thats insane!

 

You're not going to get 580 HP without some serious engine mods. Software, headers, and an exhaust aren't going to get you there.

However, the C63 is going to be an awesome car.

 

Why not? People have hit 580 in s85 v10 from the M5/M6 naturally aspirated and that is a motor with less displacement. People ALREADY have hit 550 hp with the 63's. According to evosport, they show dynos gaining 24 whp from software alone on the Ml63, which has higher drivetrain losses being AWD. Kleemann headers provide 40 hp claimed although I have seen no dynos yet. Kleemann is known to underrate their horsepower claims as has been seen on kleemann parts for the 55 motors. Give the tuners some time, 550-580 is realistic and just the beginning for the 63 motors.

 

Can't wait!

 

Whoaaaa!

 

Wow, that would be a great daily driver.

 

That is sweet . . .

 

The only major difference between the two is software, just like the SLR and 722.

 

True. Getting the C63 up to E63 power levels will be easy.

 

Curio,

I've owned a Renntech car and a Kleemann car. They do not "underrate" their HP claims they actually overrate their claims, especially Kleemann. I've yet to see a dyno that proves over 550 HP on a 63 engine. Until I do I'm very skeptical. Simple bolt ons are not going to increase HP by 100 (from 460 to 560) unless the bolt on is some sort of FI which will require some significant changes.

You mention 580 HP M5's which is possible. This is a 70 HP gain over stock and I've still never seen these gains confirmed on a dyno or at a drag strip. Plus, there's also a big difference between a 70 HP gain and a 100+ HP gain.

I modify everything and have the "bug" big time. I've learned that most tuners have one thing in common, exagerrated HP claims.

Regardless, the C63 is going to be one awesome machine!

 

I dont see why 550 wouldnt be possible. If the S63 is rated for 518hp, then headers and an ECU flash should be able to do at least close to 550. As I said before, the difference between an S63 and C63 is purely software.

 

You need to take a look at some dynos. I understand you have owned mercedes, as have I, but the dynos I have seen show kleemann mods putting up more than claimed on 55's. I am not going to go search for these dynos on mbworld and then post them unles you really truly need to see them.

Yes these gains are possible, there are several m5's and m6's that dyno 460 rwhp, 480 rwhp, and one that has made 500 rwhp, on motor.

I see you that what you are saying is the jump for the C63 is large. Yes, it would be large if that motor actually was putting out much less power than the other 63's. The 63's already have reached the 550 level, the C63 will as well, mercedes has underrated it in the C class as the trap speed shows, there are no internal differences. And yes, it is awesome.

 

I've been a member of mbworld since 2002 and I'm very aware of the Kleemann dynos. You will not find a single dyno post, other than Kleemann's dyno, that comes close to their claimed HP. Go ahead and try. As a matter of fact they no longer even claim what they used to.

One of my Kleemann cars was in Road and Track years ago, you can search for it under "Battle of the Bricks." It was a fun car (actually a truck) but didn't make anywhere close to claimed HP. I live in Colorado and know the Kleemann guys really well, we've actually become good friends. After a few beers they'll even admit that the claims out of Kleemann in Dutchland are exagerrated.

I don't want to get in a tuner argument with you but you're just plain wrong.

Please show me a 63 engine making 550 - 580 HP. I've seen claims but so far no proof. I may be wrong but I can't find anything but unproven claims. The 63 engine is very high strung and no where near as tunable as the 55 kompressor engine. There are huge obstacles, beyond high compression, in designing a supercharger kit.

Again, don't get me wrong, as I'm excited about the C63 and truly hope that someone will see 580 HP with bolt ons. I'm jut not convinced that it's possible without forced induction.

 

It's not purely software. There are differences in the exhaust, etc. The differences are minor and can easily be overcome.

Headers and an ECU change are available now. Is the combo making 550 HP as claimed? I don't know as I can't find 1/4 mile times or dynos that prove this. I may be wrong.

 

You are wrong in this instance. Since you are an mbworld member you should be able to poke around their forum for the answers. Kleemann actual vs. dyno numbers aside, their mods propel the fastest cars with their k4 55's reaching the mid to low 11's. I don't see how they are not making their claimed power when the dyno shows it and as does the 1/4 mile trap speed. What type of kleemann modded car did you have? Are the different numbers we are seeing naturally aspirated kleemann mods vs. their forced induction mods?

Evosport has products for the 63's out. Their dyno for the ML63 with powerchip software shows a 24 wheel hp gain, through the stock exhaust and intake. 24 @ the wheels is already over half way there to 550 without any breathing mods, exhaust or intake.

This motor is high strung, but not as much as the BMW v10 and if the aftermarket can get 80 hp on a 100 hp per liter motor naturally aspirated they will be able to do it for the 6.3 liter v8. I remember when the e46 m3 first came out and I read these same type of posts about the S54 6 cylinder not being able to gain any more power. Look at the power the aftermarket is getting out of that higher compression, higher revving, smaller motor in comparison to the 63.

550 hp has ALREADY been reached! 580 will come and go. The car has yet to even hit the streets. I want to post a dyno but mbworld is having a database error right now (just my luck). Renntech's site on the other hand is working and their stage 2 package for the 63 shows a 50 hp gain @ the crank consisting of software, mufflers, and headers. Your basic bolt ons, I see ABSOLUTELY no reason to believe this motor can't reach 550 hp and beyond.

Even motors as stressed as the one in the 996 GT3 have been able to pick up 25 @ the wheels with software and exhaust tuning as some member have shown on 6speed.

I guess we will agree to disagree, but I think we can agree that the C63 leaves more power on the table for the tuners than the e63, s63, or cl63.