REVIEW : 981 Boxster S PDK
#16
05-23-2012, 01:21 PM
John,
I have to respectfully disagree with this. I'm 49 and have been turning wrenches since I was 17. I've done engine sways (blown big block in tubbed, full caged S-10, blown 306 in a Miata) but at my age, I've turned so many wrenches that I'm tired of it. I hate working on my cars.
In fact, last year when I decided to install a Duramax diesel in my H2, I sent it to CA. to be done. (Thank God I did... the wiring was a nightmare)
I've been in the body shop business for 30 years. I've molded, made, twisted and designed wings, spoilers, hoods that I've had people beg me to make. I've done it so much, I hate it. I'd much rather buy one off the shelf (providing it meets my requirements) than take the time to make one.
My point is, does that make me any less of an enthusiast?? Hell no, I'm a car nut. I love cars but the fact that I don't want to work on them anymore doesn't make me any less of an enthusiast, it just makes me ignorant on how they tick, work or function.
A unknowledgeable person is not equated with a non-enthusiastic car junkie.
My .02....
Mark
#17
05-23-2012, 03:21 PM
Hey, Manifold.. Lighten up a bit and reread what I wrote. You are making me work too hard. OK ok ok... so you must be one of those guys who never works on their own car...haahahaha or you just enjoy playing devil's advocate!?
However: "So, if someone doesn't work on their cars, does that make them less of a car enthusiast?". YES, of course it does. They are NOT as INVOLVED with their car the person who is doing some/most of their own work. How could that be any different? If you do your own mods and adjust things yourself, the next time you are really using your car, you are very much aware of how the car is now responding to the road and your right foot. You may also be thinking about how you might readjust whatever it is to work even better. But that is strictly in terms of involvement and hasn't a thing to do with snobbery.
If you do none of the work on your car... it may mean you are not as connected as you could be but it has little bearing on how enthusiastic you may be about owning and using your car. However, the more I think about it I have to admit that many times the guys who do their own work have tended to have a bias against those who don't. sigh.
About driving skills. I am an old SCCA racer. At work once I was introduced as "the racer" and a pal immediately interrupted and said "Anyone can be a racer. He is a racing champion!" Well, there is truth to that but is sounds really uppity and means nothing unless you are racing.
Basically, our cars are getting so good that we are becoming less and less a part of the equation. If you are reading this you possibly are thinking " H.. no!". Well, go out to your favorite back road and turn ALL your driver's aids OFF. Yes. Even those ones they make it difficult to turn off. Now, I imagine you will be in a 986-987 and these are some of the nicest handling and best balanced cars ever built. If you can't drive one of these well without all the aids, you need to seriously consider attending a drivers school. Really. BTW, if you have never done this before, you should use caution. Older drivers aids were intrusive and I was always aware when they kicked in but newer cars are amazingly seamless and allow talentless drivers to feel and look like skilled enthusiasts. If you aren't careful you could hurt your car or yourself.
All this thinking makes me want to get out and visit one of my back roads.
But will I be willing to turn the driver's aids off?!
JR
However: "So, if someone doesn't work on their cars, does that make them less of a car enthusiast?". YES, of course it does. They are NOT as INVOLVED with their car the person who is doing some/most of their own work. How could that be any different? If you do your own mods and adjust things yourself, the next time you are really using your car, you are very much aware of how the car is now responding to the road and your right foot. You may also be thinking about how you might readjust whatever it is to work even better. But that is strictly in terms of involvement and hasn't a thing to do with snobbery.
If you do none of the work on your car... it may mean you are not as connected as you could be but it has little bearing on how enthusiastic you may be about owning and using your car. However, the more I think about it I have to admit that many times the guys who do their own work have tended to have a bias against those who don't. sigh.
About driving skills. I am an old SCCA racer. At work once I was introduced as "the racer" and a pal immediately interrupted and said "Anyone can be a racer. He is a racing champion!" Well, there is truth to that but is sounds really uppity and means nothing unless you are racing.
Basically, our cars are getting so good that we are becoming less and less a part of the equation. If you are reading this you possibly are thinking " H.. no!". Well, go out to your favorite back road and turn ALL your driver's aids OFF. Yes. Even those ones they make it difficult to turn off. Now, I imagine you will be in a 986-987 and these are some of the nicest handling and best balanced cars ever built. If you can't drive one of these well without all the aids, you need to seriously consider attending a drivers school. Really. BTW, if you have never done this before, you should use caution. Older drivers aids were intrusive and I was always aware when they kicked in but newer cars are amazingly seamless and allow talentless drivers to feel and look like skilled enthusiasts. If you aren't careful you could hurt your car or yourself.
All this thinking makes me want to get out and visit one of my back roads.
But will I be willing to turn the driver's aids off?!
JR
- Someone who likes cars as objects to possess, display, and admire.
- Someone who likes working on cars because they enjoy understanding their mechanical aspects in depth and modifying cars to their preferences.
- Someone who likes driving cars, especially cars that drive well - perhaps this person is properly more a driving enthusiast rather than car enthusiast.
The second category has only limited application to me because my time is limited and I'd rather drive cars than work on them. But I did enjoy working on cars and motorcycles when I was younger, when life was much more leisurely.
The third category is the one that applies to me. And I would argue that, since performance/sports cars were designed to be driven, that's what their designers intended their owners to do, rather than becoming mechanics, though I agree that every owner of a performance/sports car should have at least basic knowledge of how it works and when something might be wrong.
#18
05-23-2012, 05:55 PM
My “working” on my cars came out of necessity because when I was younger, I a) enjoyed it and b) couldn’t afford to pay someone even if I didn’t like it.
I tend to fall into the third category for a few reasons.
1) I don’t have the time to devote to wrenching anymore.
2) I don’t enjoy wrenching anymore.
3) I can afford not to wrench anymore.
Last but not least, as technology increases, it gets harder and harder to do any of your own work. Yeah, sure you can add an exhaust or shocks but with the electronics on the engines, shy of uploading a tune into your engine (which doesn’t qualify as “working” on your car) not everyone has a 50K computer to hook up to.
Regardless, it’s pretty well obvious that anyone that owns/drives a P car appreciates a car that I consider “a driver’s car”.
With that said, I don’t care what anyone drives... just glad they have an appreciation for cool cars.
Mark
I tend to fall into the third category for a few reasons.
1) I don’t have the time to devote to wrenching anymore.
2) I don’t enjoy wrenching anymore.
3) I can afford not to wrench anymore.
Last but not least, as technology increases, it gets harder and harder to do any of your own work. Yeah, sure you can add an exhaust or shocks but with the electronics on the engines, shy of uploading a tune into your engine (which doesn’t qualify as “working” on your car) not everyone has a 50K computer to hook up to.
Regardless, it’s pretty well obvious that anyone that owns/drives a P car appreciates a car that I consider “a driver’s car”.
With that said, I don’t care what anyone drives... just glad they have an appreciation for cool cars.
Mark
#19
05-23-2012, 07:19 PM
Oh my.. What was this thread about again?
I'll refrain from my comments because I know when to keep my mouth shut..
That being said.. The new boxster is just getting better n better...
The Spyder is a complete car from bumper to bumper.. The C R is not to far off the mark as well.. And a cayman gt would be the Bomb!
But there is the old problem that Just nags at certain people... It remains to be a personnel problem with certain people...
Sometimes having money doesn't make you smart..( although money doesn't suck)... But u gotta love the more money than skills guys.. Or the look down the nose syndrome... Who cares..
A Porsche is a Porsche is a Porsche !!!
I'll refrain from my comments because I know when to keep my mouth shut..
That being said.. The new boxster is just getting better n better...
The Spyder is a complete car from bumper to bumper.. The C R is not to far off the mark as well.. And a cayman gt would be the Bomb!
But there is the old problem that Just nags at certain people... It remains to be a personnel problem with certain people...
Sometimes having money doesn't make you smart..( although money doesn't suck)... But u gotta love the more money than skills guys.. Or the look down the nose syndrome... Who cares..
A Porsche is a Porsche is a Porsche !!!
#21
05-23-2012, 09:00 PM
Hmm, what about the Cayenne and Panamera? Very nice SUVs and sports sedans, so I'm not knocking them, but they're not true sports cars, and I think of Porsche first and foremost as being a sports/racing car company.
#22
05-23-2012, 09:02 PM
Well, relatively speaking, I would consider them "sportier" than their competitors....
#23
05-23-2012, 09:08 PM
Agreed, in that sense they're still Porsches. But there's still a gap between the 911/Boxster/Cayman vs Cayenne/Panamera, as you can see based on which cars show up to autocross and track events.
#24
05-23-2012, 09:24 PM
Please don't mistake this for an argument, I sincerely don't know what's going on in this thread after page 1 lol.
Last edited by shermanator; 05-23-2012 at 09:27 PM.
#25
05-23-2012, 09:42 PM
Right, so what is your point? Your conclusion can be said for most automakers today. Consider SLS AMG vs. R350, Corvette ZR1 vs. Cobalt, Viper vs. Caravan etc.
Please don't mistake this for an argument, I sincerely don't know what's going on in this thread after page 1 lol.
Please don't mistake this for an argument, I sincerely don't know what's going on in this thread after page 1 lol.
#27
05-23-2012, 10:15 PM
Manifold.. I'm just gonna have to say this is a nice way.. Either blow me.. Or choke on it..
Are you that difficult in real life?
Are you that difficult in real life?
#29
05-23-2012, 10:23 PM
And a panamera turbo s is a hell of a car!!! That's the problem with mercedes guys...
I drove the BMW Alpina b7... Far superior to any Mercedes...
Yep ... I was that *****... Loved every minute of it
Sadly but happily trade the b7 in on a raptor f150.. Why... Kuz motortrend says its the gt3 of trucks... Who am I to argue..
But when you go to p driving school.. And you do the off road course with the cayenne ... And then Haywood gives u a hot lap in the panamera ...
Come back and apologize ...
Kuz any and all a Porsche is a Porsche is a etc etc..
I drove the BMW Alpina b7... Far superior to any Mercedes...
Yep ... I was that *****... Loved every minute of it
Sadly but happily trade the b7 in on a raptor f150.. Why... Kuz motortrend says its the gt3 of trucks... Who am I to argue..
But when you go to p driving school.. And you do the off road course with the cayenne ... And then Haywood gives u a hot lap in the panamera ...
Come back and apologize ...
Kuz any and all a Porsche is a Porsche is a etc etc..
Last edited by StockKiller; 05-23-2012 at 10:39 PM.
#30
05-23-2012, 10:44 PM
Jesus, that was nice? I would hate to see you when you're mean lol.
This should take an interesting turn come morning....
This should take an interesting turn come morning....