Vince, I bet this Boxster is very quick around a track, but it's not street legal. This is more of what I had in mind. Just re-badge it to a Boxster, update it with today's standards and now you have something to compare with. I opted to not suggest the CGT because I'm sure this would be viewed as unfair. So I chose a 10 year old version.

This isn't about making me happy. I'm very happy with my 2.5L Boxster.

The Le Mans version is my all time favorite.

 

^^wait, wait....it looks more like one of those flat fish with the eyeballs on the top of it's head. flounder?


but in a fast, cool way...hehe!

 

Ken

To each their own but why have 4-5 nice cars when you can have 2-3 real great cars? You can only drive one at a time right? just my .02 cents

 

+1 You just wasted your money on a POS Honda.

 

+5!!!

Why not just have the BEST car in the world and drive the hell out of it? This article was from January of 2008. There's probably a ton more miles on it now.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Most supercars and exotics are your typical garage queens with little mileage on them. It’s this mileage that keeps up their high resale value too, I mean who wants to buy a Ferrari with 50,000 miles on it?
Featured in Porsche’s christophorus magazine (#329 December 2007/January 2008 issue) Enrico Pozzi isn’t one of those owners who garages his two year old Porsche Carrera GT. It is his daily driver in Milan, Italy. For Enrico, it was love at first sight when he test drove the Carrera GT at Porsche’s Leipzig test track.
But the biggest shock to us all is the mileage on his black beauty. During his two years of ownership, Enrico has driven over 100,000 kilometers (62,000 miles) and this is equivalent to circling the globe 2.5 times. One can only imagine his hefty maintenance costs for this supercar.

 

slow down spending money on so many different cars. unless you can buy them to turn around and sell at a profit you are losing money on them. save your dough and get the cars you want for later down the road!

 

haha you guys are right.. but i do make money off of these hondas i buy and drive for awhile.. i make a good grand or two off each of my hondas i sell.. ive been buying and selling these hondas since i was 15.. i will eventually sell all these cars and buy myself a "GREAT" car.. its nice to have options i guess but i really never lost any money on any of these cars i pick up.. i may throw on a few mods here and there then sell it to other kids out there who is looking for a 1st car or a tuner and these cars are very easy to sell..

 

Mark

Let's review. RSR in the slow class.

There are 4 major classes of endurance sports car racing, LMP1, LMP2, GT1, and GT2. In the U.S. there are 6 GT racing series. ALMS GT1, GT2, Rolex GT, IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge, Koni Cup, Speed World Challenge. Of the 4 major, GT2 races the slowest cars. Worldwide there are no less than 15 GT race series.

I'm not saying that a RSR or Cup car is slow. It is blazing fast! But in GT2, these are the slower of the four.

As an example in order to define slow. Slow in this case is in seconds. Johannes Van Overbeek who drives for Flying Lizards lapped a RSR and a GT3 RS at Willows Springs to compare the two. The RSR was 17 seconds faster. A GT3 Cup car laps between 5-8 seconds slower than the RSR.

At Sebring this year these were the qualyifing times. LMP1 Audi at 1:44:974. LMP2 RS Spyder at 1:46:046. GT1 Aston DB9R at 1:55:286. GT2 Ferrari F430 at 2:02;439. You tell me which is the slower of all the classes.

All you have to do is watch a endurance race and look at which cars are the slowest and holding up the rest.

In GT1 the Corvette's and Aston's don't have any competition and is why Corvette Racing is dropping down to GT2 next year with a team and all teams the following years.

In GT2, which you are right, not GT3 is the premier class. Porsche in the GT2 class, until recently hasn't had any real competition. The following I am quoting right out of Excellence's race reports.

"A large majority of Porsche's GT2 or GT3 wins can be attributed to strength in numbers." One example. "In 2006 at the IMSA GT3 Cup Mid Ohio, there were no less than 47 GT3 Cup cars in the field."

In ALMS there are no less than 3 factory supported teams at any given time, which puts them at a huge advantage. In Rolex, Koni, Speed, IMSA there are huge amounts of privateer teams. Good for Porsche until now.

Within the last 2 or 3 years Ferrari with it's F430 has become it's only serious competition. Not only as a competitor, but competitor in the sales of race cars. In terms of speed, Ferrari is dominant. Easily outpacing the RSR. For pole by as much as 2 or 3 seconds. So much that RSR teams are defecting to the Ferrari's.

Why? Porsche has queezed every ounce of speed out of the RSR and in doing so discovering that the rear engine platform compared to the mid engine car is at a disadvantage. The mid engine is more balanced and has better handling resulting in faster lap times. One article after Petite Le Mans this year quotes RSR drivers saying that, " Having to lift in the middle of the corner's due to oversteer is seriously effecting our abilitity to put down fast lap times." This oversteer is due the huge amount of grip in the RSR. It is overpowering the front. Not the case in a mid.

The other's you mention aren't even close The GT40's are not up to speed and have little backing. The Corvette's, the Aston Vantage and Viper's are small privateer teams that don't really offer a threat, at least not yet. The Panoz is a threat, but still a work in progress. It did win Le Mans last 2 years ago, due to attrition. All the major contenders went out in the first few hours.

At last years Le Mans race only one American RSR team was invited. Flying Lizards. A Porsche GT2 team won driven by Patrick Long and it was a French based RSR IMSA effort. Adding evidence to the water down fields in the ALMS GT2 series .

GT1 vs GT2. Horsepower has never been a issue when it comes to competing in GT1. Proof. 1996 911 GT1 with a 3.2L twin turbo flat six and 600bhp. This 911 GT1 only had two things in common with a 911. A 993 tub that was highly modified in order to create a mid engine design and the engine itself. Elements derived from the mid engine design, like the aero body, the balance, handling and the tire wear characteristic were the main reason's it was able to win Le Mans. It did win Le Mans it's first time out. In 1997 it didn't win a race. The McLaren F1 dominated. In 1998 Mercedes with it's CLK-GTR dominated the class. In 1998 the rules were changed regulating the air restrictors to the turbos on the 911GT1 and it effected the turbos performance so much that Porsche pulled out of GT1. Not because it didn't want to procuce the car worldwide. You have to produce and sell 25 street legal version per the FIA homogolation rules in order to contest and they did.

Porsche AG has made it clear to PMS that it will not race the 911 in GT1.

Why? Porsche knows that racing a 911 in GT1 put's it at a disadvantage due to it's wide rear fender's and all the drag they produce, equalling less straight speed. Smooth out the fender's and it upset's the balance and removes rear traction. The GT1 is the proof. It had speed and traction from aerodynamics as well as balance and handling from the mid engine layout. Which is the optimum platform. The 911 is Porsche's cash cow and it has to be competitive.

On the subject of "snap oversteer". Allow me to clarify my previous statement. The cars that were notorious for having this inherent oversteer were the early rear wheel drive turbos up until the latest 996 GT2. These cars had a natural tendency to swing the rear out if not properly driven into corners or exiting them. Add a explosive power band and in the hands of a lesser skilled driver and these cars were a handfull to keep on the road, which is why so many were wrecked. This problem in most other Turbos was eliviated with the aid of bigger rear wings, traction control and AWD all in an effort to improve rear grip. Ultimately creating some of the best 911's ever. Arguably the 993TT is one of the best of all time. Your's is a primo example. Someone like you with your skills and experience can have fun with it, but not your average driver, let alone a good driver.

Cheers!

 

Do I think 911's have a disadvantage over others? Yes. Is it the rear engine design? Some but mostly because they are racing against cars with larger engines with more mod potential from the start.

You say I should spend sometime watching endurance races. I did. I raced Cup Challenge last year and spent 7 weeks watching ALMS and Speed World. Also 7 weeks watching the LMP's and at no point would an RSR stay with them. Top end speed was never the problem. Braking as in all racing is the problem. LMP cars had breaking points 50% less than the RSR's you can't compare. Their weight and horsepower were insane and incredible to watch. Not unlike the F1 cars CRAZY difference we experienced while racing Indy as well. You also mentioned Rolex series but you have to agree no RSR or Cup would compete with those Prototypes they lap them at Rolex 24 hours like they are cones.

I also spent 7 weeks with Speed World wanting us to race their races the same weekend. When GT3's did race Speed World only than did the Speed World guys complain about our series racing with theirs. Our Cups were faster than the higher horsepower GT3's that raced and they didn't like it.

these series are all have different issues
Koni Challenge Porsche took 2nd place overall for the year. How they did this against un-restricted huge V8's I will never know. The Mustangs that ran this series like the G6 Pontiacs the year before could weigh nothing and have any horsepower basically they wanted.

Speed Challenge with the huge amount of V8's Porsche took 1st 4 of 10 races and 2nd place 2 times to 6 of ten races the GT3's were in the top 2 spots. That's not a bad showing.

ALMS did have some great competition and this series does have new teams but these new teams come in with BIG $ backing and only lack track knowledge to compete. These teams LMP to GT1 and 2 Spend so much money racing you wouldn't believe. As I stated (excluding Lemans) GT1 had really only two teams for the year so GT2 was the place to be and race. Mind you Lemans is not much unlike the Tour de France bicycle race they would only invite French if they could. So not always the best vehicle for comparison

ALMS 2008 series you state that RSR's weren't competitive and 2-3 seconds off the pace. Not true. This is endurance racing and the little flat 6 Porsche creates does a pretty good job against the stronger more horsepower 430 you mention. Don't get me wrong I love my 430's they are fun to drive but driving hard I do prefer my GT3 RS.

Sebring Porsche took 1st and 2nd. Also posted fastest race lap by .177 seconds over Ferrari. Qualifying means nothing but Ferrari could have had a clean traffic free lap

St Peters took 2nd, 3rd posted .05 seconds slower lap time than ferrari
Long Beach 2nd, 3rd both with faster race lap times than Ferrari
Utah 1,2,4th all Faster lap times than Ferrari
NE Grand Prix 1,2 but with .183 seconds slower fastest laps (endurance again)
Lexington 2,3,4th only .015 seconds off fastest lap
Road America 1,2,4th only .305 seconds off fastest lap
Mosport 2,4 .201 seconds off fastest
Detroit 1,2,4th .733 seconds faster than Ferrari
Petit Lemans 2nd place w/ largest margin on laps .603 seconds slower. Road Atlanta caters to larger engines. Huge back straight with speeds to 170 gives the V8 tons of advantage not including a front straight and 1st turn sweep that also gives huge advantage to bigger engine.
Laguna the didn't perform well 3rd place but had the .108 second advantage on fastest race lap.

Porsche Won the series points and performed pretty damn well.

All of these cars are set up and run within typical 100's of a second on all of these tracks making it an extremely exciting series. No real runaways.

Including 2007 Finish at Sebring were Ferrari edged Porsche by 20ft in 12 hours making it one of the best finishes to a race I (and most) have ever seen.

We could argue for days about the rear engine platform and it's problems or just say damn these are good cars and ANYONE lucky enough to earn a ride in them deserves the props they get.

 

Guys I would love to read these long *** posts but I got patients waiting with mouths open.
Besides why are we arguing between rear vs mid-engine when the OP went and got himself a front engine Honda.

 

Hey now, don't rock the boat. I find this extremely informative. I love how folks on here love to hijack threads all the time.

 

This is what the NW section is famous for. What was this thread about again?

 

hey! i got the prelude for a daily commuter.. if you would like to know how i even got my porsche in the first place i buy and sell honda/acura to other kids and gathered up a fair amount to cash out the boxster i own now.. im hoping i could some more of what i did to work my way up to a better p-car. no need to dislike me now cause i bought a "POS" FWD honda to save gas.. if i was well off like any of you guys i would have went out and bought myself a F430 or a CGT..

 

I love my Honda.

 

it's all good ken. you are trying to get ahead in life and i commend you for trying! sounds like you're doing okay with buying and reselling. i give you props for purchasing your car w/out a bank note as well. =D

jeff,
i love your honda too!