Road & Track 2014 Porsche GT3 First Drive Review
#31
05-01-2013 | 06:23 PM
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When cars progress it's about making them faster, handle better, stop better and go quicker around the track. New IS better because this car does most everything better as with every new generation. Who would buy new cars if they didn't offer better performance?
Your statement only applies to people who like older technology that hinders progression for a subjective "feel". If people want a stick car then buy a 997.2 GT3RS. Leave the whining at the door and the new allocations for people like me who want the best performing machines available
Your statement only applies to people who like older technology that hinders progression for a subjective "feel". If people want a stick car then buy a 997.2 GT3RS. Leave the whining at the door and the new allocations for people like me who want the best performing machines available
#32
05-01-2013 | 11:20 PM
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The 458 is a great car, but a manual one would be even more fun!
This.
Only dual clutches in all Ferraris now, right? One transmission = more R&D can get poured into it = better product across the entire brand. (I believe, as of now, there are two different versions of the dual clutch trans in their cars)
I can't see driving a McLaren MP4-12C or 458 Italia and think,"Man, this is boring."
Anyone?
Only dual clutches in all Ferraris now, right? One transmission = more R&D can get poured into it = better product across the entire brand. (I believe, as of now, there are two different versions of the dual clutch trans in their cars)
I can't see driving a McLaren MP4-12C or 458 Italia and think,"Man, this is boring."
Anyone?
#33
05-01-2013 | 11:22 PM
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When cars progress it's about making them faster, handle better, stop better and go quicker around the track. New IS better because this car does most everything better as with every new generation. Who would buy new cars if they didn't offer better performance?
Your statement only applies to people who like older technology that hinders progression for a subjective "feel". If people want a stick car then buy a 997.2 GT3RS. Leave the whining at the door and the new allocations for people like me who want the best performing machines available
Your statement only applies to people who like older technology that hinders progression for a subjective "feel". If people want a stick car then buy a 997.2 GT3RS. Leave the whining at the door and the new allocations for people like me who want the best performing machines available
#34
05-01-2013 | 11:28 PM
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Not anymore. Manual 430's now command a higher percentage of their original list price than F1's. I know because I have been looking to buy a manual 430 spider for two years. Also, I ordered a manual 360 spider in 2004 and when I decided to sell it a year later, it was sold in a week for all the money.
#35
05-05-2013 | 03:14 PM
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The problem is not with the cars being boring on the track at speed, or whether people will or won't have the talent to drive to the potential of the cars, in fact just the opposite. It is how fun the cars are to drive the rest of the time, when just driving on the street, when one can't drive "fast enough", or when driving within one's limits, rather than at the car's limits, on the track.
But this time, I'm ready to take a leap of faith. If the transmission choice makes the car boring, I'll sell it early-on while the demand is still high (number 2 on the list). I almost liked the PDK in the new Cayman S and if the new PDK in the GT3 is faster with more aggressive gear changes (more like a sequential), then I think it will be a winner, even on street.
The author of the RT article hates any type of automatic in a sports car even the one in the 458. So his mind was made up prior to driving the GT3.
#36
05-05-2013 | 04:38 PM
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Not anymore. Manual 430's now command a higher percentage of their original list price than F1's. I know because I have been looking to buy a manual 430 spider for two years. Also, I ordered a manual 360 spider in 2004 and when I decided to sell it a year later, it was sold in a week for all the money.
#37
05-07-2013 | 06:48 PM
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Agree
I have track time in a new 458 and I can assure you it's anything but boring. I find all the comments comical about this new GT3. The car is going to be amazing and the tranny is going to be great. I liked someone's comment on this subject saying, "if you think going to be too boring you're not driving fast enough" If you push a car like this to its limits you won't be sitting mid turn wishing you had a manual. And let's be real about how many people are even good enough to push a car like this to its limits It will be nice to not have people on the track missing gears, over revving engines, etc...
Too many people bashing with no experience driving the car yet.
If you push a car like this to its limits you won't be sitting mid turn wishing you had a manual. And let's be real about how many people are even good enough to push a car like this to its limits It will be nice to not have people on the track missing gears, over revving engines, etc...Too many people bashing with no experience driving the car yet.
Mr. B
#38
06-04-2013 | 10:11 PM
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I own both a manual Boxster Spyder and PDK C2S. A choice would be nice, but I also respect their desire to keep the cost of the GT-3 cars down by only offering PDK, as they explained.
As for the involvement of the manual, I've slowly been won over by the PDK
despite it being a 997.2 version. The new PDK is both a later better generation as well as custom designed for the GT-3. I say give PDK a chance and drive one. More driving tasks don't necessarily mean more involvement, but they generally do mean slower track times and possibly more accidents.
As for the involvement of the manual, I've slowly been won over by the PDK
despite it being a 997.2 version. The new PDK is both a later better generation as well as custom designed for the GT-3. I say give PDK a chance and drive one. More driving tasks don't necessarily mean more involvement, but they generally do mean slower track times and possibly more accidents.
#40
06-05-2013 | 07:23 AM
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Personally, I feel the 2 pedal perspective has left the traditional method behind... Because the manual shifters are too busy having fun, not trying to catch up to the faster car.
Even Sebastien Loeb is using paddle shifters in his Pikes Peak car. I think if it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. I really can't picture him getting out of his 1930lbs 875HP AWD car and saying,"Man, that was boring."
Last edited by jaspergtr; 06-05-2013 at 07:27 AM.
#41
06-05-2013 | 04:54 PM
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Do you mean to imply that it has waned at any point?
Personally, I feel the 2 pedal perspective has left the traditional method behind... Because the manual shifters are too busy having fun, not trying to catch up to the faster car.
Even Sebastien Loeb is using paddle shifters in his Pikes Peak car. I think if it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. I really can't picture him getting out of his 1930lbs 875HP AWD car and saying,"Man, that was boring."
Personally, I feel the 2 pedal perspective has left the traditional method behind... Because the manual shifters are too busy having fun, not trying to catch up to the faster car.
Even Sebastien Loeb is using paddle shifters in his Pikes Peak car. I think if it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. I really can't picture him getting out of his 1930lbs 875HP AWD car and saying,"Man, that was boring."
Last edited by SpeeddemonC2; 06-05-2013 at 05:10 PM.
#43
06-05-2013 | 05:51 PM
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R&T on the GT3....consider the source.
Road & Track was a car magazine w/integrity back in the days. If they said it, well it was probably accurate. Been a subscriber for over 30 years.
The latest itineration of Road & Track is a train wreck....1st issue w/ the new format came out last month. It was hard to read let alone believe.
A day or so ago the 2nd issue came out & they are making some progress in the readability dept. Hope it continues to improve.
In the letters to R&T section at the end there is an "editors note" that reads:
"It would be disingenuous to not mention the hundreds of letters we received regarding May's redesign of the magazine. As expected, reactions were all over the map; our readers care about this magazine deeply and expressed strong feelings on everything from the writing tone to the graphic design.
Sadly the sheer mass of correspondence makes it impossible to print everything or choose representative examples. But we're proud to report
your replies were well-reasoned and civil. You're a passionate. articulate bunch, and we're lucky to have you. Keep 'em coming."
************************************************** ***************
Good political rhetoric huh?
Print media is having a tough enough time surviving as it is. My hope is they get back to what worked for years and remain in print.
Road & Track was a car magazine w/integrity back in the days. If they said it, well it was probably accurate. Been a subscriber for over 30 years.
The latest itineration of Road & Track is a train wreck....1st issue w/ the new format came out last month. It was hard to read let alone believe.
A day or so ago the 2nd issue came out & they are making some progress in the readability dept. Hope it continues to improve.
In the letters to R&T section at the end there is an "editors note" that reads:
"It would be disingenuous to not mention the hundreds of letters we received regarding May's redesign of the magazine. As expected, reactions were all over the map; our readers care about this magazine deeply and expressed strong feelings on everything from the writing tone to the graphic design.
Sadly the sheer mass of correspondence makes it impossible to print everything or choose representative examples. But we're proud to report
your replies were well-reasoned and civil. You're a passionate. articulate bunch, and we're lucky to have you. Keep 'em coming."
************************************************** ***************
Good political rhetoric huh?
Print media is having a tough enough time surviving as it is. My hope is they get back to what worked for years and remain in print.
Last edited by HotHonda; 06-05-2013 at 06:12 PM.
#44
06-06-2013 | 07:42 AM
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Garbage.
Will not purchase again. It is easy to make these poor magazines irrelevant. I understand it's a job to some. But until they improve at it, I'm not paying for their services.
#45
06-07-2013 | 01:07 PM
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This.
Only dual clutches in all Ferraris now, right? One transmission = more R&D can get poured into it = better product across the entire brand. (I believe, as of now, there are two different versions of the dual clutch trans in their cars)
I can't see driving a McLaren MP4-12C or 458 Italia and think,"Man, this is boring."
Anyone?
Only dual clutches in all Ferraris now, right? One transmission = more R&D can get poured into it = better product across the entire brand. (I believe, as of now, there are two different versions of the dual clutch trans in their cars)
I can't see driving a McLaren MP4-12C or 458 Italia and think,"Man, this is boring."
Anyone?
is awesome and satisfying and engaging. I also own a McLaren MP4-12C and frankly DO find it boring and NOT engaging - That brings me to my SUBJECTIVE point - for the street, I am not looking to race (I have an RSR and other cars to satisfy my urges - and they have paddle converted sequential shifters to ensure I have the absolutely best and fastest where 0.1 a lap actually matters). I want something fun and engaging for the street - The 4.0 does that for me - and it has the complete package - Having said that, my Scuderia is also engaging and has paddles - and I would generally take the 4.0 out over my Scuderia as well.
Sooooo, would I prefer a manual on the GT3 - sure - Will I be really disappointed if the new RS does not offer it as an option - YES . Will I sell my 4.0 - No. Am I ordering a GT3 ...
FWIW, McLaren just got it wrong - sure it is fast fast fast but it is too sterile - steering and brakes (I have CCB) and steering and just plain sound and feel.
But that's just me. Your mileage may vary....