Why is Lexus NOT on recall list?
#31
02-13-2010, 02:32 PM
Registered User
First off Viper can have poor sales. It was never meant to sale for the Masses. I mean since the birth of the Viper in 1992 till now only about 25K Vipers were made. Period!!!!! You cant put Viper and a IS-F in the same sentence ( two completely different car for completely different a
what exactly is your point again?
#33
02-13-2010, 07:21 PM
First off Viper can have poor sales. It was never meant to sale for the Masses like the IS-F. The Viper brand is a Halo sports car. I mean since the birth of the Viper in 1992 till now only about 25K Vipers were made. Period!!!!! You can’t put Viper and a IS-F in the same sentence (two completely different cars for completely different a performance, completely different production of car). Viper is a raw race car made for the streets. And as far as mpg? Is that why you own a IS-F? If you have to talk about gas mileage and own a high hp car. Buy an ES300 or a Hummer to make that bad gas mileage statement (that’s why Hummer is going away). And MPG that is not why dodge (the parent company of the Viper brand) is in trouble. Actually Dodge's troubles have nothing to do with the Viper. And what you are talking is the past, Dodge is actually not in trouble with the Viper Brand leaving (hence the ACR-X a plus 100k race track only car). Viper has been breaking and passing world track time records next to half-million to million dollar exotic elite sports cars for a more than a decade now. They are actually keeping the low produced, hand made, 200mph off the showroom floor Viper around. Its just keeps setting the bar higher in the race track world. I own all my cars (no loans) and resale on the Viper fell like all other cars out there including Lamborghini, Ferrari, etc. I don’t see your point??? I can sell my used Viper right now and buy a IS-F brand new with the same money.
I am not trying to turn this topic into something different but you need to get the facts straight. I was not speaking directly about the ISF but the company as a whole. AND YES Toyota is the parent company of Lexus. A Lexus ES is an upscale Toyota Camry just open the hood and look at the engine.
FYI, sorry for any spelling errors.
I am not trying to turn this topic into something different but you need to get the facts straight. I was not speaking directly about the ISF but the company as a whole. AND YES Toyota is the parent company of Lexus. A Lexus ES is an upscale Toyota Camry just open the hood and look at the engine.
FYI, sorry for any spelling errors.
My point is that I would be worried.............
#34
02-13-2010, 08:26 PM
Registered User
awesome.........my point is I'm not! And I would highly recommend that if you have any further comments regarding Toyota, you should try the Other Japanese Supercar forum instead of Lexus!
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...supercars-121/
-cheers
Last edited by UMADBRO; 02-13-2010 at 08:30 PM.
#35
02-13-2010, 09:08 PM
awesome.........my point is I'm not! And I would highly recommend that if you have any further comments regarding Toyota, you should try the Other Japanese Supercar forum instead of Lexus!
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...supercars-121/
-cheers
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...supercars-121/
-cheers
http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...agic-Accident/
I am on the right forum thread here.......... Again, I would be worried!!!!
Thanks, Manny
Last edited by Immanuel; 02-13-2010 at 09:23 PM.
#36
02-13-2010, 09:26 PM
You are blessed with ignorance - only a few are given that special gift from above...be very thankful you are one of the few.
So when your Lexus gas pedal get stuck (due to floormat issue) and you hit a tree at 100+mph (with your family on board), I'll make sure to tell your love ones not to sue Toyota, because you said it here, not me..."Toyota is not Lexus and Lexus isn't Toyota."
So when your Lexus gas pedal get stuck (due to floormat issue) and you hit a tree at 100+mph (with your family on board), I'll make sure to tell your love ones not to sue Toyota, because you said it here, not me..."Toyota is not Lexus and Lexus isn't Toyota."
Thats Funny
!!!! Sad but funny! I am with you....I like Toyota/Lexus.... Great cars but this is a big BOOBOO!!! BUT the facts of a possible coverup is online around the world...... I am sorry if i have a loan on these cars and s**t starts hitting the fan as it did....... I am sorry but I WOULD BE WORRIED!!!!!
http://www.leftlanenews.com/adding-t...-problems.html
http://www.king5.com/news/business/T...-83600267.html
Last edited by Immanuel; 02-13-2010 at 09:55 PM.
#37
02-13-2010, 09:50 PM
Registered User
Thanks a bunch!!!!! But I have one quick question. Was the accident with the family of four, in a Lexus?
http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...agic-Accident/
I am on the right forum thread here.......... Again, I would be worried!!!!
Thanks, Manny
http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...agic-Accident/
I am on the right forum thread here.......... Again, I would be worried!!!!
Thanks, Manny
For someone who doesn't own a Lexus or seem to care one way or the other about Lexus or Toyota other than regurgitating antiquated news articles that having little if anything to do with the thread, you sure do enjoy spewing inane and incredulous nonsense in here.
It's no wonder you have zero reputation points, and you were obviously absent the day they taught remedial "multi quote" (see little quotation icon lower right) training in 6speed forum school!
-just sayin
#38
02-13-2010, 10:07 PM
Uh.. I think maybe you are the one blessed with ignorance. The Toyota recall is on gas pedals made by CTS on cars built in the U.S. The same Toyota models made in Japan with parts from Denso do not have this problem. Lexus models are all made in Japan with the exception of the RX (some made in Canada) and they do not use the same gas pedals.
As for the lexus recall, it is on the floormats. And yes, floormats can get stuck due to user or install error. That is true for any manufacturer. The car that was in the accident in San Diego had all weather rubber floor mats (from a different model) on top of the regular carpet mats. It think that would jam the gas pedal, don't you think? Do some real research before just regurgitating what you've heard from the biased media please.... It really is unfortunate what happened to that family nonetheless.
As for the lexus recall, it is on the floormats. And yes, floormats can get stuck due to user or install error. That is true for any manufacturer. The car that was in the accident in San Diego had all weather rubber floor mats (from a different model) on top of the regular carpet mats. It think that would jam the gas pedal, don't you think? Do some real research before just regurgitating what you've heard from the biased media please.... It really is unfortunate what happened to that family nonetheless.
#40
02-13-2010, 11:33 PM
#42
02-23-2010, 03:23 PM
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Orange County Socal
Posts: 1,621
Rep Power: 157 
02-13-2010 09:26 PMImmanuel
Maybe this will help............
Everybody read on the top left hand side, recent News Blog and click on it.
http://www.ctscorp.com/
I guess ignorance is bliss in your case. I took your advice and clicked on your link. Do you ever bother to read the links you post or the posts respond too? Your link states that CTS states that they have nothing to do with the Lexus or Prius recalls. Read my post again. Where do I say that CTS made the pedals for Lexus or Prius for that matter. I said that they made pedals for Toyota...
02-13-2010 09:26 PMImmanuel
and for denso, read the first line.
http://www.tuneyfish.com/blog/cts-ga...-how-it-works/
This is starting to get good!!!!!! Can people say Toyota/Lexus company coverup..
This is where it really gets good. I took your advice and clicked on this link you posted. Why don't you go and read the article before you post it. I hate to bore everyone here, but here is the article.
The rest of the forum can decide how much involvement CTS has had in the pedal recall. This article clearly states that Toyota started using CTS after Denso could no longer keep up with demand and that the resin used in the CTS pedal was different from the one Denso makes. My original statement still holds water. No problems were found on the recalled models that had Denso made accelerator pedals.
<LI class=page_item>Home<LI class="page_item page-item-1241">Subscribe <LI class="page_item page-item-606">Manuals <LI class="page_item page-item-516">iPhone <LI class="page_item page-item-183">Video <LI class="page_item page-item-2">About CTS Gas Pedal ~ Pedal Operation And Sensor Input Feedback
CTS GAS PEDAL | GAS PEDAL NON-CONTACT
The CTS and Denso pedal currently under the Toyota Recall is what Toyota owners are trying to figure out whether it’s the cause of a sticking gas pedal issue in Toyota’s recall of over 2 million vehicles in the US.
The CTS pedal is one of many potential issues that have caused sudden and unintentional acceleration.
The CTS pedal has been declared the source of the unexpected acceleration problems according to Toyota, but since the gas pedal was built to spec by CTS they have argued that the issues with the gas pedal assembly are not their problem.
Toyota and CTS Inc. have been working together for years and it’s been said that the Denso pedals, which are the pedals used in most of the Toyota vehicles do not demonstrate the same problems that the CTS gas pedals have produced.
Toyota started using the CTS gas pedal when Toyota sales increased and they had to look for alternative suppliers to the usual Denso gas pedal that Toyota has used primarily. The Denso currently has not been identified as a problem in this recall but the difference between the CTS and the Denso may not be inherent in their physical properties in terms of strength or durability and more in their chemical properties of the resin material that’s used in these pedals.
The variance between the Denso and CTS exists in the type of resin material that’s used. The resin is a type of plastic material that allows the gas pedal to be light weight and strong, but there are other issues surrounding these differences that could be contributing to the CTS pedal issues.
Toyota has used Denso for most of their vehicles, until Denso couldn’t meet the production demand. Toyota decided to find ways to meet the demands of their production, which led to a portion of the gas pedals to be manufactured by CTS.
The CTS and Denso gas pedals are non-contact pedal assemblies which utilize electronics to perform the same function that the older mechanical cable throttle assemblies would. This new system is called “Drive By Wire” and it’s controlled by magnetic sensors and hall effect IC’s.
The pedal assemblies indicate throttle position due to the throttle or accelerator sensor that sends a signal to the computer to indicate the degree in which the pedal is depressed.
The CTS and Denso pedal assemblies are comprised of two main pieces, the pedal arm and the pedal base. The pedal arm pivots in the base against a return spring that is supposed to return the pedal to a 0 degrees or 0 % throttle. At this point the engine is held at idle via an IAC (idle air controller) that is basically a controlled vacuum leak. The current fix for the CTS gas pedals is to install a shim behind the spring to give the CTS pedal assembly a stronger return to 0% position when the foot is lifted off the CTS gas pedal.
When a gas pedal or accelerator is depressed in the traditional mechanical configuration, a throttle cable that passes through the firewall and up to the throttle body will pull the throttle blades to an open position when the pedal is fully depressed the throttle blades are fully open and the amount of air entering the engine is mixed with the right amount of fuel to produce maximum power. This is also known as WOT (wide open throttle).
When a vehicle is at WOT the characteristics of the computer and it’s reliance on it’s sensor inputs are usually out of the loop. When the vehicle is at part throttle the computer is performing many different calculations, it’s “learning” the right calibration so that the vehicle idles smooth, and when the throttle increases (referred to as tip-in throttle) the car doesn’t stumble from too much fuel.
There are many variables that are used in calculating the vehicle’s demand for fuel, one of which is the vehicle speed sensor which measures the current speed the vehicle is traveling at. In highway driving, if a vehicle is traveling at 55 MPH and needs to pass or engage a burst of speed theres what is called the kickdown function where on an automatic transmission will drop down to give the vehicle a higher RPM and more power to perform the lane change or other activity that required the sudden change in speed.
The CTS pedal design when compared to the Denso pedal design may reveal subtleties that would question the integrity of the pedal housing, or other internal components that may seem to be prone to wear or other degradation. The matter in which the CTS or Denso pedal mechanically rotates or fails to rotate due to friction should not result in the unexpected acceleration issues. This is because fail-safe measures are part of the vehicles computer system that would not permit such operation, it would be illogical to program the computer such that a throttle position of anything under 50% would produce WOT characteristics.
The CTS pedal should be tested with an Oscilloscope to fully determine whether or not there are variations in the output voltage, which in a situation of a stuck pedal would demonstrate examples that a computer would or should be throwing an error code.
In the next post we’ll describe the kickdown function and wide open throttle sensor in drive by wire systems, and the feedback loop that works with a magnetic and hall effect sensor.
Maybe this will help............
Everybody read on the top left hand side, recent News Blog and click on it.
http://www.ctscorp.com/
I guess ignorance is bliss in your case. I took your advice and clicked on your link. Do you ever bother to read the links you post or the posts respond too? Your link states that CTS states that they have nothing to do with the Lexus or Prius recalls. Read my post again. Where do I say that CTS made the pedals for Lexus or Prius for that matter. I said that they made pedals for Toyota...
02-13-2010 09:26 PMImmanuel
and for denso, read the first line.
http://www.tuneyfish.com/blog/cts-ga...-how-it-works/
This is starting to get good!!!!!! Can people say Toyota/Lexus company coverup..
This is where it really gets good. I took your advice and clicked on this link you posted. Why don't you go and read the article before you post it. I hate to bore everyone here, but here is the article.
The rest of the forum can decide how much involvement CTS has had in the pedal recall. This article clearly states that Toyota started using CTS after Denso could no longer keep up with demand and that the resin used in the CTS pedal was different from the one Denso makes. My original statement still holds water. No problems were found on the recalled models that had Denso made accelerator pedals.
<LI class=page_item>Home<LI class="page_item page-item-1241">Subscribe <LI class="page_item page-item-606">Manuals <LI class="page_item page-item-516">iPhone <LI class="page_item page-item-183">Video <LI class="page_item page-item-2">About CTS Gas Pedal ~ Pedal Operation And Sensor Input Feedback
CTS GAS PEDAL | GAS PEDAL NON-CONTACTThe CTS and Denso pedal currently under the Toyota Recall is what Toyota owners are trying to figure out whether it’s the cause of a sticking gas pedal issue in Toyota’s recall of over 2 million vehicles in the US.
The CTS pedal is one of many potential issues that have caused sudden and unintentional acceleration.
The CTS pedal has been declared the source of the unexpected acceleration problems according to Toyota, but since the gas pedal was built to spec by CTS they have argued that the issues with the gas pedal assembly are not their problem.
Toyota and CTS Inc. have been working together for years and it’s been said that the Denso pedals, which are the pedals used in most of the Toyota vehicles do not demonstrate the same problems that the CTS gas pedals have produced.
Toyota started using the CTS gas pedal when Toyota sales increased and they had to look for alternative suppliers to the usual Denso gas pedal that Toyota has used primarily. The Denso currently has not been identified as a problem in this recall but the difference between the CTS and the Denso may not be inherent in their physical properties in terms of strength or durability and more in their chemical properties of the resin material that’s used in these pedals.
The variance between the Denso and CTS exists in the type of resin material that’s used. The resin is a type of plastic material that allows the gas pedal to be light weight and strong, but there are other issues surrounding these differences that could be contributing to the CTS pedal issues.
Toyota has used Denso for most of their vehicles, until Denso couldn’t meet the production demand. Toyota decided to find ways to meet the demands of their production, which led to a portion of the gas pedals to be manufactured by CTS.
The CTS and Denso gas pedals are non-contact pedal assemblies which utilize electronics to perform the same function that the older mechanical cable throttle assemblies would. This new system is called “Drive By Wire” and it’s controlled by magnetic sensors and hall effect IC’s.
The pedal assemblies indicate throttle position due to the throttle or accelerator sensor that sends a signal to the computer to indicate the degree in which the pedal is depressed.
The CTS and Denso pedal assemblies are comprised of two main pieces, the pedal arm and the pedal base. The pedal arm pivots in the base against a return spring that is supposed to return the pedal to a 0 degrees or 0 % throttle. At this point the engine is held at idle via an IAC (idle air controller) that is basically a controlled vacuum leak. The current fix for the CTS gas pedals is to install a shim behind the spring to give the CTS pedal assembly a stronger return to 0% position when the foot is lifted off the CTS gas pedal.
When a gas pedal or accelerator is depressed in the traditional mechanical configuration, a throttle cable that passes through the firewall and up to the throttle body will pull the throttle blades to an open position when the pedal is fully depressed the throttle blades are fully open and the amount of air entering the engine is mixed with the right amount of fuel to produce maximum power. This is also known as WOT (wide open throttle).
When a vehicle is at WOT the characteristics of the computer and it’s reliance on it’s sensor inputs are usually out of the loop. When the vehicle is at part throttle the computer is performing many different calculations, it’s “learning” the right calibration so that the vehicle idles smooth, and when the throttle increases (referred to as tip-in throttle) the car doesn’t stumble from too much fuel.
There are many variables that are used in calculating the vehicle’s demand for fuel, one of which is the vehicle speed sensor which measures the current speed the vehicle is traveling at. In highway driving, if a vehicle is traveling at 55 MPH and needs to pass or engage a burst of speed theres what is called the kickdown function where on an automatic transmission will drop down to give the vehicle a higher RPM and more power to perform the lane change or other activity that required the sudden change in speed.
The CTS pedal design when compared to the Denso pedal design may reveal subtleties that would question the integrity of the pedal housing, or other internal components that may seem to be prone to wear or other degradation. The matter in which the CTS or Denso pedal mechanically rotates or fails to rotate due to friction should not result in the unexpected acceleration issues. This is because fail-safe measures are part of the vehicles computer system that would not permit such operation, it would be illogical to program the computer such that a throttle position of anything under 50% would produce WOT characteristics.
The CTS pedal should be tested with an Oscilloscope to fully determine whether or not there are variations in the output voltage, which in a situation of a stuck pedal would demonstrate examples that a computer would or should be throwing an error code.
In the next post we’ll describe the kickdown function and wide open throttle sensor in drive by wire systems, and the feedback loop that works with a magnetic and hall effect sensor.
Last edited by GotBoost?; 02-23-2010 at 03:25 PM.
