont know about 997.2, but that older 4.84s record on a (upgraded) vtg car seems impossible to me... I know that my 4.97s 60-130 run, even could be bettered by a faster shift, was a crazy pull, a lot of boost, bigger turbos, lightweight, etc.. noting to compare with a VTG car performance, been in one and raced it too, day and night compared to my car
Records still come... M3s, 997s, etc... And maybe you can get a perfect 60-130 once, or ....ok....maybe can be done with 2 different cars ... but I already know of 3 different platforms (M3, 997.1, 997.2) where you own not only the best time, but this is way lower than others..and 997s are AWD and TIP/PDK.. driver input is minimal.... and that is just improbable, dont want to argue but its just statistical very improbable if we are comparing apples to apples, so if the car isnt totally stripped, than it has more power that all the others, knowing its a pump tune, how much more timing/boost can it deliver over any other setup ? Or where is the difference ? I am excluding the possibility that all of us are stupid and can not drive our cars, repeatedly and on various platforms..
Man I wish you go on Nurburgring.. who knows ?
I know PTF from n54 forums, Dzenno is a nice guy and a good professional
To get to the point, I dont know about 997.2, but that older 4.84s record on a (upgraded) vtg car seems impossible to me... I know that my 4.97s 60-130 run, even could be bettered by a faster shift, was a crazy pull, a lot of boost, bigger turbos, lightweight, etc.. noting to compare with a VTG car performance, been in one and raced it too, day and night compared to my car
Records still come... M3s, 997s, etc... And maybe you can get a perfect 60-130 once, or ....ok....maybe can be done with 2 different cars ... but I already know of 3 different platforms (M3, 997.1, 997.2) where you own not only the best time, but this is way lower than others..and 997s are AWD and TIP/PDK.. driver input is minimal.... and that is just improbable, dont want to argue but its just statistical very improbable if we are comparing apples to apples, so if the car isnt totally stripped, than it has more power that all the others, knowing its a pump tune, how much more timing/boost can it deliver over any other setup ? Or where is the difference ? I am excluding the possibility that all of us are stupid and can not drive our cars, repeatedly and on various platforms..
Man I wish you go on Nurburgring.. who knows ?
#36
12-02-2014 | 02:24 PM
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@wolfehedge, I'm sorry but please have the courtesy to us in this thread. If we do find anything that even remotely points at a falsified record we will have it addressed publicly and will have this removed accordingly. Until then I'd ask you to please stop repeatedly insinuating at least the nitrous usage on this car as we've taken the time to explain in multiple posts why using nitrous on this particular car in such a way/volume would have potential catastrophic side effects on the motor given fuel limitations.
Through testing we have taken this car to 24.5psi peak and incurred fuel pressure drops at the HPFP in multi-gear pulls in mid 5k range in 4th gear. There is no room for nitrous on a 997.2 with the OEM fuel system and no secondary fueling in place at all.
Through testing we have taken this car to 24.5psi peak and incurred fuel pressure drops at the HPFP in multi-gear pulls in mid 5k range in 4th gear. There is no room for nitrous on a 997.2 with the OEM fuel system and no secondary fueling in place at all.
#37
12-02-2014 | 02:46 PM
#38
12-02-2014 | 02:53 PM
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Pump gas in greece as far as i know is pretty bad.. maybe like 94US octane at its best
I know PTF from n54 forums, Dzenno is a nice guy and a good professional
To get to the point, I dont know about 997.2, but that older 4.84s record on a (upgraded) vtg car seems impossible to me... I know that my 4.97s 60-130 run, even could be bettered by a faster shift, was a crazy pull, a lot of boost, bigger turbos, lightweight, etc.. noting to compare with a VTG car performance, been in one and raced it too, day and night compared to my car
Records still come... M3s, 997s, etc... And maybe you can get a perfect 60-130 once, or ....ok....maybe can be done with 2 different cars ... but I already know of 3 different platforms (M3, 997.1, 997.2) where you own not only the best time, but this is way lower than others..and 997s are AWD and TIP/PDK.. driver input is minimal.... and that is just improbable, dont want to argue but its just statistical very improbable if we are comparing apples to apples, so if the car isnt totally stripped, than it has more power that all the others, knowing its a pump tune, how much more timing/boost can it deliver over any other setup ? Or where is the difference ? I am excluding the possibility that all of us are stupid and can not drive our cars, repeatedly and on various platforms..
Man I wish you go on Nurburgring.. who knows ?
I know PTF from n54 forums, Dzenno is a nice guy and a good professional
To get to the point, I dont know about 997.2, but that older 4.84s record on a (upgraded) vtg car seems impossible to me... I know that my 4.97s 60-130 run, even could be bettered by a faster shift, was a crazy pull, a lot of boost, bigger turbos, lightweight, etc.. noting to compare with a VTG car performance, been in one and raced it too, day and night compared to my car
Records still come... M3s, 997s, etc... And maybe you can get a perfect 60-130 once, or ....ok....maybe can be done with 2 different cars ... but I already know of 3 different platforms (M3, 997.1, 997.2) where you own not only the best time, but this is way lower than others..and 997s are AWD and TIP/PDK.. driver input is minimal.... and that is just improbable, dont want to argue but its just statistical very improbable if we are comparing apples to apples, so if the car isnt totally stripped, than it has more power that all the others, knowing its a pump tune, how much more timing/boost can it deliver over any other setup ? Or where is the difference ? I am excluding the possibility that all of us are stupid and can not drive our cars, repeatedly and on various platforms..
Man I wish you go on Nurburgring.. who knows ?
It is only 1 run absolute best! It can not be replicated easily (maybe even not at all) - It is the best the car can do at that moment ONLY! It was not 5 sec faster than what is run in general all over the world (6.5 is the norm as I can see and NOT at dedicated run and NOT at cold temps) but instead it was 0.5sec lower!!! And I am hearing nitrous and all kinds of bull...
Same goes for the M3 (other guys ran 6.6-6.8 and for some reason I ran 0.6 lower in 1 damn run... was in fact so "worried" with the performance of the car (I ran head to head with a 600WHP GTR a good friend of mine had) that I decided to sell it as I was afraid for the engine... Same goes for the 4.84! At least 2 guys on comletely stock internals have ran 5.5sec with VTGs and I seem to recall another one here running very low 5's... Theirs were repeated (so they say) records, mine was a one time thing as car could was getting repeated 5.4.-5.5 runs but never again got bleow 5!
To assist everyone achieving THE best time (guys it is supposed to be for fun) I will let you know on some common knowledge secrets: (even though I am a stupid man)
1. you find THE absolute perfect spot with great traction, near sea level, and within 3% downhill limit for the duration of the run at least
2. Ambient temps below 10C help A lot
3. You get to that spot without heatsoaking the car at all
4. You punch it at around 75km/h (below that even though it feels you built more boost, you hinder performance as you heatsoak it) in whatever gear is the approprate for each platform
5. You hold on and check your vbox at the end of the run
That is it! Oh and nitrous ofcourse... tons of it...
I did do a lot of runs to get to the best one...
997 APR was a 6.8-7sec car all day, M3 was a 6.8-7sec car all day, Cargraphic 997 was a 5.5-6 car (it was very heat affected car-maybe it was because of the small coolers it had) and this pdk is a 6.5-6.6 sec car all day!
Ask Dzenno and Mitch what I have asked from them if you wish...
It is not to go faster, it is to get steady times with comlete reliability!!!
I am happy if the car can do 6.5 all day almost on par with my 997.1 APR!
Regards
Costas
#39
12-02-2014 | 03:08 PM
Costas - people are not fools.
Your M3 time was fluff. 100% fluff. When you posted it and people attacked you I was actually on your side saying hey maybe this guy got lucky or whatever.
Your 4.84 was fluff with VTGs since that's what 900-1000whp cars do.
Your 5.9 time is fluff as well. After this 3rd magical world record with almost no mods lol I am fully on board with those that called you out back then.
These "world records" as you refer to them are nothing but smoke and mirrors.
I know what you mean that they are your best hits and non repeatable and perfect weather and conditions etc etc. We all have them but they are usually .2-.3 better not .7-.8 better.
Your M3 time was fluff. 100% fluff. When you posted it and people attacked you I was actually on your side saying hey maybe this guy got lucky or whatever.
Your 4.84 was fluff with VTGs since that's what 900-1000whp cars do.
Your 5.9 time is fluff as well. After this 3rd magical world record with almost no mods lol I am fully on board with those that called you out back then.
These "world records" as you refer to them are nothing but smoke and mirrors.
I know what you mean that they are your best hits and non repeatable and perfect weather and conditions etc etc. We all have them but they are usually .2-.3 better not .7-.8 better.
__________________
#TeamAIM
997TT SilverSpool - 210.8 mph 1/2 Mile WR Apr 2019, 9.2 @ 168 mph 1/4 Mile Manual World Record , 3.15 60-130 mph , 2.72 100-150 mph , 1400whp E85
996TT SpoolBus - 204.6 mph 1/2 Mile 996TT WR Aug 2018, 9.5 @ 154 mph, 3.23 60-130 mph, 2.5 100-150 mph Manual Porsche World Record, 1400whp E85
997TT SlowBerry - 205.0 mph 1/2 Mile WR Nov 2018, 9.7 @ 170 mph 1/4 Mile , 3.2 60-130 mph , 2.4 100-150 mph , 1420whp E85
ESMOTOR | DO88 | TPC DSC | SYVECS | COBB | IPD | KLINE | XONA | AMS | ID | ERP | SACHS | TURBOSMART | CSF | DODSON |
#TeamAIM
997TT SilverSpool - 210.8 mph 1/2 Mile WR Apr 2019, 9.2 @ 168 mph 1/4 Mile Manual World Record , 3.15 60-130 mph , 2.72 100-150 mph , 1400whp E85
996TT SpoolBus - 204.6 mph 1/2 Mile 996TT WR Aug 2018, 9.5 @ 154 mph, 3.23 60-130 mph, 2.5 100-150 mph Manual Porsche World Record, 1400whp E85
997TT SlowBerry - 205.0 mph 1/2 Mile WR Nov 2018, 9.7 @ 170 mph 1/4 Mile , 3.2 60-130 mph , 2.4 100-150 mph , 1420whp E85
ESMOTOR | DO88 | TPC DSC | SYVECS | COBB | IPD | KLINE | XONA | AMS | ID | ERP | SACHS | TURBOSMART | CSF | DODSON |
#40
12-02-2014 | 03:14 PM
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To get more consistent and reliable performance I would think you should look into getting better intercoolers (maybe meth too).
Do you brake boost on 60-130 runs? (I wouldn't have the ***** with PCCBs)
Do you brake boost on 60-130 runs? (I wouldn't have the ***** with PCCBs)
#41
12-02-2014 | 03:17 PM
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There's simply no room fueling capacity wise for nitrous on a 997.2 turbo given what our map is running. He mentioned that the 6.05 run he actually started in 3rd, tranny then dropped him into 2nd and then quickly upshfited back to 3rd. This would make more sense given the acceleration graph/spikes provided by Costas here.
One thing about the vbox to keep in mind is that the accelerometer readings taken in a given instant (i.e. not a running average value but acceleration at time X for instance) can be questionable and doesn't need to reflect the vehicle's actual acceleration. In fact if you consider the way the device is mounted/installed inside the car and how quickly it can move in direction especially at the onset of WOT and especially if something like brake boosting, tranny shifting back/forth through gears, traction loss/re-gain, and shorter gears are used at start you can imagine how that could cause what is shown for the first roughly 0.8-0.9secs seconds of the run.
Costas is a customer of ours and we can only go by what we've sent to him tuning wise and what he's provided through datalogs in return. If he's got a hypercar, spoofing the vbox somehow with special sauce equipment, getting rear ended by another car catapulting him to those longitudinal acceleration spikes
we have no way of proving or disproving unfortunately and these numbers are really just posted for fun. In fact all those things mentioned are higher likelihood than him stacking nitrous on this particular car. Classifying it as a "World record" in itself is funny and we always chuckle a little writing it that way as there's no official body regulating such competition so the only purpose it really can serve is be a fun fact out there.
We hope that this thread can/will take a turn with a more positive note from here on forward. As a tuning company that provides services to local as well as remote customers we have no means of being present with all the customers we tune. We can only go simply by what we provided tuning wise and what the customer has communicated back to us through datalogs and vbox runs such as this. Our only goal is to provide our customers with the best customer service we can possibly offer and build as consistent, reliable custom tuning for the mods and octane on the car. Simple
One thing about the vbox to keep in mind is that the accelerometer readings taken in a given instant (i.e. not a running average value but acceleration at time X for instance) can be questionable and doesn't need to reflect the vehicle's actual acceleration. In fact if you consider the way the device is mounted/installed inside the car and how quickly it can move in direction especially at the onset of WOT and especially if something like brake boosting, tranny shifting back/forth through gears, traction loss/re-gain, and shorter gears are used at start you can imagine how that could cause what is shown for the first roughly 0.8-0.9secs seconds of the run.
Costas is a customer of ours and we can only go by what we've sent to him tuning wise and what he's provided through datalogs in return. If he's got a hypercar, spoofing the vbox somehow with special sauce equipment, getting rear ended by another car catapulting him to those longitudinal acceleration spikes
we have no way of proving or disproving unfortunately and these numbers are really just posted for fun. In fact all those things mentioned are higher likelihood than him stacking nitrous on this particular car. Classifying it as a "World record" in itself is funny and we always chuckle a little writing it that way as there's no official body regulating such competition so the only purpose it really can serve is be a fun fact out there.We hope that this thread can/will take a turn with a more positive note from here on forward. As a tuning company that provides services to local as well as remote customers we have no means of being present with all the customers we tune. We can only go simply by what we provided tuning wise and what the customer has communicated back to us through datalogs and vbox runs such as this. Our only goal is to provide our customers with the best customer service we can possibly offer and build as consistent, reliable custom tuning for the mods and octane on the car. Simple
Well put Dzenno.
FWIW, when I was doing my pbox runs there were some huge spikes in the acceleration graph. I just figured it was pbox error for whatever reason. My car certainly wasn't spinning the tires and the car felt linear.
#42
12-02-2014 | 03:26 PM
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Costas - people are not fools.
Your M3 time was fluff. 100% fluff. When you posted it and people attacked you I was actually on your side saying hey maybe this guy got lucky or whatever.
Your 4.84 was fluff with VTGs since that's what 900-1000whp cars do.
Your 5.9 time is fluff as well. After this 3rd magical world record with almost no mods lol I am fully on board with those that called you out back then.
These "world records" as you refer to them are nothing but smoke and mirrors.
I know what you mean that they are your best hits and non repeatable and perfect weather and conditions etc etc. We all have them but they are usually .2-.3 better not .7-.8 better.
Your M3 time was fluff. 100% fluff. When you posted it and people attacked you I was actually on your side saying hey maybe this guy got lucky or whatever.
Your 4.84 was fluff with VTGs since that's what 900-1000whp cars do.
Your 5.9 time is fluff as well. After this 3rd magical world record with almost no mods lol I am fully on board with those that called you out back then.
These "world records" as you refer to them are nothing but smoke and mirrors.
I know what you mean that they are your best hits and non repeatable and perfect weather and conditions etc etc. We all have them but they are usually .2-.3 better not .7-.8 better.
I know that Adam will get into low 6 - high 5's very very soon in such a run and i want to see what you (and everyone else will say then)...
Anyway no hard feelings please man. I am not trying to trick anyone as I hve no profit from it! I did not even start the thread here for these exact reasons nor asked Dzenno to start it for me... I have absolutely nothing to gain from this, I pay as everyone else for my cars and mods and my line of work has absolutely nothing to do with cars (I am in Shipping)! I am very very happy with my cars performance and these guys (Dzenno and Mitch) are amongst the very best I have met/worked with.
Liar/stupid/deceiving etc whatever anyone thinks (based solely on this thread as noone really knows me personally ofcourse) I honestly do not care anymore
#43
12-02-2014 | 03:26 PM
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Costas - people are not fools.
Your M3 time was fluff. 100% fluff. When you posted it and people attacked you I was actually on your side saying hey maybe this guy got lucky or whatever.
Your 4.84 was fluff with VTGs since that's what 900-1000whp cars do.
Your 5.9 time is fluff as well. After this 3rd magical world record with almost no mods lol I am fully on board with those that called you out back then.
These "world records" as you refer to them are nothing but smoke and mirrors.
I know what you mean that they are your best hits and non repeatable and perfect weather and conditions etc etc. We all have them but they are usually .2-.3 better not .7-.8 better.
Your M3 time was fluff. 100% fluff. When you posted it and people attacked you I was actually on your side saying hey maybe this guy got lucky or whatever.
Your 4.84 was fluff with VTGs since that's what 900-1000whp cars do.
Your 5.9 time is fluff as well. After this 3rd magical world record with almost no mods lol I am fully on board with those that called you out back then.
These "world records" as you refer to them are nothing but smoke and mirrors.
I know what you mean that they are your best hits and non repeatable and perfect weather and conditions etc etc. We all have them but they are usually .2-.3 better not .7-.8 better.
so i guess congrats on yet another " World Record* " Costas!
#44
12-02-2014 | 03:31 PM
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I remember back in the day when Skandalis first posted his mid 6s 60-130 on stock vtgs and APR tune. We all thought it was BS. Turns out APR tune cranks up the boost to 1.6bar if not higher. Perhaps it can do 1 "ringer" 60-130 before pulling timing but I don't think anyone in North America was able to replicate the APR times.
I know that when I was testing different versions of the tune while Dzenno was fine tuning the first pass with the new versions was always wickedly fast. Now it's not as fast as the "peak" we had on a previous version but it's stable and consistent. But I can't forget that one run where I nailed it in 3rd gear and for the first time I had to hang on to the steering wheel. It was a 2.69s 60-100mph trip.
I know that when I was testing different versions of the tune while Dzenno was fine tuning the first pass with the new versions was always wickedly fast. Now it's not as fast as the "peak" we had on a previous version but it's stable and consistent. But I can't forget that one run where I nailed it in 3rd gear and for the first time I had to hang on to the steering wheel. It was a 2.69s 60-100mph trip.
#45
12-02-2014 | 03:55 PM
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Member wolfhedge has been banned...not for seeking the truth but for having several user accounts...hard to tell who he really is and if he has an agenda