997 vs. 991
#31
To the new 991 owners: don't treat an aesthetic discuss as an attack on the engineering of the 991 nor your purchase decision. Time marches on at Porsche. That said the image says more than all the words :
YNOT : to me, I got a tactile 911 for that feeling, the pebbles, leaves and tarmac is why the pcar is in my life. The BMW's (one w/ elec. steer, one w/o) sitting in front of the c4s; these provide me with that fatty, non-sensuous feeling of just getting around. There are plenty of alternatives to a pcar w/o that steering feel.
YNOT : to me, I got a tactile 911 for that feeling, the pebbles, leaves and tarmac is why the pcar is in my life. The BMW's (one w/ elec. steer, one w/o) sitting in front of the c4s; these provide me with that fatty, non-sensuous feeling of just getting around. There are plenty of alternatives to a pcar w/o that steering feel.
#33
YNOT : to me, I got a tactile 911 for that feeling, the pebbles, leaves and tarmac is why the pcar is in my life. The BMW's (one w/ elec. steer, one w/o) sitting in front of the c4s; these provide me with that fatty, non-sensuous feeling of just getting around. There are plenty of alternatives to a pcar w/o that steering feel.
#36
Spent the weekend at Porsche Palooza in Arkansas. Following and passing and running with all era's of 911. I just don't feel the 911 "soul" when I see a 991. No doubt, the Turbo S and all the 991's are bad *** performers, but again, if I was just after speed a 5.0 Mustang with a procharger would fill the bill for $100k less. I'm sure the same was said about the 996, 997, etc. Even someone on this thread doesn't care for the 997.2...I get that. But the 991 is a real departure and certainly more in line with Nissan GTR than a 997. Again, I get it, that's "progress". But IMO Porsche is losing the soul of what made the 911 a great car...curvy body lines, german interior with thicker quality leather, road feel, raw engine noises and MANUAL transmissions. Perhaps they'll redeem themselves with the next go around (like they did with the 996 to 997) and bring back what we all want from a styling perspective. The rave reviews coming in about the Cayman GTS is encouraging. But who ever grew up dreaming of owning a Cayman?? Again, it's not a slam on the Cayman, they're a blast to drive and rail corners like a 911 cannot. But...in the end they're not a 911.
#37
Congratulations Porsche marketing! They did a wonderful job, even last year at the Porsche road show, everyone agreed that the Cayman felt better but most would take the C4S b/c it has prestige that the Cayman does not. I haven't driven a GTS yet but I have a 981 Boxster and I've driven both the base Cayman and S, they are great driver's cars for those who can look beyond the iconic status of a 911. I agree the 991 has gotten too big, actually the 997 is quite big compared to the air cooled 911's.
#38
Nothing wrong with mine, I've driven another 997 and it feels the same. I haven't driven a 997.2 for comparison. I've driven 991's on multiple occasions. The steering feel every car journalist talks about, it's the extra feedback through the steering wheel. This extra feedback is also the extra vibration and loose feeling you get with hydraulic steering compared to electric. I like the heavier and stiffer feel w/o all the extra feeling that is not necessary on a road car.
Now with regard to the heavier/stiffer feel, I'm going to have to disagree on this one. Having experienced the electric steering of the Panamera, Cayenne, and Cayman, each for several weeks, my impression was that the force required to rotate the steering wheels is far less on these cars than on my 997.2. It's especially evident at low speeds, when you could almost steering the car with the tip of your finger, whereas you still need to use a full grip on the 997. Are you sure something isn't wrong with your 997?
#40
Regarding the 997 rear profile (especially the wider 4's)As Donkey from Shrek said: "I like that boulder. That is a NICE boulder."
I myself am currently contemplating a '12 997.2 GTS or '12 991 S. I'm leaning towards the GTS pending the PPI.
I myself am currently contemplating a '12 997.2 GTS or '12 991 S. I'm leaning towards the GTS pending the PPI.
#41
I know right? Why not just get a Mercedes for a smooth ride?
#42
Werd!
Spent the weekend at Porsche Palooza in Arkansas. Following and passing and running with all era's of 911. I just don't feel the 911 "soul" when I see a 991. No doubt, the Turbo S and all the 991's are bad *** performers, but again, if I was just after speed a 5.0 Mustang with a procharger would fill the bill for $100k less. I'm sure the same was said about the 996, 997, etc. Even someone on this thread doesn't care for the 997.2...I get that. But the 991 is a real departure and certainly more in line with Nissan GTR than a 997. Again, I get it, that's "progress". But IMO Porsche is losing the soul of what made the 911 a great car...curvy body lines, german interior with thicker quality leather, road feel, raw engine noises and MANUAL transmissions. Perhaps they'll redeem themselves with the next go around (like they did with the 996 to 997) and bring back what we all want from a styling perspective. The rave reviews coming in about the Cayman GTS is encouraging. But who ever grew up dreaming of owning a Cayman?? Again, it's not a slam on the Cayman, they're a blast to drive and rail corners like a 911 cannot. But...in the end they're not a 911.
Spent the weekend at Porsche Palooza in Arkansas. Following and passing and running with all era's of 911. I just don't feel the 911 "soul" when I see a 991. No doubt, the Turbo S and all the 991's are bad *** performers, but again, if I was just after speed a 5.0 Mustang with a procharger would fill the bill for $100k less. I'm sure the same was said about the 996, 997, etc. Even someone on this thread doesn't care for the 997.2...I get that. But the 991 is a real departure and certainly more in line with Nissan GTR than a 997. Again, I get it, that's "progress". But IMO Porsche is losing the soul of what made the 911 a great car...curvy body lines, german interior with thicker quality leather, road feel, raw engine noises and MANUAL transmissions. Perhaps they'll redeem themselves with the next go around (like they did with the 996 to 997) and bring back what we all want from a styling perspective. The rave reviews coming in about the Cayman GTS is encouraging. But who ever grew up dreaming of owning a Cayman?? Again, it's not a slam on the Cayman, they're a blast to drive and rail corners like a 911 cannot. But...in the end they're not a 911.
#43
Looking great! Cant wait to see the final pics.
I considered the 991 GT3 front, but eventually found an OEM 997.2 GT3 front bumper, so Im going with that instead.
BTW, I have a pair of the 991 turn signal/DRLs for sale, if anyone needs them for the conversion. They are in perfect condition, and Ill take pics for anyone interested.
I considered the 991 GT3 front, but eventually found an OEM 997.2 GT3 front bumper, so Im going with that instead.
BTW, I have a pair of the 991 turn signal/DRLs for sale, if anyone needs them for the conversion. They are in perfect condition, and Ill take pics for anyone interested.
#44
I think the perfect Daily 911 is the 997.2 GTS.
I don't care for the steering on the 991. I like to feel every pebble.
I hate the rear of the 991. The counter sunk taillights don't look right to me. The size of the taillights is too small in relations to size of the rear bumper of the car. They just kind of get lost (I do like the LED treatment).
The rear horizontal line breaks up the cars historic smooth flow.
The side view mirrors, why for the love of all that is Holy would they stick them to the side of the door. It doesn't look right
One of the worst things they did was take the rear deck lid and cut it into the rear wheel arches. The 911 has always had a squarish engine cover that never cut into the rear fenders now they did this. I know when I wash my car one of my favorite lines is from the roof down the thin C pillar over the fenders and onto the lights. It's fluid. Now there is a great big slash in that
I like the more purpose built interior of the 997. The interior of the 991 is from a panamera, which I love in that vehicle. Just not sports car enough for me.
If my choice was any 997 GT3 or GTS or a new 991, I would choose the 997 variant every time.
I don't care for the steering on the 991. I like to feel every pebble.
I hate the rear of the 991. The counter sunk taillights don't look right to me. The size of the taillights is too small in relations to size of the rear bumper of the car. They just kind of get lost (I do like the LED treatment).
The rear horizontal line breaks up the cars historic smooth flow.
The side view mirrors, why for the love of all that is Holy would they stick them to the side of the door. It doesn't look right
One of the worst things they did was take the rear deck lid and cut it into the rear wheel arches. The 911 has always had a squarish engine cover that never cut into the rear fenders now they did this. I know when I wash my car one of my favorite lines is from the roof down the thin C pillar over the fenders and onto the lights. It's fluid. Now there is a great big slash in that
I like the more purpose built interior of the 997. The interior of the 991 is from a panamera, which I love in that vehicle. Just not sports car enough for me.
If my choice was any 997 GT3 or GTS or a new 991, I would choose the 997 variant every time.
Last edited by BLKPPR; 05-20-2015 at 11:24 AM.
#45
Here is the rear trunk line. It has never cut into the rear fender. May be the most iconic part of the 911 series- the hips- now have a line across them. It's like a C- Section scar. Won't necesarily ruin the final product but sure wish it wasn't there.
then this:
Horrid when opened:
Why was it necessary? Aftermarket wings will be goofy looking and it takes away from 50 years of design
then this:
Horrid when opened:
Why was it necessary? Aftermarket wings will be goofy looking and it takes away from 50 years of design
Last edited by BLKPPR; 05-20-2015 at 11:30 AM.