Does it make sense to add the GT3 control arms without changing anything else?

Currently running street tires with max -camber front and back. I think the mechanic said he got almost -1.5 on the rear. Can't remember the # for the front. The setup has worked well so far. Getting some 18"s with slicks for the track. I have access to a set of GT3 control arms but I don't plan on lowering springs or coilovers for now.

Most of the posts on the GT3 control arms are from guys with lowering springs or coilovers. Great for the track but not so great for the streets around here.

Thanks

 

If you think you can use more neg camber, go for it.

Unfortunately, the whole store is a little longer than that.

Porsche did a really good job designing a suspension that works well together for a sporty street application that can be used occasionally on a track. If you change one component dramatically (like using a slick), the whole equation is thrown off. To rebalance, you need to make more changes.

For example, a sticky tire will transfer twice (or more) the g forces to the car. This compresses springs and rubber bushings and alters the alignment settings while cornering. This throws alignment setting off and take the tires out of their optimal operating conditions.

 

yeah, I was afraid of that.

The guy I'm buying these from took them off his 2006 997s when he upgraded to a GT3 RS (I'm green). He also had it lowered quite a bit, H&R springs I think. He said it made the nose bounce on the street but REALLY improved track grip.

Oh well, more grip can't be bad, can it? ;-) Maybe the slicks are a bit much. Maybe something like a ToyoR888 would work better. Got a really good deal on the gear, though.

 

Here's my experience (PCA Instructor). Changing just the control arms, fluid to SRF, tires to RA1s (or other R-comps), and pads to Yellow 29s is a "perfect" setup. It's all about camber because the rest of the suspension is really a well done balance. I tried Damptronics (lower) with stiffer sways and it was actually worse on the track than stock.

When you say you are "green" does that mean you are in the novice run group? If so, you don't need control arms, "slicks", or anything else. Once you are in the intermediate group, then you might start thinking about upgrades. You want to learn the car "as is" until you can make it do whatever you want it to do.

 

I agree with RonCT on better brake fluid, R compounds and something on the order of Pagid Yellows. I went a bit different route on camber. My car is lowered 20mm on Damptronics. I have Tarett adjustable drop links, Tarett camber plates, Tarett adjustable rear toe links and stock sways.

With the above I was able to get the following:

Front Left /Front Right
Camber: -2.4, Toe: .05 /Camber: -2.5, Toe: .05
Rear Left /Rear Right
Camber: -2.1, Toe; .12 /Camber: -2.0, Toe: .12

I ran at Mid-Ohio two weekends ago on the stock PS2 tires and it didn't do bad at all. It's been a long time since I ran street tires on the track. The car was stable under braking and stuck fairly well until the the temps started to rise. I tried hot pressures of 36/38 and 38/40.

I'll most likely try a set of the new pilot Super Sports next. I dumped my trailer and tow gear 6 years ago and have rediscovered the fun of driving to the track with friends.

 

Thanks for the response! "Green" That is green with envy, drooling over my friend's GT3RS.

I am in an intermediate run group. I did the brake lines, fluid and pads first- that was easy, cheap, and made a huge difference in braking throughout the sessions- especially when hot.

My next goal is to stop burning up $520 street tires (the cost of 19" rear Michelin PS2s). I picked up a set of 18" wheels that already have slicks on them.

From yours and other posts it sound like the GT3 control arms will be more important with the stickier tires.

The inside edge of both back tires corded last time. I was told the rear toe may be off so another alignment is in order. Will put the control arms at that time.

With -1.5 in the rear I should probably put -2 up front more or less.

Many thanks- can't wait to get back out there!

 

+1....million!

Also your cars suspension is not set up for slicks. If you go with slicks you will need different shocks, springs, sways and no rubber in the suspension. Also when you move to R-Compound DOT tires like Toyo R888's for example you will need the control arms for tire wear. Like Ron said if you are new to this don't waste your money on all this right now. Just learn to drive the car as it is in stock form.
Also I noticed in your post you said you have max camber front and rear. Rear camber can go very high with the stock suspension and you might have too much rear camber compared to what you can get for the front. What are your current alignment specs?

 

Just checked the papers I have from the last alignment. No specs listed on there. I'll have to get the numbers from my mechanic. I only remember that he said he got almost -1.5 on the rears. Can't remember on the front- obviously less. Will check. The wear on the fronts was actually very even. The rears corded the inside edges first. I was told this could be due to toe out.

I purchased a set of used 18" wheels so I could use more appropriate tires for the track. (cheaper and stickier). I was planning on trying some R888's, Nitto NT-01's, Advan 048s, or BGF R1's.

The wheels I purchased happened to have rubber on them already: Hoosier slicks on the rear, 305's which have done 1 heat cycle and Pirelli 101's on the front that might have a day left in them. Have not used them yet.

I'm planning on having the GT3 control arms installed another alignment done next.

Do you think I should pull the slicks off and try something more mild. I hate to waste them. If I add the control arms the only difference between my car and the car those tires came off are lowering springs.

What could go wrong? ;-)

Again, thanks for the advice.

 

So the control arms have gone from $700 to $1,200 since 2009?

 

Doc you're going to kill any so call slick or R-Comp tire with less than -2 degree of camber up front. Stay with streets until you get your corner speeds up and get proper alignment.

Also for a 997 car Nitto nt01 do not have the proper sizes in 18". Your rear tires have to be taller than fronts.

 

if you plan on running slicks and want to remove all rubber bushings then RSS LCAs may be a better value as with 996 LCAs you will need to buy steel LCA ends separetely and they are $250 apiece.

for upper mounts (if you want steel up there too) I would recommend to go with stock GT3 uppr mounts, not a tarrett race parts. aftermarket upper mounts are bit cheaper but stock ones are better protected from elements and imho are of better quality. instaling them in front if you rotate them will move wheels a bit more into wheel wells - it helps when you run 9" or 9.5" wide front rims.

 

Consider going to the RSS brand LCA's:

RSS LCA's come with shims (OEM does not). Shims are not cheap. RSS have a replaceable spindle (**** happens), and the chassis mount end eliminates the rubber bushing that comes with the OEM LCA. Aftermarket upgrade to monoball mounts for the OEM LCA's are about $250.00 a pair.

The RSS ones are about $800.00+ per pair but when you add the features: monoball ends and the shims, and much better design, you are not much more that the Pcar parts.

The lower cost Porsche GT3 LCA's are actually one of the carry-over parts from the 996 model (and have the 996 part number still cast on them). The reason I include this info, is that the 996 LCA's are effectively shorter on a 997 chassis, and require more shims. Not so with the RSS ones. I have both types of LCA's on my 997C2S. OEM 996 up front, and the RSS on the rear. (18mm of shims per side in the front and less than ten mm of shims in the rear.)

I will most likely upgrade my fronts at some point to the RSS.

My setup includes running 2.8 deg neg camber front, and 2.3 neg camber rear. What ever camber you go for, keep about .5 degree less in the rear of the car.

 

Also my Porsche Motorsport GT LCA's gave me a wider front track width.

 

And that is worth considering depending on what you have/have not done with wheels. In my case the wheels were already flush due to the Forgeline GA3s I had made for the car.

The addition of GT3 LCAs would have pushed the tire contact patch further out than I wanted.

 

Guys,

Was fortunate enough to be invited to Monticello Motorclub as a guest yesterday. Only 6 cars all day, so we ran open track. It was an absolute blast. I usually track at NJMP so this was a refreshing change -- longer (3.6 miles, 22 turns) and much more technical (late apexes, hairpin turn, etc.) That was the good news...

Bad news is my Super Sports, which I had grown so fond of in the 3 months and 5 previous track days I had them, corded on the edge of 1 of the rears. I had maxed out the camber and added some toe to the OEM setup but I guess I learned the hard way that doesn't cut it over repeated track days. Anyway, I have 3 track days coming up this season so I need to fix this problem soon -- can't afford to ruin another set of tires.

**Question: Do 996/997 GT3 LCA's fit the 997 4S? Anyone recommend a supplier or any other tips on purchase/install?**

My thought is to just do the LCA's -- not really looking to do other suspension work. (I occassionally drive on rough roads so can't lower the car and it's a 12 month Northeast road car too).

Thanks v much in advance!