Not gonna respond to your other bait

With your quoted words above you basically are making my point with it. I would never buy a Reventon for the same reasons as an LF-A. Why would I buy a Reventon with a Bugatti Veyron, CCX, Zonda F, Mercie 670 SV etc out there? Im not a collector so my opinion is not from a collectors perspective as is obvious by now. You want your Reventon and LF-A be my guest. Neither would be my choice. BTW I dont really care for the Reventons shape that much either even though it also is a collectors piece.

As regards peoples opinion on a car changing upon a test drive you are absolutely correct. But most buyers select the kinds of cars they want before hand so they go and test drive those prospects. I would not have the LF-A on my prospect list if I had 400k to spend so "I" wouldnt be the candidate Lexus is looking for as is obvious. Especially with that weird lease deal they offering them for.

Again Im defending "my" opinion lol. My opinion for the thousanth time is that its not the car I would chose though it is quite a capable, ridiculously overengineered masterpiece from Lexus but for someone else. Oh and I own a Lexus RX330 and have had a 350z, Infiniti Q45, Ford Probe GT[] to name a few so Im hardly a biased car dude. Hardly big time cars but you get the gist that Im very openminded on my purchases. If you have ever driven a bpu or faster Supra then you will understand the disappointment guys like me and Germeezy have with the LF-A's acceleration.

 

I would like to personally thank Porsche for the 911, Chevrolet for the Corvette and Nissan for the GTR. These cars all at their respective price levels have all pushed sports/ exotic cars in general to another level as far as performance. Compare a 360 Modena to the 458 Italia and a first gen Gallardo vs the LP 560-4 and its obvious that in a few short years the cars have attained another level of performance.

When you have a ten year development period, how can you compete with companies like Porsche who is constantly pouring millions into R & D to keep their cars performing on a level that is very comparable to entry level exotics if not a little bit better?

Who would have thought that we would have cars capable of the Mclaren F1's 0-60 or 10 second 1/4 mile times or 125 plus mph trap speeds in the sub exotic class? So I can conceed that maybe Toyota did not decide to stop development and the class just moved so fast that it was unable to keep up without spending a lot more money. I have to remember and respect that Toyota is a business, and not an enthusiast/ forum marketing company!

Porsche is not even immune to the competition bringing out surprises. It happened in the Carrera GT's development where it got an engine displacement increase and rework to bring its power and performance more in line with the Enzo's.

 

You all should check out the Porsche 918. It's a 500 HP hybrid with a top speed of about 200 mph and gets about 80 mpg and will cost about 450K.

 

Why wold anyone buy anything? Because they can, variety is the spice of life! You guys have to think "outside" the box so to speak and realize that not everyone has the same taste in cars! Like I have said before ad nauseum, with your reasoning and incredulous logic and if it were up to you, we would all be driving Z06's or ZR1's because for the money nothing comes close. But what kind of world would that be..............bland and insipid IMO.

After all this back and forth dialogue, let's just establish two certainties:

1. We all agree that there are better performing cars that are less expensive than the LFA.

2. The type of people who can afford an LFA don't care about #1 and make purchases because they can, and for exclusivity. I highly doubt LFA owners are tracking their cars or street racing on friday nights! They are cruising Sunset or Miami Beach and keeping it in their climate controlled garage and using it as a weekend warrior! Performance is not the primary impetus behind said purchase!


Not trolling, no fanboyisms, no flaming just my .02



Don't worry, there will be enough flames to go around when that car hits the showrooms!

 

^ And then again in 2 years... When there is an option to return it.

 

One thing that was brought up now confuses the reasons for buying the car. For instance I can understand the Reventon because those cars will never, ever be seen and in 10 years I bet the highest mileage one will have 900 miles!

But the LFA, you can't buy it as a speculator or a car collector or as an expensive sculpture you never plan to drive except for rare ocassions. You have to drive it because you are leasing it and as such end up losing out if you don't drive it. Also not knowing the terms of the lease its hard to say but it seems like they did it that way to avoid the speculators.

 

And I love variety, and love cars of all makes and models....so its not some inherent hate for X brand of car or X country of origin. It is amazing that you can chose what works the best for you in each individual category!

 

You are borderline though!

... Same answer



Kidding of course on both counts.

 

Nothing I'm doing here prevents anyone from posting. They're free to do so. So it's not up to me to "let" people add something. They can do so whether you prompt them to or not.
Actually, I'm answering your questions head on. Which you claim no one is willing to do. If you don't like the answers, just ignore them (as you claim to have been doing anyway, sort of like snakebitten not addressing my posts ).

You did question whether I have driven any high-performance cars as if it's relevant to the discussion and implied that I'm not qualified to comment in this thread. What is relevant is the magnitude of performance/$ in the minds of typical supercar buyers, as well as those in the price range of the Z06. The fact that only a tiny fraction buy a car like the Z06 (and can let the Viper pretty much rot) undermines your whole emphasis on performance/$. As does GM's open admission that they are looking beyond performance/$ for the next Corvette.

 

I don't have to have driven a Supra to understand that as far back as half a decade ago, Toyota announced they would not be making anything like a Supra, which they have not with the LFA. Your disappointment lies in your expectations, but Toyota never promised a Supra.

Nothing in my post is bait. It may seem like bait to people who are uneasy about addressing it directly. The simple fact is, Ferrari's seemingly low MSRP is not a reflection of how "easy" it is to get a car at MSRP. And to avoid my question seems like tacit acceptance that your MSRP position can't be defended: the GTO isn't as easy to acquire as you think, and could very well cost much, much more than the LFA.

You may be openminded about your purchases, but how about being open-minded to other people's purchases? Ie, there can be perfectly legit reasons to buy a car even if it costs more than a 599 at Z06 levels of objective performance.

Unless you choose an LFA, right? Because to do so, you would have to be crazy. You said so yourself: There is no sane reason to choose an LFA when alternatives exist.

 

We can go on and on Guibo but it will get nowhere. I know where these "opinion" arguments go so I chose to ignore the part or whole of your replies if I see they are gonna lead nowhere. We are not arguing facts. Most of it is personal feelings.

The funny thing is Ive seen things from the side you lean to before I even posted in this thread and have acknowledged it many times but my personal feeling continue to be that its not my first choice in that price point because the final product is less than even Toyota initially hinted at which is another reason why my expectations were so high. Its a hell of a car but in that price point there are other cars that stir my soul better visually and performance-wise. Sue me.

 

Have any of you guys worked on any of the cars you are comparing to the LF-A?....actually had the interior apart or removed/replaced any major components on a lift?

I had a reventon on the lift next to a ford GT and the reventon looked like a kit car while the GT looked like a production car designed to be driven 100k miles or more and serviced easily.

I'm sure the LF-A looks like any other lexus from below while it's and I'll bet it's designed to last 20 years of daily driving.

I have yet to see a lexus car that isn't easily capable of 200k miles.....as long as the fluids are changed at proper intervals.

I just did a valve adjustment on a 1990 LS400 with 270k miles and only 2 out of 24 valves needed any shims thickness changes.

 

I own a Lexus that literally is packed with enough technology to be compared to the Space shuttle. I have no idea how they can put an 8 year / 100k warranty on this hybrid powertrain and still maintain reliability with its complexity. How many people you know buy a Supercar to put 200k miles on it?

This thread is funny to me because people are trying to distract us from our opinion like we will just forget it. First finding out and attacking the kind of car I drive, despite the fact that I own a Lexus as well ( go figure). And then making it a Z06 vs LFA argument when its not, and after that making it a value argument when I already said plainly the Lexus is worth $400k because its value is set by those willing to pay the price.

One thing you can't escape is every car has expectations either set by its manufacturer or its class based on its class and/ or price point. Would I buy a hybrid if upon doing my research I found out it was much slower, got much worse gas mileage, and had much higher emissions? My expectations for it were set by its place in the market and its intended mission vs other luxury SUV's.

 

snakebitten:
Where did I say the LFA is a great deal? Please, in your very next post, provide a link to where I said it's a great deal.
550 hp and 3200 lbs...isn't the Scuderia providing similar stats? Yet in a straight line, we don't expect Enzo levels of performance from it. Again, you are disappointed only because you had unrealistic expectations when Lexus themselves said they would not be providing a car like a Supra. You have no one to blame but yourself, and so far only one person here has been man enough to admit that.
There is nothing baiting about the stated MSRP issue. Like I said, what's the relevance of the stated MSRP if you can't even get a car at the stated MSRP? This is not a tangent. It is directly addressing a statement that you made about the prices between these two cars.

 

By the same token, how many people do you know buy a supercar only for its 1/4 mile acceleration with apparently no interest in all the other aspects that make up a car-owning experience?
Another thing we can't escape is your inability to even define the LFA's class.