Base GT-R lobs 7:38 Nordschleife Supertest Lap Time
#316
06-23-2009, 07:44 AM
How about it, monaro? Can you at least admit the Turbo is slower than the GT-R? You say that the 5 seconds separating the GT-R and the GT2 in the supertests isn't close. Then the 16 seconds separating the GT-R and the Turbo (with ceramics and Cups) must be an eternity. Your entire agenda has been based on faulty theories, all of which have been debunked. Deep down, I bet you still think a CTS-V is capable of a 7:38 in HvS's hands, right?
Monaro can never reconcile the Hypocrisy of his claims. For it would take 3 words to come out of his mouth which his vocal cords cannot resonate.
"I was wrong"
If Monaro ever said this, his head might explode.
#317
06-23-2009, 10:54 AM
It doesn't sound outrageous. I think the margin is lower than that, but it's not really worth discussing this miniscule difference. We'll have to agree to diasagree.
A 7:43 sounds about right, for HvS driving a GT-R on Bridgestones at something less than 100% in unknown conditions and only ~8 laps. That's not to say that another driver, living with the car for months/years, testing day in and day out to the point he can drive the car like he's signing his own name, couldn't be faster with perfect conditions and driving 100% for sure. And we already have the lap and telemetry of Nissan doing the 7:38 with Bridgestones with some wet sections of track.
We also know 7:33 is not the best the GT2 can do. Rohrl ran a 7:29 while passing multiple cars during that lap.
A 7:43 sounds about right, for HvS driving a GT-R on Bridgestones at something less than 100% in unknown conditions and only ~8 laps. That's not to say that another driver, living with the car for months/years, testing day in and day out to the point he can drive the car like he's signing his own name, couldn't be faster with perfect conditions and driving 100% for sure. And we already have the lap and telemetry of Nissan doing the 7:38 with Bridgestones with some wet sections of track.
We also know 7:33 is not the best the GT2 can do. Rohrl ran a 7:29 while passing multiple cars during that lap.
#318
06-23-2009, 11:32 AM
What makes you think I didn't?
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...5-post314.html
Already addressed that subject.
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...8-post313.html
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...5-post314.html
Already addressed that subject.
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...8-post313.html
#319
06-23-2009, 12:31 PM
Agreed. Nissan made a press statement to counter Porsche's allegations about the type of tires used. Nissan were very specific stating that Dunlops were used for the 7:38 and 7:29 runs. I find it hard to believe they would get this very critical point wrong. The other sources referenced here are second hand.
Secondly, when Nissan did the 7:38, they were obviously gunning for the 7:35 or 7:30 mark, or they wouldn't have come back the next year to try to beat it. If they're going for the fastest time, they're going to use the tire with the most aggressive compound, and that is the Dunlops. Suzuki is on record saying the Dunlops are the better circuit tire. It doesn't make much sense for them to have used Bridgestones but who knows.
Secondly, when Nissan did the 7:38, they were obviously gunning for the 7:35 or 7:30 mark, or they wouldn't have come back the next year to try to beat it. If they're going for the fastest time, they're going to use the tire with the most aggressive compound, and that is the Dunlops. Suzuki is on record saying the Dunlops are the better circuit tire. It doesn't make much sense for them to have used Bridgestones but who knows.
#320
06-23-2009, 12:50 PM
That's right, just like a particular note at the right frequency can make a wine glass break - "I was wrong" is Monaro's 'Harmonic frequency' 
Seriously Monaro, let's start from basics here before jumping into the 'deep end'
Can you just admit that, the GTR is faster than a 911 turbo around the 'ring'?
Come on, you can do it!
Seriously Monaro, let's start from basics here before jumping into the 'deep end'
Can you just admit that, the GTR is faster than a 911 turbo around the 'ring'?
Come on, you can do it!
Ummmm i think 911tt will be too much for him to start with.......based on his delusions he actually may need to begin from something far more basic.
Here Monaro let's try saying this together and if it hurts don't push the issue.....ok buddy!!!!
Say..."GT-R is better than a unicycle" you know the thing you ride around town wearing short shorts and a halter top
yelling GT-R is evil, GT-R is evil, GT-R is evil.
Last edited by airtrackk; 06-23-2009 at 01:05 PM.
#321
06-23-2009, 01:24 PM
Agreed. Nissan made a press statement to counter Porsche's allegations about the type of tires used. Nissan were very specific stating that Dunlops were used for the 7:38 and 7:29 runs. I find it hard to believe they would get this very critical point wrong. The other sources referenced here are second hand.
Secondly, when Nissan did the 7:38, they were obviously gunning for the 7:35 or 7:30 mark, or they wouldn't have come back the next year to try to beat it. If they're going for the fastest time, they're going to use the tire with the most aggressive compound, and that is the Dunlops. Suzuki is on record saying the Dunlops are the better circuit tire. It doesn't make much sense for them to have used Bridgestones but who knows.
Secondly, when Nissan did the 7:38, they were obviously gunning for the 7:35 or 7:30 mark, or they wouldn't have come back the next year to try to beat it. If they're going for the fastest time, they're going to use the tire with the most aggressive compound, and that is the Dunlops. Suzuki is on record saying the Dunlops are the better circuit tire. It doesn't make much sense for them to have used Bridgestones but who knows.
#322
06-23-2009, 03:07 PM
How about it, monaro? Can you at least admit the Turbo is slower than the GT-R? You say that the 5 seconds separating the GT-R and the GT2 in the supertests isn't close. Then the 16 seconds separating the GT-R and the Turbo (with ceramics and Cups) must be an eternity. Your entire agenda has been based on faulty theories, all of which have been debunked. Deep down, I bet you still think a CTS-V is capable of a 7:38 in HvS's hands, right?
You people havent been reading my posts, ive always maintained that the ZO6, GT3, Turbo and GTR are in the same league i.e. high 7:30 and 7:40 potential cars. I HAVE BEEN SAYING THAT THE 7:26 TIME ADVERTISED BY NISSAN (STOCK) IS A LIE. CAN YOU AT LEAST ADMIT THAT THE GTR CANT RUN WITH ENZO'S AND ZONDA'S ON A LONG TRACK? AND THAT NISSAN LIED WITH THEIR 7:26 TIME?
My guess is NO...........
#323
06-23-2009, 03:51 PM
What makes you think I didn't?
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...5-post314.html
Already addressed that subject.
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...8-post313.html
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...5-post314.html
Already addressed that subject.
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...8-post313.html
When someone from Nissan says it, then I'll think about believing it. Maybe they've told so many lies they don't know which way is up.
By the way, Nissan mentions both sets of tires in that statement. And official one, as opposed to the one you're pushing. It's not like it's a typo. They clearly say "we make two sets of standard tires", "and for BOTH tests the same (dunlop) tires were used".
But a forum poster and a mag editor is enough to rebuff that? I should expect erroneous evidence from you by now.
Last edited by heavychevy; 06-23-2009 at 03:57 PM.
#324
06-23-2009, 03:54 PM
Same league? TWO independent tests (1 head to head by AMuS, and the 2 supertests by Sport Auto) indicate the GT-R is faster on the 'Ring by 16 seconds than the Turbo. The difference between the GT-R and the GT2 is not even 1/3rd that.
The Z06 has potential as a high 7:30, but HvS got a time 10 seconds slower than that. Why would you automatically rule out 10 seconds faster than 7:38 for the GT-R? Even if you allow 8 seconds, that's a 7:30, and as CH said any difference of 5 seconds or less is not worth discussing. It says more about the driver and the conditions of the track than anything about the car in question.
1) hp/wt
DEBUNKED
2) the GT-R not being able to "hang with" certain other cars in a straight line
DEBINKED
3) the GT-R not being able to run with 600-hp supercars
DEBUNKED
4) the alleged 290 kph top speed on the straight part of Doettinger Hoehe
DEBUNKED
By continuing to insist that the Turbo and GT-R are in the same league, despite more than half a dozen tests elsewhere saying otherwise, despite 2 NRing results saying otherwise, you haven't got a leg to stand on. But then, you never really did to begin with. (hp/wt, LOL)
#325
06-23-2009, 04:05 PM
Wasn't the car featured in the Sport Auto fahrberichte on Bridgestones? I seem to recall that HvS was driving among a group of GT-Rs when they tried for the lap record. That was the same date the 7:38 was set, wasn't it?
#326
06-23-2009, 04:25 PM
Truly ironic that you'd be one to use the term fanboy.
Wasn't the car featured in the Sport Auto fahrberichte on Bridgestones? I seem to recall that HvS was driving among a group of GT-Rs when they tried for the lap record. That was the same date the 7:38 was set, wasn't it?
Wasn't the car featured in the Sport Auto fahrberichte on Bridgestones? I seem to recall that HvS was driving among a group of GT-Rs when they tried for the lap record. That was the same date the 7:38 was set, wasn't it?
I don't know about all that, all I know is that Nissan clearly explains they were on Dunlops. They obviously had both kinds of tires at the ring and probably still do. Not to mention they always had more than one GT-R at the ring.
You are reaching for straws again now. But don't let the facts get in your way.
#327
06-23-2009, 04:38 PM
I don't know about all that, all I know is that Nissan clearly explains they were on Dunlops. They obviously had both kinds of tires at the ring and probably still do. Not to mention they always had more than one GT-R at the ring.
You are reaching for straws again now. But don't let the facts get in your way.
You are reaching for straws again now. But don't let the facts get in your way.
#328
06-23-2009, 06:47 PM
Yes we have!! 
That is the general response to them as well.....
Here are some of your better nuggets:
"Just shows that the pre production test cars are all ringers and that the early production cars are are factory specials. I wonder how Nissan will react when they do the SAE testing. I wonder how Nissan will react when everyone starts beating their cars in the real world. At the moment the GTR is still a unicorn, only seen in Japan and a few other places."
" Nor has nissan been very successful in a truly international races with the GTR. It's a bit hard to cheat in a highly regulated field that doesnt easily give favoritism."
" Do you honestly expect us to believe that a stock Nissan GTR can run alongside a Porsche Carrera GT and Koenigsegg CCX, yet cant seem to beat a lightly modified 996 GT3?"
" Nissan's car doesnt seem production either, since Nissan havent released a car in America conforming to American smog etc rules."
"Funny thing is that there have already been several reported GTR kills by Corvette ZO6 owners, one was published by the magazine that drove the GTR. Here I was thinking that these new fangled GTR's were Carrera GT, Bugatti Veyron, Corvette ZR1, Koenigsegg CCX, Ferrari Enzo killers. "
"Stifle actual independent production times with countless manufacturer times. "
"If thats true then wow. Whats with all these Nissan tests, why cant anyone outside Nissan conduct and back up these tests around the Ring. Afterall the car has already been out for a while. Come on Nissan people are starting to doubt.......if they havent already. "
"Earlier ringer ones provided to the magazines were measured to have between 430-450rwhp. The actual production cars measured far lower and are in the region of 398rwhp. These production models has power output that actually line up to the factory 480fwhp."
"Most of those better times were achieved with early production cars or test cars. The more recent cars which are closer to the production versions hasnt fared all that well.
RINGERS ANYONE? "
"But looses badly to the Viper ACR. Nissan GTR has another **** poor showing in the quarter mile. Also this puts into question how Car and Driver only managed a 2.01 around Buttonwillow when Road and Track achieved a 1:56.9. It seems like the early Nissan cars had far better performance, were the early ones ringers?"
"Now that more realistic GTR times are emerging the Nissan fanbois are starting to get gun shy. They no longer want to discuss the growing skepticism that Nissan produced early ringer for magazine tests. "
"Modify at your own risk, the GTR doesnt have the strongest of gearboxes."
"Read the first and second columns of the Autocar picture I posted. The third is dedicated to Nissan and their cheating ways. "
"The GTR should have been way faster than the Ferrari at VIR afterall the GTR is a 7:29min car as compared with a 7:39min. Now you see why the GTR times doesnt match up. My guess is that some samples are boosted up by Nissan but the majority far slower than the Ring example."
"Nissan fanbois getting owned!!!!......top stuff. "
"Competitive? You have got to be kidding me the GTR got slapped arounds between the three proven powerhouse. Here I was thinking that the GTR competes with the Zonda's, ZR1, and CGT's of the world. The penny drops, Nissans hype drops along with the penny. "
You sir are a major
.....
That is the general response to them as well.....Here are some of your better nuggets:
"Just shows that the pre production test cars are all ringers and that the early production cars are are factory specials. I wonder how Nissan will react when they do the SAE testing. I wonder how Nissan will react when everyone starts beating their cars in the real world. At the moment the GTR is still a unicorn, only seen in Japan and a few other places."
" Nor has nissan been very successful in a truly international races with the GTR. It's a bit hard to cheat in a highly regulated field that doesnt easily give favoritism."
" Do you honestly expect us to believe that a stock Nissan GTR can run alongside a Porsche Carrera GT and Koenigsegg CCX, yet cant seem to beat a lightly modified 996 GT3?"
" Nissan's car doesnt seem production either, since Nissan havent released a car in America conforming to American smog etc rules."
"Funny thing is that there have already been several reported GTR kills by Corvette ZO6 owners, one was published by the magazine that drove the GTR. Here I was thinking that these new fangled GTR's were Carrera GT, Bugatti Veyron, Corvette ZR1, Koenigsegg CCX, Ferrari Enzo killers. "
"Stifle actual independent production times with countless manufacturer times. "
"If thats true then wow. Whats with all these Nissan tests, why cant anyone outside Nissan conduct and back up these tests around the Ring. Afterall the car has already been out for a while. Come on Nissan people are starting to doubt.......if they havent already. "
"Earlier ringer ones provided to the magazines were measured to have between 430-450rwhp. The actual production cars measured far lower and are in the region of 398rwhp. These production models has power output that actually line up to the factory 480fwhp."
"Most of those better times were achieved with early production cars or test cars. The more recent cars which are closer to the production versions hasnt fared all that well.
RINGERS ANYONE? "
"But looses badly to the Viper ACR. Nissan GTR has another **** poor showing in the quarter mile. Also this puts into question how Car and Driver only managed a 2.01 around Buttonwillow when Road and Track achieved a 1:56.9. It seems like the early Nissan cars had far better performance, were the early ones ringers?"
"Now that more realistic GTR times are emerging the Nissan fanbois are starting to get gun shy. They no longer want to discuss the growing skepticism that Nissan produced early ringer for magazine tests. "
"Modify at your own risk, the GTR doesnt have the strongest of gearboxes."
"Read the first and second columns of the Autocar picture I posted. The third is dedicated to Nissan and their cheating ways. "
"The GTR should have been way faster than the Ferrari at VIR afterall the GTR is a 7:29min car as compared with a 7:39min. Now you see why the GTR times doesnt match up. My guess is that some samples are boosted up by Nissan but the majority far slower than the Ring example."
"Nissan fanbois getting owned!!!!......top stuff. "
"Competitive? You have got to be kidding me the GTR got slapped arounds between the three proven powerhouse. Here I was thinking that the GTR competes with the Zonda's, ZR1, and CGT's of the world. The penny drops, Nissans hype drops along with the penny. "
You sir are a major
..... Monarocountry has spend a whole lot of time acting like a lover scorned. GT-R has done him bad....really bad. It's ok buddy you can put your head on our shoulder and cry, we are here for you.
here are some more words of wisdom from the great one
Keep in mind that these are his rants on a freaking VW forum
hahahaahahahah ahahahahahahahahahahaha you know how he is always whining about people talking about GT-R on 6speedonline.....mainly a porshe forum according to him
how bout it Monaro? how bout you bashing on a freaking nissan on a VW forum and getting pwnd........hypocrite
Quote, originally posted by VWRulez »
shouldn't they have warm up laps to get used to the car first? this thread is kinda useless
monaroCountry
The simple fact is that the base GTR wouldn't have lasted more than a lap around a challenging and long Nurburgring circuit. Even Chris Harris complained about brake and tyre wear within just one lap.
Carmagazine also tested the Spec-V around the Nurburgring. Even the Spec-V's carbon ceramic brakes were cooked after just three laps. Weight and lots of it along with 4WD are the main culprits for brake and tyre wear.
Quote, originally posted by rosskoss »
Hey Monarocounty, you know those bitter old men who spend their whole lives trying to prove a point that no one cares about? You're going to be that guy at 70 babbling on about GT-R conspiracy theories.
Modified by rosskoss at 10:28 AM 5-23-2009
monaroCountry
Many people care about how a stock Nissan GTR performs around the ring, so much so that several publications has spent hundreds of thousand of dollars and Porsche maybe closer to a million dollars to find out.
My aim was first to question a very shady time from a shady manufacturer (when it comes to Ring times), when all tests backed up my argument then I aimed to inform those misinformed by Nissan.
I wont be one of those babbling old fool, by that time everyone thats not a Nissan fanboi would be on agreement. Nissan fanbois are a lost cause, I wont spend my precious time trying to convince them of their foolish beliefs.
Last edited by airtrackk; 06-23-2009 at 06:57 PM.
#329
06-23-2009, 06:52 PM
Here are some more gems from the YODA of GT-R hating
He is the president of anti-gtr fanboi club
Quote, originally posted by monaroCountry »
I wont be one of those babbling old fool, by that time everyone thats not a Nissan fanboi would be on agreement. Nissan fanbois are a lost cause, I wont spend my precious time trying to convince them of their foolish beliefs.
PDing >>
Then why do you still post here then or on all other car forums about GT-R vs. ZR1/GT2/GT3 then? How much of what you typed actually got processed through the pea, that you call brain?
By changing the term "fanboi" to "anti-fanboi", you just described yourself. Besides, the whole GT-R threads finally started to die down and you had to come and post again.
How are you not a troll and an anti-fanboi? Heck, if anything, you can be considered a fanboi in denial. Just let the whole topic die already. Idiot.
Modified by PDing at 6:30 PM 5-23-2009
He is the president of anti-gtr fanboi club
Quote, originally posted by monaroCountry »
I wont be one of those babbling old fool, by that time everyone thats not a Nissan fanboi would be on agreement. Nissan fanbois are a lost cause, I wont spend my precious time trying to convince them of their foolish beliefs.
PDing >>
Then why do you still post here then or on all other car forums about GT-R vs. ZR1/GT2/GT3 then? How much of what you typed actually got processed through the pea, that you call brain?
By changing the term "fanboi" to "anti-fanboi", you just described yourself. Besides, the whole GT-R threads finally started to die down and you had to come and post again.
How are you not a troll and an anti-fanboi? Heck, if anything, you can be considered a fanboi in denial. Just let the whole topic die already. Idiot.
Modified by PDing at 6:30 PM 5-23-2009
Last edited by airtrackk; 06-23-2009 at 06:59 PM.
#330
06-23-2009, 07:04 PM
Oh there is so much more.....should i keep going?
Monarocountry is like the Michael Jordan of GT-R hate (if Michael Jordan was a babbling old guy who just kept repeating himself to convince the world he is insanely obsessed with the GT-R)
Quote, originally posted by monaroCountry »I wont be one of those babbling old fool, by that time everyone thats not a Nissan fanboi would be on agreement. Nissan fanbois are a lost cause, I wont spend my precious time trying to convince them of their foolish beliefs.
cougar>>
No, instead you're just a babbling young fool that's a completely different sort of lost cause.
« » 8:44 PM 5-23-2009
Nubbin>>
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHA this loser got effing pwnt
6:05 PM 5-23-2009
Monarocountry is like the Michael Jordan of GT-R hate (if Michael Jordan was a babbling old guy who just kept repeating himself to convince the world he is insanely obsessed with the GT-R)
Quote, originally posted by monaroCountry »I wont be one of those babbling old fool, by that time everyone thats not a Nissan fanboi would be on agreement. Nissan fanbois are a lost cause, I wont spend my precious time trying to convince them of their foolish beliefs.
cougar>>
No, instead you're just a babbling young fool that's a completely different sort of lost cause.
« » 8:44 PM 5-23-2009
Nubbin>>
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHA this loser got effing pwnt
6:05 PM 5-23-2009
Last edited by airtrackk; 06-23-2009 at 07:08 PM.