About to be HAMMERED
#46
02-13-2006 | 01:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Christian
I have driven both, I have raced one.
Porsche GT2 Porsche 997S
3175lbs 3130lbs
456ft/lbs 320ft/lbs
462hp 381hp
There's nothing armchair or keyboard about that.
Christian
Porsche GT2 Porsche 997S
3175lbs 3130lbs
456ft/lbs 320ft/lbs
462hp 381hp
There's nothing armchair or keyboard about that.
Christian
#49
02-13-2006 | 08:03 AM
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I think everyone has gotten away from Crewser's initial point. He never said he ran faster than the GT2. His experience showed that the Club coupe does not get walked on by a GT2. He offered a possibility of the GT2 driver being sub-par or that it was not a true GT2 (but probably was) to show he was not arguing.
And I absolutely believe the club coupe would not be pulled on too hard by a GT2. There is no argument that the GT2 is faster, everyone will agree with that notion. However, it is not insanely faster than the 997 S X51. It's like arguing that John Doe's 360 Modena will beat a Challenge Stradale-- we all know the CS is faster, but it's only 30 hp more (not too much) so it's not that much faster. Granted, it will probably feel faster given the weight savings and "passion" but it's not yugo v. Enzo.
-Joe
And I absolutely believe the club coupe would not be pulled on too hard by a GT2. There is no argument that the GT2 is faster, everyone will agree with that notion. However, it is not insanely faster than the 997 S X51. It's like arguing that John Doe's 360 Modena will beat a Challenge Stradale-- we all know the CS is faster, but it's only 30 hp more (not too much) so it's not that much faster. Granted, it will probably feel faster given the weight savings and "passion" but it's not yugo v. Enzo.
-Joe
#50
02-13-2006 | 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by JoeyG
...And I absolutely believe the club coupe would not be pulled on too hard by a GT2. There is no argument that the GT2 is faster, everyone will agree with that notion. However, it is not insanely faster than the 997 S X51...
-Joe
-Joe
--- Kevin
#52
02-13-2006 | 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by TheJudge
I will end this argument with the all time greatest argument starter...
A Z06 will run both and its 40K cheaper!
A Z06 will run both and its 40K cheaper!
This was not intended to be an argument. It got nasty when folks started making unsubstantiated claims that had NOTHING to do with the premis. I'd love to test against a ZO6 too, when you get it. First, we'd like to see Porsche treat you like a customer...
Last edited by gdctus997; 02-13-2006 at 10:20 AM.
#53
02-13-2006 | 11:22 AM
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I'm really looking forward to the 997TT vs. C6Z06 ... that is going to be exciting... I think Porsche will come out victorious as they always under-rate and Porsche drivers are generally better drivers than Z06 drivers. Z06 will be, by far, the best bang for the buck though.
#54
02-13-2006 | 11:36 AM
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I've spent about 1/2 hour in a 997S, and imho, walked away feeling that it felt relatively slow... that I expected it to be faster. I've also spent time wringing out a GT2, and they are in no way on the same playing field. Not knocking the 997S, but just my experience.
#55
02-13-2006 | 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by dr_sharp
I'm really looking forward to the 997TT vs. C6Z06 ... that is going to be exciting... I think Porsche will come out victorious as they always under-rate and Porsche drivers are generally better drivers than Z06 drivers. Z06 will be, by far, the best bang for the buck though.
---Kevin
PS: You guys have to remember, those new Z06's are dynoing between 445-455RWHP!! in factory stock trim. Thats practically the FLYWHEEL HP rating on a GT2....in a package thats LIGHTER to boot* Hence the 125-126MPH trap speeds those things are seeing regularly in the 1/4mile....bone stock. (I personally give the new 997TT a ~122-123MPH trapspeed and ~119-120MPH for the GT3...and these times represent the best I'd ever see the porsches doing stock)
Last edited by Kevin D; 02-13-2006 at 12:29 PM.
#56
02-13-2006 | 12:46 PM
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The problem with anything turbocharged or supercharged has been the lag. At low RPM, it is the base engine that counts. That matters on a track, which is why GT3s are used and not TTs.
I really hope the new geometry of the turbos produces what Porsche is saying. I'd like to see the Z06 beat; but I'd be concerned if I were in a 997TT. I thought I was going to get trashed by the GT2, which is what started this thread...
I really hope the new geometry of the turbos produces what Porsche is saying. I'd like to see the Z06 beat; but I'd be concerned if I were in a 997TT. I thought I was going to get trashed by the GT2, which is what started this thread...
#57
02-13-2006 | 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by StephenTi
I've spent about 1/2 hour in a 997S, and imho, walked away feeling that it felt relatively slow... that I expected it to be faster. I've also spent time wringing out a GT2, and they are in no way on the same playing field. Not knocking the 997S, but just my experience.
#59
02-13-2006 | 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Fabryce@GMGRacing
Gerry
So I take it we will see you at the next track event in April......
So I take it we will see you at the next track event in April......
Being a man of motorsport, what are you thoughts about all of this? Was it an imposter GT2 or is it plausable that the cars are similar under the conditions described?
#60
02-14-2006 | 02:56 AM
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Originally Posted by gdctus997
I didn't say that my Club Coupe is faster. Reading and comprehension are important abilities.
I told you about my experience this morning. How do you expect me to value your understanding of horsepower, torque, weight, gearing and power curves (whatever that is) -- oh, and physics, logic and the experience you talked about (well, you stated you have experience, but I just read a lot of hot air without anything to support it). I also offered to other readers a test to really see how these cars compare. What I have said and offered is a lot more than your meaningless comments.
If you actually have something to offer, I'm all ears. To this point, I think you should have been a lawyer (most are dumb and worthless; some are brilliant). If you have some experience to talk about, let's hear it. Otherwise, you are waisting our time.
By the way, R&T published numbers for the 996TT and 997S (not X51). The 997S was faster 0-60 and they were equal in the 1/4 mile. The last time I looked, the 996TT had more hp (415 vs 355) and more torque (a lot more than 290). The TT is heavier; but not a lot. I suppose R&T is also ignorant?
I told you about my experience this morning. How do you expect me to value your understanding of horsepower, torque, weight, gearing and power curves (whatever that is) -- oh, and physics, logic and the experience you talked about (well, you stated you have experience, but I just read a lot of hot air without anything to support it). I also offered to other readers a test to really see how these cars compare. What I have said and offered is a lot more than your meaningless comments.
If you actually have something to offer, I'm all ears. To this point, I think you should have been a lawyer (most are dumb and worthless; some are brilliant). If you have some experience to talk about, let's hear it. Otherwise, you are waisting our time.
By the way, R&T published numbers for the 996TT and 997S (not X51). The 997S was faster 0-60 and they were equal in the 1/4 mile. The last time I looked, the 996TT had more hp (415 vs 355) and more torque (a lot more than 290). The TT is heavier; but not a lot. I suppose R&T is also ignorant?
Look, your club coupe is sweet and all but it isn't GT2 fast, it isn't turbo fast, and it certainly isn't even on the same planet of fast as a carrera GT. A properly driven carrera GT shouldn't be in the same zip code as you. Actually, these days it really isn't that fast at all. If you look in the back of road and track there are easily a dozen cars that can smack a 997s around in a straight line since that seems to be your concern.
You are letting your x51 go to your head. If you wanted the straight line speed you should have picked up a turbo and chipped it and saved a bunch of money and been a lot faster.
Last edited by sticky; 02-14-2006 at 03:01 AM.