Track-challenged 997S (long)
#1
Track-challenged 997S (long)
Hey guys,
Please allow me to rant, then either advise or console...
At the end of July, I attended a DE at New Jersey Motorsports Park, Thunderbolt course, as a guest of AWE (thanks, Mike!). On my second run of the day, CEL went on and a couple of laps later, the car blew huge plumes of white smoke from both sides of the exhaust (humorous in hindsight as it completely smokescreened the F360 Challenge car that was behind-he shouldn't have been on the course anyway, because I'm in the novice group doing a lead-follow to learn the track layout). I was on the main straight, in 3rd gear at about 5K rpm. Needless to say my $165 for the day and 2 afternoon runs literally and figuratively went up in smoke. My car showed minimal oil. It ran but I was afraid to do any more damage so I got AAA to tow it to the dealer who regularly services the car. They changed the Air Oil Separator (AOS) and all seemed well. The car ran a little rough for a couple of miles after but then settled down. Ok, I can deal with simple mechanical failure.
Now this weekend, my local PCA ran it's final big event of the season as a 3-day DE at the same track benefitting the Make-A-Wish Foundation. I was nervous but excited at the prospect of taking my car on the track for 3 whole days! You'll never guess what happened?! On my second run, huge puffs of white smoke again!!! I was in 4th gear (~5K rpm), downshifted to 3rd, at the end of the main straight, about to take Turn 1, no CEL! I got black flagged, pulled over and everyone had to get off the course. The dash oil gauge showed a loss of 1 bar. My service manager from the dealership happened to be there as an instructor. He told me that the oil level may have been high and that the extreme side loading and stresses of track driving may have caused overflow (excuse my poor explanation but I'm not mechanically inclined). I was advised to drive the car off the track for a bit until the oil/smoke blew out. I did that and returned to the track for a third run. Sure enough, on my 3rd run, white smoke at the same place on the track, main straight on about the 3rd lap, same gear, same frustration...
Now the oil gauge showed 1 blinking bottom bar, ie, all the oil was gone. No obvious leaks. My service manager called my tech at the dealership but no one had any answers except get the car back to the dealership for a complete diagnosis. Members of the PCA club said I need the Motorsports AOS and that would solve my problem (but will it?). My car is still under CPO. Service manager said that PCNA and Motorsports Division are separate so the Motorsports AOS couldn't be installed under CPO warranty. Another friend suggested that I rig a "catch can" and seal off the intake at least so that I can still run the weekend, maybe at the back of my run group so that I won't smokescreen anyone. Service manager didn't want to rig it because he stated that it may be something other than the AOS, such as problem with scavenger pumps, or ??
Well, I put oil in and drove to the hotel on Friday night completely depressed. Sure we were having a Nor-Easter and the cold rain prevented many guys with R compound tires from venturing onto the track but I still wanted to drive and learn! Saturday, I drove 1.5 hours to the dealership without a problem. The engine buzzed along wonderfully. The car stopped smoking after several miles, at least from what I could see through the rain.
Some info: bought the car March 2008 (so still under finance), CPO until Sept 2010, had 25800+ miles for the first incident and currently has 27K miles. The new AOS only has 1K miles on it.
I've read about and heard similar stories with Caymans and Boxsters that were tracked. Their problems were solved with the Motorsports AOS. Is my car the same or just not meant to be tracked? I was not pushing it, matter of fact, I was driving like grandma trying to learn the lines and not slide on the slippery track. Believe me, I was practicing my point-bys more than I wanted to! Should I just be content to enjoy her on the street when next season comes around, then when my CPO warranty expires, start installing Motorsports parts? Or should I trade her in before my CPO warranty expires and try another 911? (or horror of horrors, a used Z06?)
I really love this car. It's my first Porsche and I want to enjoy it the way I thought it was meant to be enjoyed-on the track...thoughts and $.02 anyone?
-E.
Please allow me to rant, then either advise or console...
At the end of July, I attended a DE at New Jersey Motorsports Park, Thunderbolt course, as a guest of AWE (thanks, Mike!). On my second run of the day, CEL went on and a couple of laps later, the car blew huge plumes of white smoke from both sides of the exhaust (humorous in hindsight as it completely smokescreened the F360 Challenge car that was behind-he shouldn't have been on the course anyway, because I'm in the novice group doing a lead-follow to learn the track layout). I was on the main straight, in 3rd gear at about 5K rpm. Needless to say my $165 for the day and 2 afternoon runs literally and figuratively went up in smoke. My car showed minimal oil. It ran but I was afraid to do any more damage so I got AAA to tow it to the dealer who regularly services the car. They changed the Air Oil Separator (AOS) and all seemed well. The car ran a little rough for a couple of miles after but then settled down. Ok, I can deal with simple mechanical failure.
Now this weekend, my local PCA ran it's final big event of the season as a 3-day DE at the same track benefitting the Make-A-Wish Foundation. I was nervous but excited at the prospect of taking my car on the track for 3 whole days! You'll never guess what happened?! On my second run, huge puffs of white smoke again!!! I was in 4th gear (~5K rpm), downshifted to 3rd, at the end of the main straight, about to take Turn 1, no CEL! I got black flagged, pulled over and everyone had to get off the course. The dash oil gauge showed a loss of 1 bar. My service manager from the dealership happened to be there as an instructor. He told me that the oil level may have been high and that the extreme side loading and stresses of track driving may have caused overflow (excuse my poor explanation but I'm not mechanically inclined). I was advised to drive the car off the track for a bit until the oil/smoke blew out. I did that and returned to the track for a third run. Sure enough, on my 3rd run, white smoke at the same place on the track, main straight on about the 3rd lap, same gear, same frustration...
Now the oil gauge showed 1 blinking bottom bar, ie, all the oil was gone. No obvious leaks. My service manager called my tech at the dealership but no one had any answers except get the car back to the dealership for a complete diagnosis. Members of the PCA club said I need the Motorsports AOS and that would solve my problem (but will it?). My car is still under CPO. Service manager said that PCNA and Motorsports Division are separate so the Motorsports AOS couldn't be installed under CPO warranty. Another friend suggested that I rig a "catch can" and seal off the intake at least so that I can still run the weekend, maybe at the back of my run group so that I won't smokescreen anyone. Service manager didn't want to rig it because he stated that it may be something other than the AOS, such as problem with scavenger pumps, or ??
Well, I put oil in and drove to the hotel on Friday night completely depressed. Sure we were having a Nor-Easter and the cold rain prevented many guys with R compound tires from venturing onto the track but I still wanted to drive and learn! Saturday, I drove 1.5 hours to the dealership without a problem. The engine buzzed along wonderfully. The car stopped smoking after several miles, at least from what I could see through the rain.
Some info: bought the car March 2008 (so still under finance), CPO until Sept 2010, had 25800+ miles for the first incident and currently has 27K miles. The new AOS only has 1K miles on it.
I've read about and heard similar stories with Caymans and Boxsters that were tracked. Their problems were solved with the Motorsports AOS. Is my car the same or just not meant to be tracked? I was not pushing it, matter of fact, I was driving like grandma trying to learn the lines and not slide on the slippery track. Believe me, I was practicing my point-bys more than I wanted to! Should I just be content to enjoy her on the street when next season comes around, then when my CPO warranty expires, start installing Motorsports parts? Or should I trade her in before my CPO warranty expires and try another 911? (or horror of horrors, a used Z06?)
I really love this car. It's my first Porsche and I want to enjoy it the way I thought it was meant to be enjoyed-on the track...thoughts and $.02 anyone?
-E.
#2
I have no idea about the source of your problem, but you have one for sure. Based on your description of conditions, you were not generating enough cornering forces to cause an oiling problem. I had an '06 997S for a year, drove it hard on track with no problems. If it's under warrranty, you should be able to get it fixed, unless your dealer or the factory rep decides to make an issue of track use. Even then, you should prevail if the car has not been modified. If it were mine, I would give it another shot with the dealer before giving up. But, I will also admit, right or wrong, sometimes it is better move on than to remain frustrated in dealing with an ongoing problem. It can happen with any car. I lost an engine on track in a C6 ZO6 with only 7K miles. Luckily, the car was totally stock, and the engine was replaced under warranty. Good luck in getting your problem resolved.
#3
I had a similar issue and thought it was the air oil separator issue. The dealer I took the car to for an oil change actually just overfilled it. An overfill will cause it, but I can't explain your dramatic loss of oil.
#4
After every oil change verify that your oil level is correct. Before any motor sport event verify that your oil level is correct. If you don't know how to do this find someone with Porsche experience to check it for you. If your car is never overfilled with oil the AOS will last a very long time.
#5
Verdict: Oil suction/scavenge pump on driver's side went bad.
Service tech drove car around in circles to try to emulate track driving.
Found oil pressure fluctuations when driving clockwise so traced it to driver's side oil suction pump. Does this make sense to those of you who know these engines?
Anyway, I won't really be able to confirm that she's fixed until I get on a track...which here in the NorthEast won't be until next spring!
Glad that everything has been covered under CPO so far. Tally: new AOS and new Oil Suction pump. I'll let you guys know next season!
Thanks for all the replies, guys! I've been told about smoking when oil is overfilled. I'll keep an eye out to make sure it's not overfilled...
Be smooth out there!
-E.
Found oil pressure fluctuations when driving clockwise so traced it to driver's side oil suction pump. Does this make sense to those of you who know these engines?
Anyway, I won't really be able to confirm that she's fixed until I get on a track...which here in the NorthEast won't be until next spring!
Glad that everything has been covered under CPO so far. Tally: new AOS and new Oil Suction pump. I'll let you guys know next season!
Thanks for all the replies, guys! I've been told about smoking when oil is overfilled. I'll keep an eye out to make sure it's not overfilled...
Be smooth out there!
-E.
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