The Hackett is nice but you don't see much here in the states, the shirts and hats are things I buy as I travel for me or my Aston friends, That's gone downhill, if they even carry the stuff.

 

The new partnership with Girard-Perregaux in its short time has cooler watches than JLC ever released with AML. I would give Stroll more credit than is being posted in this thread. Who would've thought 2-3 years ago that Martin Whitmarsh and Sebastian Vettel would be a part of the brand?

A pure Stroll era car beyond the AMR22 hasn't been released yet.

 

Just released today, what a coincidence

https://www.astonmartinf1.com/en-GB/...ship-with-amf1

 

I ABSOLUTELY believe that neither Stroll nor Moers has the slightest clue, or worse, the slightest care, about what makes an Aston an Aston. I think it could not be more clear. Moers came in as CEO and noted that Aston had its own new V6 that was very far along in its development. A little later he said that he was looking into potential alternatives. Then he said he'd have additional access to AMG bits. Then he said that future Astons would just use AMG engines because they were available, and that would be easier and cheaper. He said he could "see no reason" for Aston to have its own engine. Then he said Aston's new V6 actually "didn't exist." That was a stunning statement given that Aston itself had already showcased its new V6 running on the test bench! He blatantly lied. He's capable, no doubt. He turned AMG from a small builder of extremely interesting tuned Mercedes into a "premium" maker of fast versions of almost every Benz made. AMG used to be something truly special, and seeing one, never mind driving one, was a real event. Now, they build hundreds of thousands of them, and the specialness, the raw desirability, is nothing like what it used to be. Also, when he left AMG, many people speculated that it was because of AMG's announcement that they would be replacing their turbo V8 with turbo-4 hybrids -- many said Moers left because he was strongly opposed to that plan because it was counter to what AMG was about, etc. WRONG. Turns out that whole turbo-4-hybrid plan was Moers' idea! This is not in doubt -- he said so himself.

All of the above, however, pales in comparison to his shocking and horrifying recent comments about future plans. As I said in my earlier post, he is on record stating that the "key" differentiator among brands will be infotainment. Think about that! Previously, he explicitly said he'd rather spend money on infotainment than on the car's engine or chassis/structure. Astons can share platforms and engines with Mercedes -- that would be no problem. But infotainment systems? Oh no, that must be bespoke.

About F1, again, Stroll is a brand guy. That's how he made his fortune. He has quite a collection, but his first love is Ferrari. He is a race fan, no question, but Aston in F1 is 100% a marketing exercise. He has said so. He's spending money because if they do well, it'll be good for... marketing. What does that have to do with making Aston Martin road cars that are Astons underneath? Nothing. Oh, and the F1 cars are Mercedes-engined. What is Aston Martin about that? Nothing. He'd be perfectly happy selling "Astons" that are nothing more than a Benz with an Aston badge (and its own infotainment) if they'll sell.

About Peter Sprague, no, I would certainly not say the same. He understood what made an Aston and Aston. When he took control, the idea of saving money (desperately important at the time) by using a bought-in engine was raised. The idea was rejected. Why? Because an Aston Martin is a thoroughbred, like a Ferrari, and a car of that calibre must have its own engine. What did he do? He got Aston back up and running, and building real Aston Martins. Sprague understood. Stroll doesn't.

To summarize: Moers thinks there is "no reason" for Aston to have its own engine. He flat-out lied about the TMV6 that was so far along in its development. He thinks Astons and Mercedes can share platforms as well as engines. He thinks the most important thing that will distinguish future "Aston Martins" is the infotainment system. So yes, I'm absolutely convinced that he doesn't have the slightest clue or care about what makes an Aston Martin an Aston Martin. No, Herr Moers and Mr. Stroll, you cannot make an Aston Martin out of a Mercedes. We are witnessing the comprehensive destruction of one of the world's great marques. What a crying shame.

 

What bothers me about Stroll's statement, is he speaks to the suspension, the interiors, touch screen etc. But not much mention of the exterior of the cars. That's the first thing a buyer sees, if the car is not attractive, or in the case of Aston, beautiful. The rest just falls apart. My neighbor has a new Vantage, and when she starts it up, is sounds like every other Mercedes turbo, kind of not that good, just kind of blatty. Many of my neighbors have G wagons, and I cannot tell with my eyes closed which one is driving by, the Vantage or the Mercedes. Maybe Stroll can work on the sound of the car as well.

 

I think what many forget is that AML was an absolute burning train wreck when Stroll and Moers arrived. Seriously in debt and what I envision as a rudderless ship.

Is Stroll and Moers the ones I would have chosen to save this sinking ship? Probably not, but without them and Stroll's cash infusion Aston would be heading for another bankruptcy and possible liquidation. It is easy to criticize, but I personally believe the new leadership team at AML are doing their absolute best in attempting to save Aston.

With regards to whether it is an Aston engine or a Mercedes engine, I could care less. In fact, I wish my Vantage did have a Mercedes engine as it would be easier to service. The closest Aston dealer to me is 255 miles away. There are three Mercedes dealerships close by.

I truly hope that AML will not only survive but actually thrive.

 

The question is why?

 

It's simple. Who was haphazardly running AML before Stroll and Moers arrived?

I think what we all have in common is that we love Aston Martin, and we want it to survive. We can all sit and disect what someone at AML said, but I believe it is currently a very fluid situation with small and even large corrections being made on a daily basis. I believe Moers when he said that AML was in a considerably worse situation than he anticipated and placing AML on the right course is not going to happen overnight.

 

I thought there are rumors that Moers' position at AML is in question? There could be some management re-positioning.

 

I doubt anyone involved in this discussion has forgotten the state Aston was in.

I agree that Moers and Stroll are trying to "save" the company as a going concern. They want to make money. I think that is the only thing they care about. Perhaps, alternatively, they have some ego-driven notion that they can "re-imagine" Aston as something that completely ignores its history and heritage, and what made Aston one of the great marques. Having the most special infotainment system in a car that has a Mercedes platform and engine, but an Aston badge -- yep, that would be a thorough re-imagining. It would also be reprehensible. Either way, I think they couldn’t possibly care less about whether the company resembles the marque many of us know and love.

You and I could not disagree more completely about the importance of an Aston engine in an Aston Martin. That you would rather have a Benz engine under the hood simply because it would be more convenient to service says to me that you don't care what an Aston is, or what makes an Aston an Aston. I don't mean that in a derogatory manner, but rather that we have deep and fundamentally different perspectives on what makes an Aston an Aston. Why not use a Chevy engine? That would be convenient to service. A Nissan engine? A Toyota platform? Why not just badge-engineer a Benz? After all, it apparently doesn't matter. If I want an AMG engine, I’ll buy an AMG car. To be clear, I wouldn't want a Mercedes with an Aston engine either. Would a Ferrari with an AMG engine be a Ferrari to you? Maybe you wouldn't care as long as it's convenient to service. IMO, an Aston Martin should be worthy of some inconvenience.

It would be hard to find someone who loves Aston Martin, and who wants it to survive, more than I do. But it has to truly survive -- as Aston Martin, not as a diluted badge-on-a-Benz that uses Mercedes engines and/or platforms. Moers clearly believes he can make an "Aston" that shares not only its engine, but also its platform, with Mercedes. He has said so. He’s wrong. MG "survives" as a Chinese-owned maker of cheap, small, utterly uninteresting SUVs. That's not MG -- that's a fate worse than death.

Aston Martin "surviving" as a Benz-platformed-and-powered vehicle with a bespoke "infotainment" system is not surviving -- it's grotesque, and a fate worse than bowing out with some remaining dignity. It's also not the only way forward -- such an awful fate would be their choice. If they are executing on what Moers has said (no reason to doubt that), then they are comprehensively obliterating Aston Martin. We are witnessing an automotive atrocity in the making.

 

Speedracer -

You have stated your option regarding Aston heritage and engines ad nauseam. We hear you and understand your extreme dissatisfaction with where you think things are headed.

Unfortunately, change at AML is happening whether we like it or not.

You can either get on board with those changes or be left behind on the dock.

I truly hope you can eventually find peace with wherever AML ends up.

 

Great conversation that has me reflecting on my own Aston experience. My purchase was mostly heart and loins driven as opposed to a cold rational process. Not frivolous but the scales were definitely biased (uncharacteristically) against optimal utility and analytical superiority. I had looked at and driven exactly two Vantage roadsters, including my ultimate purchase, for less than an hour when I wrote a check to the dealer. I was only somewhat familiar with Aston over the years, and was seriously considering a Bentley at the time. I remember my surprise at the relative affordability of the Vantage which then led me to a more dedicated search and learning curve. The Aston to me represented an exclusive marque (even in Los Angeles) and a more sporty/fun alternative to Bentley. Not a criticism but I had zero interest in a Porsche, Ferrari, or especially a Lamborghini (absolutely have a desire for the older, more differentiated and beautiful models of these amazing cars). I think of my car as what Bentley and maybe Rolls would have produced if their lineup included a smaller sports/GT model. I like a bespoke interior of metal and leather with a "Patek" dash, rather than a "Richard Mille" pod. No doubt my taste for analog, tactile, natural materials and sounds, and somewhat approachable mechanicals is pushing up against its expiration date. I suppose the Brass Era owners went through the same emotions. IMHO in a perfect world AM would have given up on the idea of going head to head with a 911 using a the standard Vantage, which in street form has always been a sporty but comfortable luxury ride laden with sound deadening and creature comforts. I always liked the idea of a lightweight, modestly but well-appointed Aston sports car geared to the old school driving enthusiast (dare I say NA 6 cylinder), but that's a pipe dream and perhaps losing out to Lotus anyway.

So, in memoriam, I leave you this. Warning that it is in French, but I love everything about the featured car and it makes me want to run out and detail mine! Also, check out the unexpected discussion at the 10-minute mark about the elbow pad. I have no idea what they are saying but it had me laughing.

 

Interesting thread... as I started up my Aston this morning to head to a cars and coffee, I was greeted by
Power
Beauty
Soul
And the glorious sound

To paraphrase Linus...

"That's what Aston Martin is all about, Charlie Brown..."

 

Even worse, the later ones say:
Pure
Aston
Martin
on start up (that ain't true anymore)

 

Prefurbia...
If you hate everything so much...why do you continually weigh in?
I know I am old!
But...every time I look at or drive my DBS Superleggera or remember the looks or reactions from my 2012 V12 Vantage...I realize that these cars are
the most beautiful automotive creations in existence...
Thanks,
JH