BWHAHAHAH

that was funny

 

I'll be the first to say I think the TT is overpriced (IMO). But if people are willing to pay for it then that's Porsche advantage for making a car that people are willing to part with 130k for.

Now to suggest that a Nissan GT-R is worth as much as a Porsche 911 Turbo is idiocracy. If they carried the same value, then the Nissan buyer would be smarter, but the Porsche is worth more. You cant slap some pleather on the dash, a computer screen on the dash and call it equal to a TT.

Nissan is probably losing a fortune on this car but the difference in this and the CGT is that the CGT like most loss leaders are only limited production runs, then they go away. The GT-R is here to stay and has meant to be from day 1.

 

both are hot end of story.

 

Just to put this into perspective...

The modded GT3 Cup cars running in the Speed GT series in Long Beach were beaten by a Mustang that run 1:26.2, which set a Speed GT record.

The Flying Lizard RSR by van Overbeek and Pilet ran a 1:20.6. The ALMS cars are on a whole other level.

So considering the Alzen 996 Turbo is way faster than an RSR... do the math. Ain't no Skyline gonna touch that Porsche!

 

Yup. Sure ain't!

 

I agree 1,000,000% Kudos!

 

Also, I don't see how you could watch yesterdays ALMS race and not want a Porsche.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arju

After reading the responses here I thought I should chime in.

Well you’ve said a lot there without really saying anything. The problem with your argument is that the very presence of the GTR will have altered the curve itself, yet there’s no way to prove/disprove this.

Whilst the basic ATTESA system was developed in the late ‘80s, it remains the most modern and best of the fundamental AWD setups, allowing increased traction without understeer. The basic viscous AWD system found its way onto a Jenson Interceptor FF in the mid ‘70s. Whilst the GTR may have joined together some existing ideas, it’s made a lot of ideas a lot better and at an affordable price, in much the same way that the Ford Model T did. Audi introduced the DSG to production, full credit, but their system can only handle 400Nm. The GTR DCT clutches can handle 90kgm, or 880Nm. Sure the Veyron system can handle 1500Nm but the Veyron costs more than a new helicopter. Some of the GTR’s aerodynamic ideas are also new to the production scene, with reference to the single-piece front duct.

In a few years time Porsche should be able to trump the basic GTR but I guess we’ll see if they rise to the challenge.

 

first of all, the nams r34 is not a "racecar", it's a shed/garage tuned car for time attack. R34s running high 54' times by now.

an ASM S2000 (NA 303hp 1300kg) ran a 57.3' time @ the last Tsukuba super lap ... so Porsche 997 GT3 Cup and tuned s2000 are equal nowz?

The fastest GT car on Tsukuba, is the SuperGT GT500 ARTA NSX ( GT500 Car >>> FIAGT/DTM/ALMS/LMES & Alzen 966) running a 51'.

so going by your glorious logic, a shed tuned r34 54'sec "is almost equal" to an 51'sec ARTA NSX GT500 Car? ..... yeeeaaaah, i don't think so.

 

Let me educate you right quick.

First of all, we dont know who's driving what. I can assure you that a cup car is going to be much faster than 4 seconds over street cars on street tires.

Secondly, what tires were being used? Who knows, therefore these comparisons are fairly useless. But I do KNOW that the Advan A048 tires that the Japanese Time Attack cars use are specially made for them, and you cant get them anywhere else, and they are some of the fastest short stint tires on the planet, hence PART of the reason the HKS destroyed everyone at the Super Lap Battle at Buttonwillow.

Next is that the GT3 is built for RACING, not time attacks, it can run 57"s for hours upon hours. I'd bet money that time attack car cant do that. I can run with many guys in cup cars for a couple laps, but not for all that long. KNOW THE DIFFERENCE.

Lastly, do you see the weight/hp and amount of aero mods on a GT500 car? If you want to compare a fully developed, I think they are tubed frame as well, car with 500 hp to a basically stripped interior GT3 with better suspension and a sequential, then you're nuts.

Now what would be humbling is that I'd bet an RSR would be really close to that NSX time. And without all of the crap they put on those GT500 cars. Most of them arent even close to what they started out as. An RSR is on a GT3 RS chassy and the Cup Car is on the GT3 Chassy. They are street cars converted for the track, just done by Porsche and not a tuning shop.

 

Dang, I wish I could comprehend your post!

Now you get why I put 'race car', smart one.

Where did you get s2000 from? I could car less about these fart can race cars. There is no SUBSTITUTE!

Look at the lap times, they are similar beside the fact that one is a seriously modded street car and the other is a factory built race car from the company with the best heritage!

 

i think porsche and indeed ferrari and lambos days as the fastest, utlimate point to point, public road machines in simple terms of performance disappeared long ago.
theres too many manufacturers passing on technology from other forms of motorsport, WRC being the big one, that result in cars that are reliable, give massive performance and are hugely useable on normal road situations, something which lets face it is what we encounter the most, all the while being able to cut it on the average track day with ease.
ive had several cars that could confidently and with ease eat any porsche or ferrari it came up against and had friends with the same. ive had a homologation issue STI subaru that was very low 3 seconds 0-60 and pulled 7750rpm flat out in 6th gear at 135mph all from a 2litre engine. no top end speed but on public roads or tracks it mattered not giving you a gear and perfect power balance for every situation. i had a works spec WRC escort cosworth that was just as fast and could pull 170+mph top end that i converted back for daily use and which nothing could touch, both of these cost me around 30k and never gave me a problem in daily use or my commutes. a friend has an 800bhp r32 thats ridiculously fast and can embarrass almost anything in meets (save other high spec modded evos or subarus) and is used to get him to work and for grocery shopping.
try and catch or keep up with a lancia delta integrale evo on a regular twisty road and you will struggle in anything other than another one, its still the fastest point to point car ever made and its over 15 years old now. the list is endless and to measure supercars in simple terms like these they are going to fall far short, the new GTR is just the latest incarnation of this trend and will not be the last.

does that make them better than porsche or others, not by a long shot in my opinion and from my experience no matter what they lap. to view these cars in such simple terms is to miss much about the issues on hand. the fact that each manufacturer, nissan in this case sets out with the specific aim to dethrone porsche as its clearly and in some cases only stated goal says much about where even their manufacturers and designers see the pinnacle being despite their language, PR and specs.
each time i beat a supercar in my cheaper and faster rally machine i would have still given my right arm just to have been sitting in the car lagging behind, living my boy hood dreams and all that comes with. who cared when cruising along the main street that my car could eat what was behind as a first course, all eyes were on the supercar that followed. whenever i drove one for myself it was apparent almost immediately that this reputation was earned through much more than price or image
what you get with a porsche, ferrari, lambo and other cars of the same ilk is a feeling, an interaction and an experience that goes far beyond what any of these lesser cars can ever hope to offer and most likely ever will. you get something tangible that at the same time is difficult to describe. thats what you pay for and why you buy them. my c2 is easily the slowest accelerating, least powerful car ive owned in the last 12 years and yet its the best car ive ever had, bar none and feels controlled like very little else. you get the feeling that raw power is most definately not the point, thats easy to achieve. instead you feel the engineering from every single pore of it as you sit in it, take it on a run in the sunshine, drive it slowly round town or corner on the limit. you feel race pedigree dripping off it and a sense of class that these faster, higher performance vehicles at a lower cost wish they could begin to offer.
porsche like only a few others are on a level, earned through the years that is an ocean apart from all these other manufacturers no matter what they make or come along with, certainly for the forseeable future IMHO. i guess you could summarize crudely as saying you feel the breeding in these brands and thats something you cant bottle or get just from lap times and bhp.

sure there will always be people chasing the next fastest thing who will jump from brand to brand but i truly think that to concentrate too much on catering to these numbers is the biggest mistake porsche can make.
pushing forward and keeping the pedigree, breeding stronger and finer is a much better approach imho even if that means you dont lap nurburgring quicker than the next plastic disposable product that appears.
porsche 911s are still one of those rare cars that dreams are made of, many of these other cars that come along are just something that scratches a temporary speed itch.

 

Neilwight -- you should convert that post ^^^ to a letter to the editor and send it to every car magazine in the world.

not too shabby for your 14th post

I could not agree more.

Kudos to Nissan for building the Millenium Falcon... quite a marvel... goes like stink and looks like a$$.

 

You should get a lapis blue one, PJPJPJPJPPPJPPJ. Then put C.C.W. rims on it!

And a RacersEDGE sticker on it! Don't forget the NOS!

 

No production car beats the 997GT2, road or track. But that posters point, which I agree with, is the GT2 is $210k+ while the GTR is $70, and Porsche don't have $200K worth of technology in the GT2, while the GTR has more technology than the GT2. The only act Porsche have together is the one of relieving you of your well earned -- and they do it so well.

I drove the GTR, in the canyons, and it's limits are very high and inspires confidence.

Black on Black is the only way to option a GT2. Will have to do a trackday, you in the GT2 me in the GTR, the outcome may surprised ya.

The ghetto birds interest in my car is why there was no interview... Was quite surprised how good it looks on camera...