i say give him at least a little time to post the dynos before calling BS. but even without dynos, i find it believable on this particular platform for a 100hp gain. the c63 has "451hp", but it's just a detuned version of the 507hp platform from the e63 and clk63. the 63's have been very responsive to headers + ecu mods, just look at the 600hp evosport clk63 black series. a 100hp gain on the c63 makes it about 550hp, and given its 507hp potential in stock form from the same platform, i think it's very possible. the 4v / cylinder motors seem to be very responsive, even to ecu tuning, as compared to the 3v / cylinder motors. headers have shown impressive gains on the e63 and clk63 series, i don't see why it wouldn't on the c63 since it's the same engine just detuned with electronics. if the clk63 can do 598hp on headers, ecu, plus exhaust and pullies, i don't see why a c63 can't do 550hp with headers and ecu. regardless, 550 hp in a C-class is insane! that's like the kind of power you got from a C55 AMG kleemann supercharged! mkb quotes 567hp on their c63 (and other 63 models) with ecu + full exhaust (i assume headers, mufflers, and resonators). according to MKB, it seems like the difference b/t a c63 and e63/clk63 is nullified once they both get ecu tuning. and i don't think mkb or kleemann have a history to exaggerate or be overly generous numbers.

 

+1 real talk. I think the C63 has a lot of potential because that motor is bananas in the S/CL/CLK/E classes. The C63 motor is identical except for software to not compete with the rest of the line up.

 

I seem to recall hearing or reading somewhere (possibly on Top Gear?) that there is a hp/torque issue with MB's new 7-speed automatic, meaning if you're adding 100hp to the current mix you may run into problems with the transmission.

Is there any validity to this? I'm curious as to what the HP/TQ limits are for the transmission.

Thanks,
Brad

 

Sounds to good to be true, but WOW I sure hope so. My 09' will be here in September.

 

FWIW, I'm involved with evosport upgrades on the black and it has become very clear during our project the Siemans ecu hasn't been cracked yet. The only ecu tune available is minor stuff like timing, fuel and delimiting top speed and throttle response. The Kleeman headers are shorty types and I'm sure they will help but I doubt that shorty's and a tune will get you 100 hp without some other mods. It took Evosport a lot more in mods to get to a 100Hp on a CLK 63 black.
Jimmy

 

I'm still waiting on our web guy to get them up on our site so I can post it on here. In a previous post on this thread I did say I could email them to anyone who wants it. So shoot me an email and I will send it right away. There has just been an overload of new product that's come out lately and we are just running a bit behind on getting out site updated with everything that's out.

 

Like I have been saying all along, you can't compare the C63 AMG to the CLK63. Kleemann is only offering an additional 40 HP give or take with ECU tuning for the CLK63 Black Edition. The C63 was detuned before being brought to the states so this is why there was more room for improvement for the C63 than most other 63 models.

I have a Dyno graph from Kleemann's dyno run however it is in newton meters because it was done in Denamark but Cory from Kleemann has given me the formula for converting to horsepower.

 

Brad,

This is a very good question, I don't have an answer for you at this time because your the first time I have heard about this. I will send Cory @ Kleemann an email who is their leader in the tech department and as soon as I hear back from him I will post up his response and send you a PM.

 

That same engine is rated at 518 bhp in the S63 as well, so the increase from 518 bhp to ~550 bhp seems realistic, especially if it is claimed by a company that has a good reputation that it would like to uphold.

 

Looking at the various horsepower and torque ratings for this engine in 3 different platforms:

CLK63: 475 bhp, 465 lbs-ft
E63: 507 bhp, 465 lbs-ft
S63: 518 bhp, 465 lbs-ft

It would seem that the current long-term durability transmission torque limit for the 7-speed automatic transmission is 465 lbs-ft of torque. Note that none of the twin-turbo 12-cylinder cars (e.g. S600 or S65) use the new 7-speed transmission. They would probably chew it up, but considering those cars start with 612 lbs-ft of torque and then move up to 738 lbs-ft of torque (and probably beyond that when modified), that doesn't seem surprising. I assume that Mercedes-Benz is running long-term durability testing on this new 7-speed transmission with various durability/performance upgrades to ensure that they will at least last through the entire warranty period for these cars once they are used in a 12-cylinder application.

All of the above is pure conjecture based on observations of engines having varying horsepower ratings with the same torque output. Then again, those numbers themselves could be BS. Never mind. What the hell do I know?

 

there was a video on youtube that showed an 89rwhp increase i think. i think the 100hp gain over stock c63 configuration is plausible, and will probably be substantiated very soon. i don't think that kleemann exaggerates numbers.

 

The W7A700 (7G-Tronic) is rated to 560 lb/ft. of CONTINUOUS torque input. Momentary shock loads are 30% higher than that. This information comes straight from the Mercedes-Benz training booklet that factory trained technicians receive in the MBUSA school in New Jersey.

 

Thats good to hear. Looks like a good place to start for upgrades. So Kleemann says the headers are all that is needed for the exhaust upgrade and a "cat back" is just for sound not power right?

If I want a dyno sheet on the upgrades do I need to PM you to get one or are you going to post them on the forum?

-Troy

 

i think i might have to do this....

 

Great information! Like I said, I was just guessing since there seemed to be an apparent upper torque limit to the different 6.3's that are out there. It looks like the transmission has plenty of margin for normally aspirated applications, but would be marginal for any of the turbo'd 12-cylinder applications. I figure it is just a matter of time until they raise that limit.