RE: Le Mans '08

Enough!

This has been going on for approximately three years. When are we going to develop a capable solution to the F430.

An effort to an overall win would also be nice.

The resources exist and this is in Porsche's DNA.

 

+1!

Of course it didn't help that Porsche factory driver Patrick Long made a rookie mistake and took out the two RSR's with the best chances to win GT2!

 

I've read some flames on the RL site about this thread being a race day spoiler. I realize that I may have inadvertently contributed with my reply and, if so, I'd like to apologize in advance. I was unaware of this race day practice which (after you hear about it) makes perfect sense. I'll certainly keep it in mind in future.

 

Its simple, its called a Cayman with the right motor that should have been put in it in the first place!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It needs the mid engine platform in order to compete, you can only fight a lacking design for so long. Only my opinion and I guarantee people will disagree, but the proof is in the pudding, all ego's aside!

 

First off ,the 08 RSR has been and is showing more speed the the 430 this year. We had Long crush the GT2 class qualifying record at Lemans 3:58.1! The Lizards set the fast lap of the class, it's no longer an issuse of speed anymore. Long just had a terrible mistake that took his team and the Lizards out of the race win. I wouldn't be surprise if he doesn't pick up that Porsche seat when his contract is up. The real issue I see was that there were ONLY 3 911s at the race. In the 40+ years I have never seen so few 911s competing! Looking at the ACO rules and the huge speed difference between diesel and Gas LMP1s, don't expect Porsche to race in LMP1. The ACO would need to make the gas LMP1s much more competitive for Porsche to enter LMP1.

 

+10000000


When will some people start actually paying attention to the races/qualifying/testing/details before whining about everything. The RSR's were faster at that race, sorry that rear engine is just as likely to break as any other car when you crash it, and cant win with almost an hour of repairs in the pits.

 

Heavy the reason there were so few RSRs is because no one believed Porsche would be competitive this year and jumped ship. The 3 RSRs were the fastest in qualifying and on the track even after the crash Porsche was the only GT2 car posting sub 4 minute laps.
this would have been HUGE this year if not for the wreck. Porsche would have finished one two with no mistakes (A big IF) and all those guys that jumped ship would have been REALLY sorry. This post makes no sense because he didnt know how fast the Lizards were. they were 1.7 seconds A LAP!!!!! they would have been LAPS ahead of any Ferrari there if they hadnt wrecked out.
SO Porsche would have been 1-2 in GT2 and LMP2 thats pretty good. Rumors are that Penske is showing up next year and looking to take the
LMP2 spyders to the overall win. I will believe it when they actually SHOW UP!

 

I agree.

The rsr would simply have molested a mid engine (ahem cayman) platform. But endurance races are about not making mistakes. Something the car cannot be blamed for.

 

I am not an engineer but it seems we are nearing the technological end for the rear engine configuration. Porsche mid engine development (for a 911 sized car) comparatively speaking is young. I truly hate to say it because I am for 911s all the way and would compare my history of ownership and support with any of the regulars on these forums. There is a reason there were so few 911s on the Le Mans grid. The teams that are spending millions want the best chance to win the race.

I am not certain that the rear engine configuration will be at the top of the food chain over the next few years in the premier races.

(From my post on Rennlist)

 

Critics have been saying for decades that the rear engine design on the 911 can't work. Porsche has continued to build better 911s and continued to make the timeless design faster. I'll let the wizards at Weissach continue to let the critics eat crow.

 

The Rear engine 911 will never go away unless Porsche wants to committ Fiscal Suicide.
They tried sending the 911 to the grave when the 928 came out. The statement of the day was we are nearing the technological end for the rear engine configuration.
David there is a good reason why youre not an engineer.

 

Last year when the f430 was better porsche won. This year, the defending champs, and lizard (top 2 teams) wrecked each other. Lizard went to lemans with only 1 car hoping the extra concentration would help with the win. In the end the risk cost them, but that is racing. I wish Farnbacher would have raced, since they too are just as fast if not faster at times. Porsche had a good chance for the ALMS titles last year too with a clearly outmatched car. This year they are on top with a DNF, and have clearly answered ferrari by raising the bar again even with ferrari's A/C cheat.

I would be curious to see if pensky's porsche's could take the overall title. I feel they would be out matched on that course but they have proven MANY MANY MANY times recently that even tracks they seem to have no chance on they will/can win on. Audi only seems to beat the porsche's when cautions come out near the end.

Most teams claimed they jumped ship off of porsche because of porsche lack of effort in the gt2 class. A good amount of their resources have gone into the spyder RS. 2nd teir teams where being over looked by porsche when ferrari did not. Porsche is doing fine in gt2 and the gamble has paid off with MASSIVE wins like sebring for the Spyder.


And for those that claim the 911 is nearing its end. I agree that the Cayman needs to be let loose, but even if the 911 loses its edge it will NEVER go away. The 911 still has plenty of tricks it can use while keeping the same displacement. Quite frankly Porsche needs to let the market decide, and some internal competion will only benefit us. So give the cayman the 3.6 and LSD!!!

 

The rules in ALMS/ACO classing have been pretty much the same in the weight/hp category for some time now, the ONLY place the RSR would be limited is in how much power you can get out of it vs a Ferrari/Corvette/Ford GT/Panoz V8 or Viper V10. Other than that the RSR is ahead of everything out there, now that tire management, cooling issues, and those mid corner push issues have been dealt with, the RSR's are the fastest in GT2 class across the globe.


So explain again how the 911 is at the end...........



The only possible notion is that the street cars and making reliable hp last for 100k+ miles is going to be increasingly hard to do with the flat 6. But the new DI is going to alleviate that and PDK will mask it a little bit. So the 911, even on the street has many MANY years to go before it's demise.

So when GT2 class up the weight/hp by a large margin, let us know, but until then, I'm not buying it.

And it's more likely that CAFE will have completely stepped in and the hp wars will die long before the 911 will. And we all know on a level playing field in terms of hp, the Porsches will win. Period.

 

Great information from you guys!

It is almost certain that PAG will always produce rear engine 911s, just as Ducati will always produce V-twins.

However, I feel, in the premier professional race venues these configurations will have it tougher and tougher.