Fabspeed 996 & 997 200 Cell Sport Catalytic Converter X-Pipe
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#32
08-14-2009, 07:15 PM
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Natick, MA
Age: 51
Posts: 3,122
Rep Power: 162 
Actually the design of the Stock Headers are terrible... They are really restrictive. The X51 headers on the other hand are much less restrictive. They are much cheaper than other Aftermarket Headers and provide pretty much the same HP. I have it on my car and did not change the sound much but I can feel that they are less restrictive from the throttle response 
Here's a picture I found of the stock headers from Sharkwerks:
Here's a picture I found of the stock headers from Sharkwerks:
See for yourself - oily stains are from WD40, I am trying to soak off nuts...
#36
08-15-2009, 03:07 AM
Those are the stock 997 3.6 headers. They're a similar design to the X-51 but with slightly smaller diameter primary tubes. This design was carried-over from the 996 3.4 and 3.6.
I'm sure the 3.8 was intended from outset (by the engineers, at least) to have the same header design as all the other M96/M97 motors. It would be my guess that the restrictive stock header was eventually used instead to reduce cost and to help reduce the power output to where marketing wanted it. The 'real' 3.8 header then became the X-51 part.
I'm sure the 3.8 was intended from outset (by the engineers, at least) to have the same header design as all the other M96/M97 motors. It would be my guess that the restrictive stock header was eventually used instead to reduce cost and to help reduce the power output to where marketing wanted it. The 'real' 3.8 header then became the X-51 part.
#37
08-15-2009, 05:24 AM
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Natick, MA
Age: 51
Posts: 3,122
Rep Power: 162 Those are the stock 997 3.6 headers. They're a similar design to the X-51 but with slightly smaller diameter primary tubes. This design was carried-over from the 996 3.4 and 3.6.
I'm sure the 3.8 was intended from outset (by the engineers, at least) to have the same header design as all the other M96/M97 motors. It would be my guess that the restrictive stock header was eventually used instead to reduce cost and to help reduce the power output to where marketing wanted it. The 'real' 3.8 header then became the X-51 part.
I'm sure the 3.8 was intended from outset (by the engineers, at least) to have the same header design as all the other M96/M97 motors. It would be my guess that the restrictive stock header was eventually used instead to reduce cost and to help reduce the power output to where marketing wanted it. The 'real' 3.8 header then became the X-51 part.
#39
08-15-2009, 09:22 AM
I think it's quite plausible. Here's a couple of possibilities:
1) Another 5 BHP or so and the 997S would have been more powerful than 1st-Gen GT3s. There may potentially have been some politics around this.
2) They needed to limit the power output of the 3.8 to where it is to make the X51 upgrade desirable.. Let's speculate that the X51 headers add 6 BHP to a non-X51 997S by themselves and they had also been a standard fitment. This would mean that the X51 upgrade would now only increase power from 361 BHP to 381. Would anyone have ever bought the X51 kit for a mere 20BHP?
If anyone has any other (hopefully better) theories why the 3.8 was strangled (albeit not by much) it would be good to hear them.
1) Another 5 BHP or so and the 997S would have been more powerful than 1st-Gen GT3s. There may potentially have been some politics around this.
2) They needed to limit the power output of the 3.8 to where it is to make the X51 upgrade desirable.. Let's speculate that the X51 headers add 6 BHP to a non-X51 997S by themselves and they had also been a standard fitment. This would mean that the X51 upgrade would now only increase power from 361 BHP to 381. Would anyone have ever bought the X51 kit for a mere 20BHP?
If anyone has any other (hopefully better) theories why the 3.8 was strangled (albeit not by much) it would be good to hear them.
#40
08-15-2009, 09:34 AM
I think it's quite plausible. Here's a couple of possibilities:
1) Another 5 BHP or so and the 997S would have been more powerful than 1st-Gen GT3s. There may potentially have been some politics around this.
2) They needed to limit the power output of the 3.8 to where it is to make the X51 upgrade desirable.. Let's speculate that the X51 headers add 6 BHP to a non-X51 997S by themselves and they had also been a standard fitment. This would mean that the X51 upgrade would now only increase power from 361 BHP to 381. Would anyone have ever bought the X51 kit for a mere 20BHP?
If anyone has any other (hopefully better) theories why the 3.8 was strangled (albeit not by much) it would be good to hear them.
1) Another 5 BHP or so and the 997S would have been more powerful than 1st-Gen GT3s. There may potentially have been some politics around this.
2) They needed to limit the power output of the 3.8 to where it is to make the X51 upgrade desirable.. Let's speculate that the X51 headers add 6 BHP to a non-X51 997S by themselves and they had also been a standard fitment. This would mean that the X51 upgrade would now only increase power from 361 BHP to 381. Would anyone have ever bought the X51 kit for a mere 20BHP?
If anyone has any other (hopefully better) theories why the 3.8 was strangled (albeit not by much) it would be good to hear them.
The X51 is already ridiculously expensive, I would never order the X51 package when I could get the same HP for half the price with aftermarket parts... You can get around 45-50BHP with a Full Exhaust System, Intake Plenum, ECU, & Cold Air Intake.
#41
08-15-2009, 09:39 AM
True, on both points... But the only thing missing on the X51 is Racing/Performance Cats. They would give another 10BHP. The problem I imagine would be the sound accompanied with the Cats. The X51 package is supposed to add power but without any of the drawbacks of performance tuning. Sport Cats might be considered as an annoying part for some people.
The X51 is already ridiculously expensive, I would never order the X51 package when I could get the same HP for half the price with aftermarket parts... You can get around 45-50BHP with a Full Exhaust System, Intake Plenum, ECU, & Cold Air Intake.
The X51 is already ridiculously expensive, I would never order the X51 package when I could get the same HP for half the price with aftermarket parts... You can get around 45-50BHP with a Full Exhaust System, Intake Plenum, ECU, & Cold Air Intake.
The reason 200-cell cats can't be used as part of the factory x51 is simply that they won't meet emissions requirements. This is true both in Europe and the US and is why you can only get them as an aftermarket item.
#42
08-16-2009, 12:36 AM
There is much talk about what's Carb legal and what's not. In CA, it states it is illegal to remove the catalytic converter from any car but we have Porsche owners doing it every day with no problems at all. The 200 Cell sport cats comply the Porsche warranty and will pass all emissions and inspection requirements.
Our X Pipe design is different than our competitors and that is why it makes power in specific areas when theirs doesn't. The new design makes 12 to almost 14 HP at the top end and bout 4-7 ft. Lbs of Torque. The new design also sounds sportier and more aggressive then our previous crossover design.
I attached a link below of the car on the Dyno, but this car also has our Sport Headers, X Pipe Sport Cat and Maxflo Mufflers with the 997 conversion.
http://www.fabspeed.com/videos/997%20Carrera%20GT3%20Conversion%20Dyno.wmv
The link below has Dyno Results showing the comparison of where the car made the additional HP with the X Pipe Cats over the crossover cats on our 997 conversion setup.
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/997-vendor-classifieds/161509-fabspeed-997gt3-tailpipe-conversion-kit.html
Our X Pipe design is different than our competitors and that is why it makes power in specific areas when theirs doesn't. The new design makes 12 to almost 14 HP at the top end and bout 4-7 ft. Lbs of Torque. The new design also sounds sportier and more aggressive then our previous crossover design.
I attached a link below of the car on the Dyno, but this car also has our Sport Headers, X Pipe Sport Cat and Maxflo Mufflers with the 997 conversion.
http://www.fabspeed.com/videos/997%20Carrera%20GT3%20Conversion%20Dyno.wmv
The link below has Dyno Results showing the comparison of where the car made the additional HP with the X Pipe Cats over the crossover cats on our 997 conversion setup.
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/997-vendor-classifieds/161509-fabspeed-997gt3-tailpipe-conversion-kit.html
#44
08-20-2009, 02:42 PM
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Natick, MA
Age: 51
Posts: 3,122
Rep Power: 162 Here is how stock sounds:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rqkUgS8omI
Here is what I have now - Fabspeed XPipe cats plus Fabspeed mufflers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKGQ6G3yiVo
A LOT of bass. Especially between 2K and 3.5K RPM.
I am yet to decide what do I think about it. On idle it is acceptably quiet but I can feel vibration with my back a bit. On 2.5K and above it is loud.
What concerns me quite so far is that I definitely feel something odd in how car responds now - as I just started to drive on this setup if was very dull, after first 20 miles it improved a bit but I still feel like when I hit throttle - reaction is a bit delayed now compared to how it was before, not sure why and by how much, it is very difficult to explain. Plus it does not really feels consistent - almost like when I hit accelerator sometimes it starts to accelerate a bit slower than usual the gets a kick and pushes faster, next time it may be same as before, difficult to say. Plus naturally after several minutes you simply get used to new setup and forget how did it feel 3 days before. Initial feeling is that I have now less torque at 3K range than before. But I may be wrong about it, do not want to say much more.
Also, when I just started it on cold engine, did let it run for 2-3 minutes and revved a bit - it definitely backfired when I dropped throttle. All that is highly difficult and subjective, plus it is 88 degrees outside and last time I drove it it was in lower 70s. I probably need to reset ECU now to let computer re-learn from scratch. Plus when pipes were right after installed it smoked a bit when they were heating up for first time - may be oxygen sensors got dirty. Who knows. Plus it did not drive her for 2 days.
Last edited by utkinpol; 08-20-2009 at 02:50 PM.