What have you found out about the cranks? Any interesting info?

 

I learned that pankl will redesign for you parts they've already designed for someone else, for 10k and up...kinda sad as they've already made a crank, but I get it, someone else paid them to do it...
PPM is an Australian company that can take up to a year to make parts (reference a 928 thread) but generally seem to be a standup company. They make 4034 cranks in 80.4 and 82.4 stroke. And they're not too expensive, under $5k or so.
Also found a guy on pelican parts selling stock 4.0RS cranks for 6k

I think the crank, rods pistons aren't so bad, I'm finding out that the liners are Spendy!

Also check out the engine 911design has for sale on eBay. Just search for GT3 engine...

 

Liners are cheap compared to the other parts combined. Around 2.5K installed, including the liners and machining, installation of them into the blocks.
Stock crank for 6K is not really a good deal. If you are going to spend that much you might as well go with a billet one with a bit more stroke and pick up more CCs.

 

OK, good, I was told liners were much more spendy, that's more inline with my expectations (used darton in the past for sleeving aluminum blocks, not the same but similar...)

If I don't have to spend $10k on design and then $8k per crank with someone like pankl I'm all for it... although an 82.4mm crank is getting a bit long, and I don't have unexplored territory dollars to throw into this, if you know what I mean. 4.2 is plenty big for my NA aspirations... For a turbo build with more modest bore, I can see wanting a bit more stroke (good for spool as well...)

 

I'm with Jamie on this one.

4.2 is plenty big enough for me and as mentioned before us NA guys will be better with a bore of 105. something and keep the stroke no more than around the 80 mm mark.

 

This!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/PORSCHE-1999-2012-4-2-LITER-530-HP-GT3-ENGINE-TITANIUM-VALVES-NEW-0-HOURS-/121017316322?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories &hash=item1c2d31b3e2&vxp=mtr

 

This looks very good.
Somebody jump on it before I'm forced to do it.

\m/

 

Small world. I didn't know 911 Design built up engines. They had an open house last year in December, but I didn't tour the whole thing. It's a nice facility located visible from the 10 fwy near Central Ave. They have a state of the art paint booth and the place had a lot of nice project cars.

 

I have spoken with the owner and discussed building motors with the parts that I would supply. Their price is pretty reasonable compared to some of the other quotes I got. Discussed with him some price breaks doing multiple builds at once and he was open to the idea. They have been around for a while and do great work.
They are on top of my list to have the motors built by, along with a couple of race engine build shops(all they do is build race motors, not just Porsches).

 

The operative words above are, "race motor".
This an interesting and important comment.
In such build endeavors one wants a "street car" that has substancial power & torque gains but still driveable.
A "race motor" would be a diaster on the street with poor low end torque (in NA motors) and a motor that only shines above 7,000 rpms ... not a street car.
It can be accomplished. I know of one. A pleasure on the street and a monster on the track. Near 3,000 miles of use and multiple track days WITHOUT a hiccup.
Okay enough from me.

\m/

 

I think you are focusing on the wrong thing here. There are engine builders and there are engine builders. lol

The mechanic working at your local dealership can build an engine just as a "race engine builder" can build an engine but the mechanic at the dealership does not build that engine with tighter tolerances, does not balance the rotating assembly so everything is close in weight to each other(rods, pistons), does not check valve to piston clearances at different lift\duration of the cams, valve spring coil bind, check rod\crank\block bearing clearances, etc. etc. but instead the dealership mechanic grabs the parts from the factory and puts them together according to the instructions provided to him. The timing is usually done with lining up certain crank, cam indicators together, some sort of a sequence provided by the factory(idiot proof; for example I have built a few subaru motors and it is pretty easy to set up timing, you light up the slots on the cam gears and the crank with lines on the timing belt and you are good to go=) The way a race engine builder, builds an engine is a lot more time consuming and complicated.
So, when I say a race engine builder, I don't mean he is going to build a "RACE ENGINE" for your street car, what I was trying to say is that they would be a lot more qualified to build the type of engine build we are talking about here. I hope that makes it a little bit more clear.

Your comment about a car with a race engine, and how it will only shine past 7000, with low bottom end torque, would be due to cams. We are not talking about using race cams. If you wanted to you can have the same short block and have a different heads\cams setup to build a race setup. You have the option and only you, I don't mean Keiser, I mean the owner of any of one of the engines that would be built, would have the choice to make that decision.

Added displacement will give you added torque, and power with what ever heads\cams you choose to use. You can of course pick up more power with better flowing heads, and cams with more lift\duration, and higher compression. If you decide you are going to run E85, or race gas all the time, you can set up your compression ratio higher to pick up more power; it's an option.

I saw that motor that you were talking about, the one for sale on eBay, the one that has 13.3 to 1 compression ratio. You would not be able to use that motor to its full potential unless you were running high octane fuel. I don't mean 91 or 93. It is not my place to comment on the price, but it seems like a pretty well built motor minus the compression for a street car. It would make a great race car, track day queen or a dyno queen car engine. You mentioned you might buy that so I am assuming you are in search for a race engine, not a street engine then.

Back to the Race engine builder part. There are dentists and there are Oral Surgeons. Dentist would be the dealership mechanic and the Oral Surgeon would be the Race Engine builder. A dentist can give you some fillings, etc. but the Oral surgeon is the one with the added skill and know how who you would go to when it comes to serious work like wisdom teeth removal, etc. I am going to shut up now… I am sure you know by now what I am trying to say.

 

What I would like to know is how the 530 HP was calculated if it has not be dyno'd? My 4.0 (Cup) motor dyno'd at 397 to the wheels same builder. Just say'n.

 

If you know this builder maybe you can ask them this question?
Would truly like to know their answer.

ADAMNSONS, I understand your response. You points are valid.
You want a powerful engine but not a race motor per say where use is measured in hours.

\m/

 

The only way you will know is to buy it, install it, program an ECU for it, build a harness for it, dyno it and then you will know. I would not rely on anything less as I have been down that road. lol

 

I'd be surprised if they don't already have an engine dyno harness that they use to tune the engines they build on the engine dyno.

I built a MOTEC engine dyno wiring harness that I used for my Subaru motors. I built it where it can be configured to work with even a 12 cylinder engine, all the input and outputs, which you could use which ever, how many ever you like(limited to the capability of the M48).