Lemon or not?
#31
The harsh economics for you would be - hope to get a leftover '09 for 25% off (these must be getting pretty hard to find) - although this is basically below cost, so there is no way you could get a 2010 for this much even if they wanted to "give" you another car at cost.
Lets say he buys a 100K car at or near cost . Low 80's .
That's 10 -15K range .
Obviously most dealerships are not discounting 2010 cars this much but the one who sold him that car should have done this just to keep him a customer .
Maybe another dealership would step up and come close enough .
The further he travells from his area the harder it wil be . He has no way to transport the car and the dealership who sells him the car will want to keep him in their service as well as retain a repeat customer .
He's in New Jersey . There's a lot of dealerships in that area and all it takes is one to do the right thing .
#32
It always surprises me that car companies with insane profit margins on a product, and insane prices on the product, can't even offer the new engine and say......maybe some free porsche luggage and 4 years free service. Cost to porsche= 12 bucks for the chinese-made luggage and $500 for the service. Maybe it would be fair compensation for the headache the OP is going through.
If you want to really laugh a bit, read up on the poor guy who ordered a Veyron and put down a million bucks on it and they changed his allotment. He can only get the targa now, even though he ordered a coupe! (google it to see the story)
Bugatti basically spit in his face! I guess no one is immune from poor service!
Anyway, I wish you the best of luck and hope you get some decent treatment. At the very least, you will have a shiny new engine and will probably forget about this in a year. As a previous poster mentioned, when BMW pulled the engine on my M3, I was pissed. Then I drove it for a few weeks and it felt better than new!!!
If you want to really laugh a bit, read up on the poor guy who ordered a Veyron and put down a million bucks on it and they changed his allotment. He can only get the targa now, even though he ordered a coupe! (google it to see the story)
Bugatti basically spit in his face! I guess no one is immune from poor service!
Anyway, I wish you the best of luck and hope you get some decent treatment. At the very least, you will have a shiny new engine and will probably forget about this in a year. As a previous poster mentioned, when BMW pulled the engine on my M3, I was pissed. Then I drove it for a few weeks and it felt better than new!!!
#33
Lets say he takes the new motor and they offer 70K in trade .
Lets say he buys a 100K car at or near cost . Low 80's .
That's 10 -15K range .
Obviously most dealerships are not discounting 2010 cars this much but the one who sold him that car should have done this just to keep him a customer .
Maybe another dealership would step up and come close enough .
The further he travells from his area the harder it wil be . He has no way to transport the car and the dealership who sells him the car will want to keep him in their service as well as retain a repeat customer .
He's in New Jersey . There's a lot of dealerships in that area and all it takes is one to do the right thing .
Lets say he buys a 100K car at or near cost . Low 80's .
That's 10 -15K range .
Obviously most dealerships are not discounting 2010 cars this much but the one who sold him that car should have done this just to keep him a customer .
Maybe another dealership would step up and come close enough .
The further he travells from his area the harder it wil be . He has no way to transport the car and the dealership who sells him the car will want to keep him in their service as well as retain a repeat customer .
He's in New Jersey . There's a lot of dealerships in that area and all it takes is one to do the right thing .
![Smilie](https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
#34
I agree..it will only come into question in 30 years as its rolling down Barrett-Jackson collector car lane and some yutz with a flashlight sees the numbers don't match. Other than that..enjoy
#35
1) The make $$$ on the warranty repairs .
2) They minimize profit but still will make something .
3) They move TWO units instead of one . It's the years end to 2009 which has has not been a great sales year .
This can be a win/win for both of them .
#36
There is a cost to Porsche that has not (it's been a long thread and I may have missed it) been mentioned. The dealer may not be motivated to step up but is it the marginal cost between a new engine and a replacement car to PCNA greater than the cost of having this discussion online in a forum of Porsche 997 enthusiasts -- and potential buyers?
Inverted, wouldn't the confidence that a generous resolution of this dispute go far in encouraging potential buyers and future traders-in that Porsche may be expensive but that they stand behind their product?
I'm a lawyer and a bit of a business person and I can sympathize with Porsche's appropriate fear of setting a bad precedent. On the other hand, wearing my customer cap, I can attest to the importance of having the feeling that I am being treated well -- especially when it comes to a non-necessary luxury purchase.
Imagine the effect on the well-heeled and enthusiastic (if critical) readership of this forum if the original post had stated the same facts and then reported that Porsche or the dealer had gone the extra mile to make things right, perhaps by offering or accepting the compromises that have been discussed. With this thought in mind, I suggest that Dave bring this online discussion to the attention of the people at Porsche with whom he is dealing and remind them that an equitable resolution is in their interest as much as it is in his.
Inverted, wouldn't the confidence that a generous resolution of this dispute go far in encouraging potential buyers and future traders-in that Porsche may be expensive but that they stand behind their product?
I'm a lawyer and a bit of a business person and I can sympathize with Porsche's appropriate fear of setting a bad precedent. On the other hand, wearing my customer cap, I can attest to the importance of having the feeling that I am being treated well -- especially when it comes to a non-necessary luxury purchase.
Imagine the effect on the well-heeled and enthusiastic (if critical) readership of this forum if the original post had stated the same facts and then reported that Porsche or the dealer had gone the extra mile to make things right, perhaps by offering or accepting the compromises that have been discussed. With this thought in mind, I suggest that Dave bring this online discussion to the attention of the people at Porsche with whom he is dealing and remind them that an equitable resolution is in their interest as much as it is in his.
#37
From the info provided by the OP, hasn't the NJ Lemon Law been met with number of repairs for the same issue?
From my understanding most Lemon Law attorneys will base their case on failure to comply with standards under the Magnusson Moss act.
I must be missing something because I would have thought this would be a done deal under the NJ Lemon Law or under an attorney's intervention with MMA.
From my understanding most Lemon Law attorneys will base their case on failure to comply with standards under the Magnusson Moss act.
I must be missing something because I would have thought this would be a done deal under the NJ Lemon Law or under an attorney's intervention with MMA.
#38
This could also work against him since this has now turned into a public, online circus for them. Just a thought.
I think that he needs to push harder or get an attorney and not settle. An attorney would likely only take this case if they can win so talking with the right people is in order.
#39
Thanks, everyone, for all of the comments and suggestions. I am going to sign off for a while, and let the legal system take its course. I promise to report back upon resolution.
Have a great holiday!
Have a great holiday!
#40
Good luck to you and may you have a new 997 in your drive within 2 months.
#41
If I were you, I would be looking around for other dealers who would be willing to give you around 75k for your trade in, and then you could buy an 09C2S for 80k from them, so 5k total. I know a few dealers in CT who are offering 20k off of msrp on 09 911's...
#43
There is a cost to Porsche that has not (it's been a long thread and I may have missed it) been mentioned. The dealer may not be motivated to step up but is it the marginal cost between a new engine and a replacement car to PCNA greater than the cost of having this discussion online in a forum of Porsche 997 enthusiasts -- and potential buyers?
.
.
It just makes no sense that they would not work this out quickly, smoothly, efficiently, and professionally -- and put this owner in a car that he is thrilled with at a cost that they all can agree is respectable.
#44
There is a cost to Porsche that has not (it's been a long thread and I may have missed it) been mentioned. The dealer may not be motivated to step up but is it the marginal cost between a new engine and a replacement car to PCNA greater than the cost of having this discussion online in a forum of Porsche 997 enthusiasts -- and potential buyers?
Inverted, wouldn't the confidence that a generous resolution of this dispute go far in encouraging potential buyers and future traders-in that Porsche may be expensive but that they stand behind their product?
I'm a lawyer and a bit of a business person and I can sympathize with Porsche's appropriate fear of setting a bad precedent. On the other hand, wearing my customer cap, I can attest to the importance of having the feeling that I am being treated well -- especially when it comes to a non-necessary luxury purchase.
Imagine the effect on the well-heeled and enthusiastic (if critical) readership of this forum if the original post had stated the same facts and then reported that Porsche or the dealer had gone the extra mile to make things right, perhaps by offering or accepting the compromises that have been discussed. With this thought in mind, I suggest that Dave bring this online discussion to the attention of the people at Porsche with whom he is dealing and remind them that an equitable resolution is in their interest as much as it is in his.
Inverted, wouldn't the confidence that a generous resolution of this dispute go far in encouraging potential buyers and future traders-in that Porsche may be expensive but that they stand behind their product?
I'm a lawyer and a bit of a business person and I can sympathize with Porsche's appropriate fear of setting a bad precedent. On the other hand, wearing my customer cap, I can attest to the importance of having the feeling that I am being treated well -- especially when it comes to a non-necessary luxury purchase.
Imagine the effect on the well-heeled and enthusiastic (if critical) readership of this forum if the original post had stated the same facts and then reported that Porsche or the dealer had gone the extra mile to make things right, perhaps by offering or accepting the compromises that have been discussed. With this thought in mind, I suggest that Dave bring this online discussion to the attention of the people at Porsche with whom he is dealing and remind them that an equitable resolution is in their interest as much as it is in his.
As much as I have drooled over P-cars, I may never buy one because of all the problems with engines the past several years.....but more importantly how the corp has handled these problems.
Nothing is perfect, every machine can malfunction. When it happens the corp should stand behind it's product. That's it and only it for me.
#45
Went through something very similar with Audi. I tried working with Sales, but quickly came to the conclusion that; 1) its out their hands 2) they could care less after they have made their commission. Sure these might be blanket statements, but you rarely hear good stories when a new car has developed problems and a resolution is worked out quickly.
To pay that much money for a car only to have reliability problems in a few months is ridiculous. I would be furious i was i was in your shoes. Use the law and pursue whatever means necessary to get what YOU want. If a new engine is not something that satisfies you than keep pushing.
Best of luck.
To pay that much money for a car only to have reliability problems in a few months is ridiculous. I would be furious i was i was in your shoes. Use the law and pursue whatever means necessary to get what YOU want. If a new engine is not something that satisfies you than keep pushing.
Best of luck.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post