Hey guys,

I am in a pickle! I am looking into leasing a new 997.2 coupe, but the dealer has some great deals on 08 997S's on the lot. I guess my question is, which car is a better choice? Obviously the 09's upgrades are great, but is the performance between the 08 997S and the 09 997.2 negligable since the HP numbers are similar?

Any feedback would be great! Thanks guys.....

 

Depends on just how great the deal on the 08 is, I suppose.
Do the 2009's have PDK? How badly do you want that?

If you have a 2006 M3, you would probably notice and appreciate the difference between the 997.1 and 997.2 engine.

 

The 08's are being discounted pretty heavy, but they are also optioned out like crazy. For example, they have a yellow 08 C2S with aero kit, nav, all the interior tidbits, and my payments would be around $150-200 more a month than a 09 997.2. Not really interested in the PDK, as I am a 6mt guy.

I was originally just going to get a E92 M3, but my buddy who is a porsche fanatic just drilled me for not considering a 997.2. I was just curious about the two engines. Similar HP, but obviously the 08 997S is a 3.8, vs. the 997.2 3.6....

 

I think you would notice the lack of bluetooth and satellite radio more on the '08 vs the '09 than the HP differences.

If you were deciding between 08 auto and 09 PDK I would say go for the 09. As for manuals I think they are much more comparable and if you are getting a great deal on an 08 might be a good idea.

Or if you really want the 09, give them a low ball offer on the 08. If they dont take it you end up in the car you wanted anyway, and if they do take it, well I think you'll mind less when you consider how much you're saving.

Either way you'll be in a 997 and there are few cars that will bring a bigger smile to your face.

 

1) I have an 08 M3 and a 997tt - I would skip the M3 . It's a great daily driver but lacks the Porsche excitement factor . I have written quite a bit on the M3 on this forum.

2) There were quite a few 08 leftovers in my area (Miami) which are not heavily optioned . It can't hurt to call . I can give you a referral if you wish.

3) The 997S vs the 997.2 --this is the burning question taht I have the most trouble answering . I can not see going above 70K to get into a car and skip the last 7 grand and get the S with a few options . You are almost there .

One thing most who have passion for cars is that stretching the wallet just comes with the territory .

 

As for the 08/09 M3, you are aware of the reliability issues? Check out http://www.m3post.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=72 There are more posts about problems with the new M3 then anything else. People have vibrations in the steering at 80 mph, DCT lag, engine malfunction errors, and on and on.

My choice was between a used 997.1 or a 2009 E92 M3, loaded.

Another factor was the large number of frumpy housewives in BMW 3 series. I know that a 328i w 17" wheels in not an M3, but BMW is not the same message, even in the M3 badge.

Off the stump and back to the advice part of this, my advice to you would be to cast your net very far and wide. In this market, there may be a dealer a bit father from you that is even more desperate to get rid of a certain car that you might like, whether it's an 08 or 09.

 

[quote=CMOS;2270089]As for the 08/09 M3, you are aware of the reliability issues? Check out http://www.m3post.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=72 There are more posts about problems with the car then anything else. People have vibrations in the steering at 80 mph, DCT lag, engine malfunction errors, and on and on.

quote]

My M3 has 10K miles and not one problem .
The only issue is boredom.

 

[quote=yrralis1;2270096]Is it really that boring. I have driven a few and most of my friends have the E92 m3 and they swear that's a great car. i can see adding one to my stable but replacing is a whole different issue.

 

Yrralis1 - Your totally right about the M3. I test drove it, and was so unimpressed with the car. I just felt like BMW was going toward the touring aspect rather than a sport car mentality. When I first saw and drove my E46 M3, I instantly fell in love with the car. Definitely not the same experience with the E92....

As for the Porsche, I am kind of leaning towards a 997.2. I just love the overall improvements to the 997.2, and with the 08 997S being in the same performance area, it makes the decision easier. Let me know what you guys think about my spec'ed 997.2.

Black 997.2 with Black interior
19 inch Carrera S wheels
Sport seats (Still considering Sport bucket Seats)
Yellow faced gauges with Yellow Seat belts, and Yellow brake calipers

 

just to add a little funny off-topic story: when I took BMWs M-driving school, we were doing a little "follow the leader" drill with M6s. Well, somehow at the onset of the first lap, the windshield wipers turned on and I could not get them off. About half way through the lap, driving at 7/10ths speed, the iDrive blinked out, then the radio started seeking stations......then the active seat bolster started squeezing the life out of me, in then out, squoosh.....the final straw was the right rear brake started jerking the car around when I was turning in. So, I parked the car. The instructor comes over in a huff, because she sees the wipers going and just figures that I am stupid. Well, she saw the seat bolsters quivering and the iDrive blinking and the result was a flat-bedded M6 with 2K miles on it going back to BMW for "research". Anyway, I am sure their quality is fine, but that shocked me a bit. We all got a good laugh about it over lunch!

 

I agree on the M3 . The only issue would be to get the 997.2 S .
I re read my post and forgot to specify (.2) It's so close.

Seats -I like sports buckets , next would come sports adaptive . last would be the sports seats .

The yellow calipers - another reason to get the S . The brakes on a C2 are not the same so anyone who sees the yellow caliper would know you had them painted . With the S they look ceramic .

If you are going to do this .. get the best right out of the box .

I tell you what spec BOTH cars -- a 997.2 and a 997.2 S and lets calculate the price of both. My guess is 7 grand on an 85-100 K car to have 30 more Hp it's a bargain .

 

Why not buy a low mileage 07 Turbo?

 

Look back over the last few weeks and there are 3 or 4 posts just like yours where you will see a variety of responses (search function may help too - search on 2009, 997.2 vs., etc.).

Basically, why would you want to move backwards in technology just 1 step? If you want "retro" or "classic", go back to a 964. You want a 997 and to me that would be the latest version and technology. If you can afford the 997.2, then get it. I have nothing but good to say about the 997.1 - my previous C2S was my favorite Porsche (over my 997 GT3, 964 C2, and Boxster S). But the 997.2 takes it to the next level with DFI engine with 30+ more ponies (many are showing dyno results stock of upwards of 400), the huge increase in fuel efficiency (30-33 MPG on the highway at 70-75), Gen 2 PASM (MUCH better than Gen 1 and the GT3 version), Gen 2 braking / ABS / PSM, etc. New electronics, BlueTooth, Universal Audio, etc. The Ring lap times are incredible for the 997.2 C2S - in the neighborhood of 997 GT3. So I guess it all comes down to what you want and what you are willing to pay. You might get to a point where you can save $5-10k to get a leftover, but that $5-10k buys you the bigger engine, better efficiency, newer electronics, better suspension, and 1 year less of depreciation.

 

Two comments:

1. Got any links to 400hp+ dyno results on stock 997.2 C2S?

2. I think the difference in depreciation is bigger than "1 year less" that you state. The changes in 997.2 are significant - DFI, PDK, electronics. Those are going to make the 997.1 depreciate a bit more quickly IMHO.

 

Sorry, I don't keep all the links, I just remember looking over pre-post dyno runs, in some cases calculating crank HP vs. wheel using a reasonable loss factor, and realizing that 2 or 3 of these cars all started out with over 385 HP and were in the 395-405 range. I think we all know Porsche tends to be somewhat conservative in their marketing materials when it comes to power and torque.