Hi,

Helping a friend shop for a C2s, used. They have up to $65k to spend. There isn't much locally, so I was doing some research here (used cars) and also what you get for what price. Not that familiar with Porsche.

A few options we found so far:

2012 997 c2s, 28k miles, CPO for $60k
2012 991 C2s, 24k miles, CPO for $66k
2009 997 C2s, 29k miles, for $54,900
2007 997 C2s, 53k miles, for $40,000

All of these cars look to be super clean, well maintained. From a driving perspective, there isn't much difference between a 997.1 and 997.2, correct? How big is the jump up to a 991?

In terms of depreciation and age vs. expected maintenance, where is the sweet spot? She is trying to keep it reasonable, hoping to stay under $6-7k/yr depreciation and maintenance, with 5k miles driven per year.

Thanks in advance!

 

A lot will depend upon what options are included with each car. Hard to determine true value from just the mileage.

 

The 997vs.991 cars drive/feel very different. Drive them both before buying.

 

There's not much difference between the 997.1 and 997.2 in terms of driving feel, but there are subtle differences. There's a bigger difference going to the 991, but again; it will still feel like a 911.

I think the key is to drive them for comparison, as mentioned above. It's also important to prioritize options and use key priorities to narrow down the choices. A few things to consider: Coupe or cabriolet? Manual transmission or automatic? Color preferences? How important are options like adaptive sport seats or electronics (sat nav, Sirius XM, Eric.)? Is the PCCB option important? What about Sport Chrono? Will this car be tracked, or just serve as a weekend cruiser? Will the car be a daily driver?

Once these questions are answered, you'll have a better idea of which car to buy.

 

With the noted budget, I would think the most important factor is what the owners wants. The 991 and 997 are quite different. Even if you get a good or great deal on a car you don't enjoy, isn't that missing the point of why she's buying it in the first place?

Another factor that may come into play on the 991's noted is perhaps they are CPO. Then the maintenance cost should be taken care of.

 

Thanks! Just followed up with her, got answers.

She has 2 kiddos. Looking for a MT if possible, PDK may be acceptable. Knowing her, she will put a roof rack on there for storage. 10-12k miles a year.

FYI, she is coming off a 2009 M3 coupe. DCT.

Might be tracked 2 days a year, mostly a sweet DD. Sport Chrono not super important. Would love a sports exhaust, she is definitely in the "enthusiast" "Hell no I am driving an SUV" category.

Electronics: must have bluetooth, and Nav would be nice. She said she uses it fairly often. With that said, driving experience is by far the most important consideration. MPG better than an M3 would be nice too.

Driving considerations aside, what would be the more effective car in terms of depreciation and expected maintenance. Looks like a 991.1 base could be had for low 60's CPO, and CPO 997.2 C2s for about the same price. A slightly older C2s 997.2 low 50's. I suppose all of this is likely a wash in the end?

A noob question: at what point does the depreciation curve flatten out? Early 997 S generation? She probably wants to stay away from a 996, it being a daily driver. I have always been a BMW guy, but know more about P-cars than her, so am trying to help her out.

All of her other friends are saying "get a new M2!".

 

997.1 and 997.2 have major engine differences. Do a search. Someone just had a good post with all the 997.1 and 997.2 differences.

 

That's good feedback. The most common buying advice that you tend to hear with Porsches is to buy the newest that you can afford. It's certainly helpful for warranties and for wear items. That being said, many people like the 997 cars better than the 991 cars. There are many reasons for that, but most 911 owners feel that their version of the 911 is the "last real 911" and is more raw and visceral than the newer model. I've spent lots of time driving 997 cars and 991 cars, and they are all excellent.

Porsche has always been a bit behind when it comes to electronics. The 997.2 has better nav than the 997.1 (although there are good aftermarket solutions to greatly improve the 997.1 electronics). If she wants the latest in bluetooth, nav, etc., then a 991 might be a good car to consider. I think it would also be quieter and more comfortable for a daily driver. She really needs to compare them directly.

If she wants a MT, then Sport Chrono isn't really that important. In a PDK car (which was first offered in the 997.2 series), then I think it's more important. I would definitely get Porsche Sport Exhaust if possible. It's great on the 997.2 and I think it's even better on the 991.

If she's comparing a used 911 to a new M2, then the 991 will probably be more appealing. It's definitely more updated and new feeling, especially in the interior.

I think the depreciation curve is very difficult to estimate. Many people feel that the switch in the 991.2 to turbocharging will result in holding or even increasing values in 997 and 991 normally aspirated cars. The 997.2 series cars were built in smaller numbers than the 997.1 cars if I'm not mistaken, so that might be the sweet spot. I also tend to think that a 991.1 C2S with a manual transmission would be a fairly rare car and would hold value well.

There's no way to predict the future. Tell her to get the one that calls to her and enjoy it!

 

I think as others have mentioned, that driving both is key. Then you can really tell which car suits you better. As for depreciation, I look at it this way. If you can get a good deal based on what others are paying for 4 year old car or a 9 year old car, you are in good shape on depreciation. Both models should hold up well. The key is getting a good deal on the front end in my opinion.

 

Woh.. with that noted, a DD(as in Daily Driver?) and 2 kids.. I don't see this being a good fit at all.

 

997.2 is going to depreciate less. Not only are they older and currently on a shallower section of the depreciation curve, but there were fewer of them sold than the 991. Supply and demand. The 991 is a spectacular car (and probably better suited as a daily driver) but my guess is they will cost more to own over the next 5 years mainly due to increased depreciation.

 

Ha! Hence the rooftop bike rack and cargo box when needed.

She is coming out of an M3 coupe though. I know, 911 is a smaller car, but not that much smaller

 

Good point. Edmunds has that TCO calculator, you can switch between models of the same year, it was giving me around $11k/3 year for the 997.2 S 2012, and $13.5k for base 991 2012.

In the end, neither is bad, and beats BMW by a wide margin. Heck, my parents lost $20k driving a Ford Fusion for 3 years....

 

It's way smaller. Prior to my 997.2 I drove an E90. Granted, mine was a sedan and not a coupe but the back seat was completely usable and the rear seats folded down allowing me to carry things like mountain bikes and 47" LCD TVs inside the car. It was a great daily driver. I find myself driving my 4Runner a lot more than I used to because I simply can't carry as much stuff in the 997 as I could my E90.

New M2 would be sweet for a DD but don't expect cheap lease deals on them. MSRP+ and waiting lists. It's one of the few BMWs enthusiasts actually want. I bet if I made a TCO spreadsheet comparing a new M2 to a used 991 or 997 I bet I could easily fudge the numbers to make the BMW cost the most

 

There is no comparison space wise.. the back seats are more like half seats... there is a frunk that isn't comparable to a trunk. Not to mention the kids will get older thus no longer fit back there.. So unless her kids are very young, say 7/8 years old or younger, I don't get why a 911 would be a good DD.

Mines is solely a weekend car.